I recall reading, somewhere, sometime, about an installation whereby additional oil was routed from the transmission cover to the front and centre mains. It was a gravity feed setup, no pump involved.
I used the Texas T Parts high-volume oiler on my '26 Touring but plan to use this original "Hill & Dale Ford Oiling System" band cover for my '24 Speedster engine.
The article I read about oiling the front and centre mains may have been written by Stan Howe. I think there were external oil lines piped to the mains or perhaps the bolt bores.
In any event, if Stan or anyone else has any recollections or suggestions along this line, I would love to hear them.
As an aside, I will be using this accessory 4-dip inspection cover from Chaffins. The troughs are 25% deeper than stock Ford with a trough capacity 28% greater than stock.
Chris, On mine the oil is slinged (slung? slang? slunged?) into an angle fitting attached in line with the flywheel on the upper driver's side of the hogshead and the oil is delivered to the second main in a much higher volume than the mag post oiler. Langs carries this kit. Part #3081HVOL (as in high volume) for $79.95. Well worth in in my book. Jim Patrick
Here is the kit. www.modeltford.com
Jim - That's an interesting installation and the only one like it I've ever heard of. It's always been my understanding that on a long or steep hill (or long AND steep) it's the front main and the front rod bearing that suffers. I'm wondering how much protection the front main and #1 rod bearing gets with your set-up?
I also wonder if it would be worth the small effort it would take to put a "tee" in place of the outlet fitting that screws into the side of your engine block and run part of the oil all the way forward to the timing gear end of the engine. (???) Just a thought,........harold
Sometimes we forget that the original internal oil line does a good job of supplying oil to the very front bearing. This high volume set up does the same for the second main which is close enough to the front that it can suffer from lack of oil, as well. I belive that it provides such a high volume that all the bearings benefit from the splash effect. Jim Patrick
Hi Jim, thanks for the photo and comments. That's a nice looking engine. I forgot to mention in my original post that I am also using the internal oiler, of course, and the mag post accessory oiler that has been on this engine for years.
Your accessory oiler is just like the Texas T Parts unit I have on my '26 Touring, except I used a rubber hose with a sight glass insert and plumbed the discharge into the side of the pan, between the #1 and #2 rods. I offset the scoop slightly to the rear of the recommended position so as to still be able to use the hogshead-to-frame brace.
You mentioned your setup supplies oil to the centre main... is there some provision inside the block to direct the oil to that bearing, or does it just dump into the general vicinity?
Thank you Chris. I just got her running on tuesday of this week (12/14) and she sounds great too!
That high volume oil setup was installed by an old Model T man in Polk City, Florida in 1977, before they were available on the market. He may have invented the thing, I don't know, but he positioned the outlet slightly above and even with the second bearing so that the oil splashed into the bearing oil hole and against the crankshaft and bearing support support so that it splashed in all directions.
Notice that the oil tube is large so that it carries a high volume of oil, under pressure, that is force fed by the rapidly turning flywheel with little chance of ever becoming clogged. Jim Patrick
Are you talking about Jess Bonar? When I was a little kid 4 & 5 yrs old, I remember riding in that Brass Touring with the Buffalo wire wheels on it.
We were on a club tour and my old man was driving one of his Model A's, Bonar came around us in the Touring and passed us like we were sitting still.
Him & Don Snyder Sr. lived right close to each other there in Polk City.
My question is will the hill and dale band cover oiler work with the acc trans screen?? Bud.
Hi Bud — yes it works with the accessory transmission screen. I had to adjust the screen surround slightly with a ball peen and the hogshead opening needed a minor adjustment with the angle grinder. Neither adjustment is visible from then outside nor do they affect operation.
For the life of me Luke, I can't remember his name, but it almost certainly was because Polk City is a very small town. I do recall he lived in a trailer park with a metal shed beside his trailer where his shop was. I carried my engine block over there for him to work on. He was probably 65 at the time, with white hair. Really knew Model T's.
I'd bet it was Jess Bonar, he was about the only Model T guy in Polk City aside from Don Snyder Sr. Jess also had a Model N. He lived in a trailer in Clear View Estates off Mt. Olive Rd. if memory serves right.
