Does anyone have a current and comprehensive list of the actual manufacturers (name, address, and telephone number) of all the various Model T replacement parts offered for sale? If so, please post it now.

Check the advertisers on this very website Max:

http://www.mtfca.com/suppliers/Suppliers.htm

Regards,
Garnet

If such a comprehensive list exists and I doubt it, it would not be a wise thing to post it here.
Ron the Coilman

Ron is right. Model T replacement part manufacturers range from small one man shops at their homes to very large multi-product manufacturers. Many of them, especially the small one man shop variety, do not make retail sales and only sell wholesale to our well known Model T parts vendors like Langs, and do not want to be contacted for direct sales. In addition, some Model T Parts Vendors, like Chaffins, have Model T parts made to specifications. They will sell these parts at retail and also wholesale them to other T parts vendors.

To summarize, Model T replacement parts manufacturers often do not want to make retail sales and you are best off to buy from the Model T parts vendors listed on this web site. These vendors provide a valuable and necessary service for us and deserve to be rewarded with our business.

Keith

Thanks Keith Merry Christmas and a Happy New Yr

Well at the same time,it would be great as a user of the parts to be able to contact a "tech support" for lack of better word sometimes maby.
Some people offer help i know.
It would also be nice to be able to know who to point out that is makeing "junk" and call on them to let them know what is wrong and what could be done to fix it.

I got instant "tech support" from Lang's.......great people, great advice!

Maybe he wants to start another model T parts company, I dont see a problem with that. it would be great to have another vendor, more the marrier i always thought.

I am a parts vender and I am right in the middle of Minnesota.

Sometimes it would be nice to know the links in the supply chain to be able to point the finger.
I bought an E-Z adjust slider for my Bennett brakes recently, for $36.75. For what it was, I thought it was not good value for the money.

When picking up some laser cut steel for one of my son's projects, I asked for a quote to cut the slider piece. For their minimum $80 charge they could cut me 17 pieces. That's $4.64 each. Bend them in the middle, weld a nut on the bend and pack it with two washers, a cotter pin and a clevis pin and you might double the price. Give the vendors a 100% mark-up and you have less than $19. Somewhere somebody has found another 100%

I agree the vendors do us a wonderful service and we could not do without them. Those I deal with back their sales with good, prompt service and a willingness to back their products. However, there are times when prices seem to be linked to what the market will bear rather than the real cost of manufacture and marketing.That may be the system but it doesn't mean we have to like it or take it without complaint.

Allan from down under.

Allan,

You should go into business and compete with the vendors on a non - profit basis. We would all buy our parts from you and then when you starved to death we would go back to buying from the vendors who are able to buy food and pay rent after selling their parts.

I'm a vendor in the middle of Missouri and after 15 yrs I only know a few people who supply my supplier, I don't have any idea who makes what, I'm just happy to be able to buy the selection that I am able to purchase because when I started in the 50's you could not find parts except at Western Auto, a few Ford dealers in there attics, and estate sales.

My partner and I make all kinds of T parts, and sell to all the major vendors. We don't advertise, because we only sell wholesale. Our motto is, if it isn't as good as Ford made it, we won't sell it!

Allen, I don't know if you are in business or not is but the cost of the part is not the cost of supplying the part. There is labor, which is obvious, but there are all the other costs which are not obvious. The part has to pay for the opportunity cost of the money that was used to purchase the materials; the press that was used to bend it; the electricity that lighted the shop; the heat that kept it warm or cooled; the taxes on the shop and the taxes on the profit-if there was any; the computer that keeps the books; the tape used to seal the packing box; the gas to take it to the shipping place; the wages of the girl who stood in line at the post office and the time of whoever answered the phone and spent half an hour with somebody who is calling for tech support because they are too stupid to follow the directions that were included. It also has to cover the replacement part that the guy screwed up and thinks should be replaced on warranty, the welder that needs a new tank of gas at eighty two bucks, the donation to the MTFCI Youth Auction, the caps that were given out at the swap meet, the tires on the pickup, the health insurance, work comp and sick leave for the kid you hired to help out two nights a week. It also needs to pay for the day you did not accomplish one damn thing in the shop because of the constant phone calls and interuptions from people with nothing better to do than call businesses and try to get them to donate to some do-gooder cause or buy advertising or some guy who is trying to get you to give him a deal because he is too cheap to pay retail and wants you to slide him one under the table for less than the retail dealer wants for it. It has to cover the tools that wore out, disappeared, became obsolete or just don't do the job. It has to cover the days the owner had to close up shop to go serve on jury duty for some BS case where the lawyers are making $100 an hour and he is making $12 a day listening to them argue some piddly point of law when it is obvious the perp did it and the court appointed lawyer is dragging it out to get a few more hours of fees out of the taxpayers. It has to cover all of that and more and more and more and more.

