If we keep the Model T engine stock, is there a difference....

Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration
Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2013: If we keep the Model T engine stock, is there a difference....
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Poane on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 09:33 am:

If we keep the Model T engine stock, is there a difference between the brass era engines and the black era engines in power and performance?

I liked having a 26 engine in my 14 because I thought is was stronger. Now that I will be getting a 12 engine, rebuilt, I wonder if it is less powerful for hills and acceleration than the later year.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 10:03 am:

It's all in your head.
.

.

.
.

.

.

The earlier engine has a higher compression head.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Hatch on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 10:04 am:

Are not the early cams also hotter? Dan


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 10:10 am:

Supposedly or so I have read the older T engines before 1919 that had the 'low head' had a little higher compression than the later 'high head'.

This gave the engines a little more horsepower of about 2 to make the earlier engines about 22 hp whereas the newer engines had 20.

Then again the closed cars were heavier and tended to be a little slower than the lighter open cars.

Maybe someone else can respond but I have heard this over the years from people who lived in the Model T era.

But this depends if everything is stock on the cars. MHO


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Carnegie on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 10:52 am:

The 26-7 engines have the hogshead bolted on. This could give you better alignment, possibly.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Halpin on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 11:07 am:

Robert, I doubt there is enough difference between the early and late (stock) to make a significant difference.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 03:16 pm:

Two horsepower is a 10% increase.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 03:30 pm:

Didnt the straight-thru Holly carb around 19-20 also help the power a little?

I know they are a desirable carb to use if you a little extra ummph.
Or so I read somewhere on the forum.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Harold Schwendeman - Sumner,WA on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 04:11 pm:

John - As I understand it, I'm sure Ford would have liked to have continued making the heads, and, the corresponding compression the same as in the earlier low heads, however, the deteriorating fuel quality in the 20's made it necessary to lower compression in the Model T just enough to prevent the detonation which was caused by the poorer quality fuel. I think I've read where gasoline in the 20's sometimes contained as much as 40% kerosene. I also believe that the subsequent loss of horsepower was about 2 hp, due to the slightly lower compression. As Norman said, that's about a 10% reduction in horsepower,.....fairly significant. Hopefully, those that know much more about this than me will respond,......harold


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Coiro on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 06:26 pm:

The sudden increased demand for gasoline in the teens caused an across-the-board drop in octane and Ford responded by de-tuning its engines by reducing compression. The books I've read are in disagreement, but legend has it that compression was dropped twice; once in 1912 and then again in 1915. My personal belief is that it only happened once. When it did, rated power dropped from 22 HP to 20 HP. That doesn't sound like a lot, but when you're that low on power, every single horse counts.

Scuttlebutt has it that the earlier brass cars, because of their lighter weight and the awesome might of those two extre ponies, were more spritely performers than the later steel cars. With an aftermarket, hi-compression head, which you can purchase from any of the usual suppliers—and which is practically identical in appearance to the original head—the issue pretty much becomes moot. If the advertising is to be believed, a hi-compression head is good for boosting the engine to the plus side of 25 HP.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John T. Tannehill on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 06:35 pm:

I would like to say I will trade you a Sept 13 out of my 12 for your early (before Sept)12 in your 14.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Poane on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 06:45 pm:

Thank you for your answers. I am going to pick up a partially restored all correct 1912 tomorrow.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 06:48 pm:

If we don't see pictures it didn't happen!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Friday, January 18, 2013 - 07:21 pm:

A '12 engine or '12 car? A really good '12 engine is worth almost as much as an average '14 car without an engine. Or, put a different way, a good '12 engine is worth about twice what a '14 engine is worth in equal condition.
If you are getting just an engine, you may want to consider picking up more '12 stuff and put together a '12 in a few years? A late '12 is not that difficult to assemble.
Congratulations either way.
As to performance. The late '15/ early '16 center-door sedan I used to have was one of the best performing Ts I ever drove. It was clocked at 55mph a couple times. It went up hills as well as half the speedsters I have had. I never had a Ruckstell in it and never wished I did. The engine was low mileage, late '15, low head, standard bore, cast iron pistons and untouched original cam.
I wish I still had it.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Posting is currently disabled in this topic. Contact your discussion moderator for more information.
Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration