OT : Replacing Rear Main Seal

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2013: OT : Replacing Rear Main Seal
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 10:44 pm:

I know you members who don't live in or around Houston, Texas, don't have a feel for the pricing of automotive repairs in this area, but here's my question: if you had to replace the rear main seal in a Ford pickup, would you take it to an independent repair shop, or a Ford dealer (after checking price estimates of course). I have a 2003 F-150 with the 4.2 V6 and auto transmission and have determined that if I ever want a clean driveway, that I'm going to have to have the seal replaced.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Daron - Brownsburg IN on Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 10:50 pm:

Trade it for a Chevy.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 11:11 pm:

I would get quotes from both and discuss what was involved. You might also see what an automatic transmission shop might be able to do. I would avoid any dealership that is owned by a national firm, and deal only with a locally owned dealership.

You need to have a good feeling in your gut about the folks you choose.

My guess is that its pretty straight forward: Remove the driveline, transmission and flywheel and you should have access. I would think that a dealer would charge 4 hours labor plus parts or about $450-500.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matthew David Maiers on Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 11:11 pm:

in order to replace the seal, the engine most likely has to be removed, and crankshaft lifted out. its a big job, and to have it done by any shop would probably cost close to $2000.

if you can remove the pan, you can do it inside the vehicle.

of course thats all assuming these modern vehicles dont use some kind of weird external seal.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matthew David Maiers on Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 11:17 pm:

of course im thinking of the type of seal housed inside the rear main cap that is comprised of either rope, or the two piece lip seal with a steel rod inside.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed Baudoux on Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 11:17 pm:

Mathew. it is a one piece seal, installed from the rear.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matthew David Maiers on Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 11:28 pm:

Wuuut! I wonder how you get that over the crankshaft flange


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 11:44 pm:

Matthew, You're right. It would make the job cheaper and simpler if the seal Ed shows is inserted as he says, but I'm like you. How do you get it over the crankshaft flywheel flange? (or am I completely stupid?)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed Baudoux on Tuesday, January 15, 2013 - 11:51 pm:

Here is the crank. There is no flange. The endplay is controlled by the rear most main bearing. The seal rides on the large diameter to the rear of it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matthew David Maiers on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 12:04 am:

well thats interesting, that is a far more convenient and less archaic way of sealing the rear of the crankshaft,

im actually surprised they didnt start doing that earlier.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Hatch on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 09:45 am:

Terry: If you have it done by a local guy only he will warranty the work. Any Ford dealer will warranty it if done by a Ford dealer. But, it is not that bad a job if it just the seal. Seals do not go bad for no reason. What made the seal go out? Miles on the truck? I had one leaking on a 83 bird, pulled the engine and while it was out did mains, rods and new oil pump. went another 175k. Dan.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 09:51 am:

It all boils down to the guy actually doing the job whether its at an independent shop or a dealer.
Thats been my expeirence.
Even though there may be a warrenty make sure to read all the details so you can hold them to it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Brown, NC on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 09:54 am:

The transmission has to come out (much easier than the engine), If it is a four wheel drive that makes it a little more work. If you know a really reputable independent, I think that would be the way to go.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By keith g barrier on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 10:15 am:

Matthew, ford has been doing it that way on most since the late 70's. KB


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matthew David Maiers on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 11:29 am:

Well that solves it then, all ive got are model Ts, FEs and y blocks.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By karl schlachter on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 12:08 pm:

Terry, V6 Auto trans calls for 4.6 hrs labor that includes trans and flywheel removal


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 12:23 pm:

I have the same kind of pickup and same year. Same engine too. Mine doesn't leak. How many miles do you have on yours? I would like to have an idea of how much longer I have before mine starts leaking?