I welcome anybody to be in business for themselves. I've been at it for almost 50 years. Hardly a year goes by that some new guy doesn't start up in the auction business and cut fees because he or his wife have a job at the state and they are just doing a few auctions on weekends to make some easy money. Competition is that mainstay of free enterprise but make sure you are fair competition. Don't beat up the guys who are in business by just being cheap. Rent a shop, buy some tools, report your income and pay your taxes like we do. Either be in business or be out of the way of the people who are. If you truly can provide a better service at competitive cost you will do OK. But there is a lot more to it than meets the eye.

I live in the state capital, where about 90% of the people work for the government one way or another. They think being in business is easy and all profit. Many of them are well paid to harrass business owners and figure out ways to add more fees, more regulations and more reasons to sell all the tools and give up, send the jobs to China and Mexico instead of continuing to beat your head against the wall to make a living.

It is Saturday, I'm headed to the shop to work for most of the day, didn't get everything I needed to do done this week and the only way I can figure to get it done is to get out there and do it. I'm not making overtime, I'm putting in time that should have already paid for a week's work. Not this week. Had a bunch of interuptions, took my girlfriend to lunch and had a dental appointment. The heat bill goes on whether I am out there working or not so off I go. Want to buy me a new lathe??? I sure could use one. The one I want is about $8000, I could borrow the money and pay 10% on it, which would be $65 a month in interest plus another 200 payment. I need a new pickup worse than I need a new lathe. My Dodge has 95,000 on it, my car has 175,000, my lathe has 20 years and hundreds and hundreds of hours on it. It still works great so it don't absolutely need one but I'm going to have to do something about a pickup in the next year or so. Oh, I forgot, "You can write it off," is the answer most non-business people have when I talk about spending money. The reality is that you can only write it off against PROFIT and then all you save is the taxes.

Here is another thing I forgot. You have to cover the lost sale because some guy who had promised to buy (insert your product and number or items ordered) from you. You now have the material in stock, you have the guy who is going to laser cut them or whatever for you, you have turned down other jobs so you can do this one and he sends an email telling you he has "Decided to go another way," with the project and won't need yours afterall. A couple of those deals will make you gunshy.

Allen, I don't know if you are in business or not is but the cost of the part is not the cost of supplying the part. There is labor, which is obvious, but there are all the other costs which are not obvious. The part has to pay for the opportunity cost of the money that was used to purchase the materials; the press that was used to bend it; the electricity that lighted the shop; the heat that kept it warm or cooled; the taxes on the shop and the taxes on the profit-if there was any; the computer that keeps the books; the tape used to seal the packing box; the gas to take it to the shipping place; the wages of the girl who stood in line at the post office and the time of whoever answered the phone and spent half an hour with somebody who is calling for tech support because they are too stupid to follow the directions that were included. It also has to cover the replacement part that the guy screwed up and thinks should be replaced on warranty, the welder that needs a new tank of gas at eighty two bucks, the donation to the MTFCI Youth Auction, the caps that were given out at the swap meet, the tires on the pickup, the health insurance, work comp and sick leave for the kid you hired to help out two nights a week. It also needs to pay for the day you did not accomplish one damn thing in the shop because of the constant phone calls and interuptions from people with nothing better to do than call businesses and try to get them to donate to some do-gooder cause or buy advertising or some guy who is trying to get you to give him a deal because he is too cheap to pay retail and wants you to slide him one under the table for less than the retail dealer wants for it. It has to cover the tools that wore out, disappeared, became obsolete or just don't do the job. It has to cover the days the owner had to close up shop to go serve on jury duty for some BS case where the lawyers are making $100 an hour and he is making $12 a day listening to them argue some piddly point of law when it is obvious the perp did it and the court appointed lawyer is dragging it out to get a few more hours of fees out of the taxpayers. It has to cover all of that and more and more and more and more.

I welcome anybody to be in business for themselves. I've been at it for almost 50 years. Hardly a year goes by that some new guy doesn't start up in the auction business and cut fees because he or his wife have a job at the state and they are just doing a few auctions on weekends to make some easy money. Competition is that mainstay of free enterprise but make sure you are fair competition. Don't beat up the guys who are in business by just being cheap. Rent a shop, buy some tools, report your income and pay your taxes like we do. Either be in business or be out of the way of the people who are. If you truly can provide a better service at competitive cost you will do OK. But there is a lot more to it than meets the eye.

I live in the state capital, where about 90% of the people work for the government one way or another. They think being in business is easy and all profit. Many of them are well paid to harrass business owners and figure out ways to add more fees, more regulations and more reasons to sell all the tools and give up, send the jobs to China and Mexico instead of continuing to beat your head against the wall to make a living.

It is Saturday, I'm headed to the shop to work for most of the day, didn't get everything I needed to do done this week and the only way I can figure to get it done is to get out there and do it. I'm not making overtime, I'm putting in time that should have already paid for a week's work. Not this week. Had a bunch of interuptions, took my girlfriend to lunch and had a dental appointment. The heat bill goes on whether I am out there working or not so off I go. Want to buy me a new lathe??? I sure could use one. The one I want is about $8000, I could borrow the money and pay 10% on it, which would be $65 a month in interest plus another 200 payment. I need a new pickup worse than I need a new lathe. My Dodge has 95,000 on it, my car has 175,000, my lathe has 20 years and hundreds and hundreds of hours on it. It still works great so it don't absolutely need one but I'm going to have to do something about a pickup in the next year or so. Oh, I forgot, "You can write it off," is the answer most non-business people have when I talk about spending money. The reality is that you can only write it off against PROFIT and then all you save is the taxes.

