Ring gear bolts

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2013: Ring gear bolts
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Cameron Whitaker on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 12:59 pm:

My '24 Touring needs a new ring gear. A while ago I removed all the magnets (many of which were cracked), removed the magneto (also shot), and the ring gear (again, shot). I bolted on oil slingers and ran it for quite a while with no ring gear, so I had to hand crank it.

Now I think it's time for me to install a new ring gear from Snyders. The question is, how do I attach the ring gear to the flywheel? Obviously, 1/4-24 bolts are hard to find! Does anyone know of a source for them? Or is there something else that will work? I'm not a big fan of retapping the ring gear for a different thread pitch.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 01:23 pm:

Start with the usual suspects (Model T parts dealers), then try Fastenal, then Harley Davidson.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 01:30 pm:

Like Steve says, these screws are anything but hard to find. Click here:

http://www.modeltford.com/item/3278RE.aspx


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 01:37 pm:

The new ring gear should be 1/4 -24 threads. Just get a new set of screws when you get it. Before you install the ring gear run a tap through the threads to clean out any burrs. I would also suggest getting a couple of extra screws just in case. Clean the holes in the spindles and flywheel, the 1/4-24 should fit those holes just fine. Some flywheels have locating dowels mounted in the flywheel for the ring gear to flywheel alignment, these will not be needed if there.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Michael Deichmann, Blistrup, Denmark on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 03:45 pm:

Be absolutely sure that you get the right screws to whatever ring you get. The screw Royce points to is the "incorrect" 1/4"-24 brass screws that fit the "incorrect" new repro ring gears.
The correct screws are #14-24 which is slightly smaller and so are the threads in the original ring gears and of course NOS gears.
Looking on Langs you can see the correct screws here: http://www.modeltford.com/item/3278.aspx

At some point I read that there are also repro ring gears now made with the correct thread (#14-24) but then I would expect Langs to have both, and they don't.

Hope I did not increased the confusion. ;-/


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Blancard on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 03:56 pm:

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but I just started to remove the screws on my '24 touring's ring gear to replace the triple gear pins. I measured the screws to determine which ones to order. They are 1/4"-20, not 1/4"-24 or #14-24. I checked them closely with a thread gauge. I also screwed a modern 1/4"-20 screw into the hole and it went in perfectly. This engine was rebuilt about 10 years ago with a new ring gear. Were repro ring gears made with with 1/4"-20 screws 10-15 years ago? Does Langs or anyone else sell correct brass 1/4"-20 screws?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Michael Deichmann, Blistrup, Denmark on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 04:20 pm:

OK Steve - THAT's a new version!
I learned the lesson the hard way as I just ordered new screws at my local part pusher and he sold me 1/4"-24. 5 of them broke" Fortunately I had an old flywheel where I could salvage 5 old screws.

Here is the blueprint from Ford:

Not easy to read, I know, but it is #14-24.
If just all vendors would try to search info in the archives in stead of guessing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Blancard on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 04:55 pm:

Michael - yes I was surprised too! At first I thought maybe someone had just forced 1/4"-20 screws into 1/4"-24 holes, but that's not the case. The holes don't have helicoils in them and they don't look modified. There are some markings on the ring gear, maybe they identify the maker. It looks like "G" to the left of the screw, then "OSRW" to the right.

gear marks

Here is one of the 1/4"-20 screws.

screw


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 04:59 pm:

If you use the Slinger Kit from Texas T Parts, and a NEW ring gear, (that is the new reproduction not a Ford NOS !)...the Kit comes with correct special hardened 1/4 x 24 bolts, so you just bolt the new ring gear right up to the flywheel. Not a problem. No tapping of the new ring gear, easy fit, and secured well.



Link to Texas T Parts instructions on doing this:


http://www.texastparts.com/mm5/manuals/T3276-SL.pdf


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 05:46 pm:

A new ring gear might come tapped to accept 1/4 X 24 TPI bolts or the original #14 X 24 tpi bolts that are several thousands smaller at around .23 rather than the 1/4 .25 bolts.

Both screw sizes appear to be available.

This was probably just a minor misunderstanding for some Chinese manufacturing firm.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 06:03 pm:

James

That is the issue, Ford spec is #14x24. All new reproduction ring gears made for several years now, maybe 8 or so are with 1/4"x24 as the vendors messed up the details and specs.

You can't use anything but 1/4x24 in new ring gears! You have to buy these special brass screws or bolts from the vendors to fit the ring gears. I know....cost me a lot of rework...as the magnets wiggled free, the clamping plates loose, as the builder of the motor used NOS Ford brass screws of the Ford size #14x24 when fitting a new ring gear......those new ring gears are NOT labeled with a warning to use special 1/4x24 screws!

You have to know the unknown!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jeff cordes on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 08:47 pm:

I have a ring gear on the wall with 1/4 28 threads in it, so add that to the list of aftermarket possibilities


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 08:54 pm:

I have one of those 1/4 20 ring gears. I just get them at the local bolt supplier.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Smith on Monday, January 07, 2013 - 12:01 pm:

Why do people have to change everything! Just leave them stock!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By ROBERT BERGSTADT on Monday, January 07, 2013 - 02:31 pm:

We make the right ones off the Ford print 14 not 1/4 Bob


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Blancard on Wednesday, January 09, 2013 - 06:25 pm:

I found out the source of the 1/4"-20 threaded ring gears. The previous owner of my car documented the rebuild on his web site from about 10 years ago. I went back and looked at his photos and text and he stated:

"The top was the ring gear we took off the touring. Bottom one is a new repro from Snyders. ****Note**** The repro flywheels have 1/4x20 tapped holes for the brass screws."

This was around 2002 or 2003. That small mystery is solved.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By R.V. Anderson on Wednesday, January 09, 2013 - 06:59 pm:

Bob, what is the alloy you're using in your screws?


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