One thing you could do is park it with your Model T's. Then you would not know which one was leaking! :-)
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matthew David Maiers on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 12:54 pm:

just put a diaper around the bell housing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 06:32 pm:

It is leaking enough to leave a puddle stain, probably 18" or so on my driveway, but really just a stain. I really haven't noticed any standing oil puddle, but this week I had a mechanic put it on his lift and check it and he said there's definitely an oil leak there. I am going to try some seal rejuvenator that is guaranteed 100% or a full refund of my purchase price by the maker, and see if that stops it. My truck is a 2 wheel drive with over 130,000 miles but less than 135,000. I don't remember the exact mileage.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 06:37 pm:

By the way, thanks for the pictures, Ed, and thanks to everyone else who answered. Jack D., I hesitate to trade it for a Chevy. I have never been in a wreck in a Ford pickup, but was in two wrecks (not at fault) that totalled both of the last two Chevys that I've owned.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Wednesday, January 16, 2013 - 09:27 pm:

Looked at oil stain, again, Its closer to 24+" by 18+".


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Shirley on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 12:05 am:

Terry, Check or better yet replace the PCV valve. Make sure the filler cap seals off. On a Ford you got to have a vacume in the block.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Charlie B actually in Toms River N.J. on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 11:01 am:

An excellent suggestion Bob. A crudded up PCV and perhaps a bit of blow-by and that Texas T will find a way out with a bit of pressure behind it. The only thing that really bothers me about this is the condition of the crank's sealing surface. Years back with transmission converter main seal leaks we ended up replacing the converter along with the seal about 50% of the time because the converter's sealing surface was NG too. As to the "flanged" cranks: they used a seal similar to the T's front seal. Rope-like material pulled through and cut off to size and you'd better know what you're doing too.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Cole ---- Earth on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 01:09 pm:

The catolytic convertor was stopped up on my dads truck.Once that was replaced it stopped leaking at the rear seal.Dodge but similar to ford.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 09:57 pm:

I bought a Haynes manual today and they show the seal and talk about possible causes. They do recommend testing the PCV valve and replacing if necessary. I see how the seal works, now. It seals around the outside of the flywheel or T.C flange, not the surface where the rear main bearing rides, like older cars. Man, that is a large diameter seal. I would have never imagined.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matthew David Maiers on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 10:02 pm:

imagine the surface speed that thing must endure.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Aaron Griffey, Hayward Ca. on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 10:17 pm:

The seal goes on the flange.
Most cars are that way since about 40 years ago.
Including VW bug, Toyota, MGB. Chevrolet Nissan, Honda, Ford, you name it.
Take it to an independant transmission shop.
The biggest part is trans removal and re-installation. They do that work all day and usually are not paying a journeyman to do the work.
Ask them to also replace the front transmission seal too. Even the rear trans seal while the driveshaft is out.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed Baudoux on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 10:33 pm:

Terry, I am a shop owner with 30 years experience as a mechanic. I can tell you that this is not my favorite kind of repair, because of the success rate. There are many reasons for a rear main crank seal to leak, one of which is excessive bearing clearance. Bearing clearance is a two-fold problem. As the clearance increases, crank movement and oil flow both increase, making the seal's job more difficult. I am not saying it is an impossible job. My point is to take it to someone with experience, don't price shop.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jeff cordes on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 10:41 pm:

I'd do it for 300 or so, those v6 with the 4R70 tranny are fairly easy to get at, I've done one with 200k and got it sealed, oh and I'm just south of you in Stafford,


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 11:50 pm:

Jeff, I thought you were in Schulenburg.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Thursday, January 17, 2013 - 11:56 pm:

Ed, I bought the truck, used with about 134K or 135K on it, It now has a little over 136K on it. I don't know what kind of care it had by the first owner, but if the physical appearance is any indicator, it was well cared for. The PCV does appear to be plugged, so I'm going to try that tomorrow.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 10:28 pm:

Checked PCV today. Seems to be OK. Added a bottle of seal softener made by the same company that makes Sta-bil gas treatment. Its guaranteed or money refunded.


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