He was a true genius when it came to Model T's. He passed away in 1998.
Thanks for that information Luke. It's almost embarassing that I didn't remember his name, or how I met him or even how it came about that I took my engine over to Polk City to allow him to put this contraption on my engine, because I was pretty particular about who I allowed to work on my engine.
I do remember attending one Model T Ford club meeting in Lakeland, when I was in College, where I probably met him and was so impressed by him, his stories, his car, his interest in my car and what he had to say about Model T's, that I allowed him to talk me into taking my engine to Polk City and letting him put that oiler on.
If Don Snyder and Jess were close friends, there can hardly be any doubt that Don Snyder saw this oiler and marketed it for Jess. I hope Jess received royalties on it. At least I know Jess's genius live on in my car and I have one of his originals, made and installed by the inventor himself. Thanks again Luke. Jim Patrick
on mag post oilers: My t-buddy ran a clear plastic line on his to check the flow- he could never see that anything went through it so, on my rebuild we're installing the one from Texas T-parts that's cut into the hogshead like you show above
Chris, if you search Terry Horlick's postings about his oiling system awhile back you'll find a lot of interesting info that he did. He also included some good ideas about installing oil dams but I liked his testing about which point the most oil was delivered around the hogshead.
Hi Gene, thanks for the tip. For anyone interested, here is the link to Terry's excellent comments/research/suggestions on Model T oiling and upgrades.
The idea of the "mountain pan" with dip dams seems reasonable on the surface. Has anyone (other then Terry) used them or have any experience with them?
Terry reported, "Lugging the car up a long 45° slope was no problem at all". I don't think so, that is 100% slope and I don't beieve any auto could pull a slope that steep. He also reported traveling up a 5 mile 20° (that's 36%) grade. 36% grade is really steep, even for a cat road. Probably just a bad estimate of the slope.
In any case it seems that the high volume oiler and dip dams should supply plenty of oil to the rods and #2 and 3 mains. Since the oil feed hole for the front main is on the front side of the front main and the added oil feed line is on the back side of the front main it would seem that the front main could be starved for oil when the oiginal inside oil line is not working due to a steep up slope. Problems with #1 and 2 rod bearings are common, has anyone heard of problems with the front main?
I added a dam to the back of my 3 dip pan the last time I had the engine out. Have done the last two national tours without any problems. Don't know how effective it will be but what could it hurt. I did drill a couple of small holes to allow the oil to flow out when stopped and prevent sediment buildup inside the trough.
I don'think burned out front and center mains are much of a problem. The one and two rods will burn out before that happens.
THE FOUR TUBE “PERIOD CORRECT” OILING SYSTEM
We believe it is not necessary to use large diameter oil lines on the exterior of the engine to adequately oil the Model T Ford engine. Instead, we recommend the four-tube, period-correct system. We use 5/16 tubing for these lines.
1) THE FOUR TUBE “PERIOD CORRECT” OILING SYSTEM. The four tubes or oil lines are; the original internal oil line, the common accessory oil line from the magneto plug to a pan bolt at the front of the engine. Two accessory oil lines installed on either side of the oil pan dipper plate. These two internal oil lines will flow up to an 17% grade, while the standard oil line will flow until a 20% grade is reached, while the outside accessory mag post oil line will continue to flow up to a 44% grade. An additional quart of oil is advisable when making a really long pull such as Pikes Peak.
2) Oil line Ratios: Standard internal oil line, 19 5/8” length with a 4” rise (20%). Magneto plug oil line 19 5/8” length with an 8 5/8“ rise (44%). Pan plate oil lines 16 ¾” length with a 2 7/8” rise (17%).
3) We climbed Mt. Evans in Co in our 13 runabout, over 14,000 feet with this system and had no problems with either oil or fuel. It sure was fun! I’m ready to try Pikes Peak!
4) Folks continue to knock the Mag post oiler. I get excellent flow out of mine. It needs time to fill the tube, but flows well once it starts. I don’t know about the repops, as I always use an original. Available on ebay. I’ve purchased probably a dozen in the past 3 years. This post should raise the price on those babies!