Here is another thing I forgot. You have to cover the lost sale because some guy who had promised to buy (insert your product and number or items ordered) from you. You now have the material in stock, you have the guy who is going to laser cut them or whatever for you, you have turned down other jobs so you can do this one and he sends an email telling you he has "Decided to go another way," with the project and won't need yours afterall. A couple of those deals will make you gunshy.

You have to cover all the time you spend waiting for the Internet to work, too. I dunno how I got that posted twice.

Off to the shop.

Stan, well said.

At one time I decided to make the metal braces that go under the Model A floorboards--mostly because none were available at the time. I did research checking out all the variations of originals I could find. Found a supplier of the correct rivets, wrote directions, gave them to random folk to see if they were readable and followable (is that a word?) Had to include in the instructions why the rivets might not fit some repro floorboards--because they weren't made to the original thickness (looked into making floorboards too) Part of my plan was to use a local non-profit that provided work for the mentally challenged (they had a wood shop!). Well, after doing a test run, including packaging (There's a big part of the costs!), someone brought out the braces (from China, no doubt) at retail less than my cost of production. I don't know if they are as accurate as mine, but that doesn't seem to matter much to some folks.
I still have some of the braces somewhere in storage--and LOTS of rivets!
Hey Stan, I've been told that one advantage to being self employed is that you can work half days when you want to---and you can decide which 12 hours that'll be!!
T'
David D.
(not currently self-employed, but third generation of a family that's been self-employed)

Allen:

"real cost of manufacture and marketing". You as the consumer have the final vote. Just don't buy it. I make some things for the T market place. It is a hobby for me so I really don't care if it makes a profit so long as it doesn't lose money. I have a commitment to my dealers and to my vendors and to Angela my daughter-in-law who works for me, Renee my wife who does the books, and to Johnny my son that does the web site. If I replaced all those people with "real" employees and started to draw a pay check too, the price on my stuff would more than double. But I am not complaining - I have fun - "most" of the time. When it ceases to be fun - Fun Projects will cease. It is heartbreaking to do a lot of research and to come up with a good well made item and then have somebody copy it and sell it cheaper since they don't have to do the research nor make it as nice - they just make it cheaper. They don't have to take any risk since they were second and have the advantage of knowing that the product sells - case in point - you bought one. I suggest you go into business making the product as you describe. You might want to plate it with zinc or something or it will be rusty by the time it sits on your shelf for a month. You might also need to decrease your 100% profit margins that you are talking about here and there since the item you describe is part of the brake system and your product liability insurance quote for such an item may cause you to need a change of underwear. "Me too - but cheaper" is a way to start a business I guess but I have started a few businesses and found out that if you look at really successful businesses you will see one thing in common and this is that "People have success in business in direct proportion to the contribution that they make to the industry they are in" - Michael Burke, founder Tellabs,Inc. The thing that started their business was a totally novel new way or idea. Bill Gates made a whole new operating system, Henry Ford made a huge contribution to manufacturing methods. Ebay founder created a whole new way for individuals to market their left over goods. Model T folks are frugal and making something cheaper will only work until someone does the same thing to you. The first vendor will be gone and they will bemoan the loss of good products. But - come on in the waters fine...but cold too sometimes. Risk your house and everything you own on an idea and you might get rich.

Gads!
I would think Model T & Model A guys would be thrilled to pieces to HAVE so many parts sources unlike collectors of other makes.

Stan and John - Well said!

I suggest you save these words 'cause every once in awhile someone complains about prices & then you can just re-post these.

I, for one, appreciate all of our Model T parts vendors, manufacturers, and rebuilders. That includes researchers and authors of articles and books on pertinent topics. Our hobby needs them to keep our T's rolling....

Keith

Stan, You said it all, TWICE. If we didn'i love the hobby we wouldn't be in business. The customer just has no idead of all that is involved in manufacturing a part and marketing it. Most of the parts manufacturers in the hobby are comitted to making a correct quality part. There are a few exceptions but at least we are no longer stuck with the junk made in Argentina. Our company manufactures around two hundred different parts for the Model T Ford but it will never make us rich. Ruckstell sold $40,000,000.00 worth of Ruckstell Axles in six years. I have been selling them for thirty one years and have not even come close to that figure. Perhaps I should raise the price. But no, we are committed to keeping our prices reasonable. The Model T hobby is blessed because of the ready availability of mostly quality replacement parts. Most of the parts are quite reasonably priced and the customer who complains about the price does not understand the costs involved or appreciate the fact that the part is even available.

Dog gone it.. My wire machine just broke down this morning.. gee Its going to send me back some money to get this repaired and going to backorder the parts that we had promised to the our parts suppliers..Oh well I'm going to have to raise my prices on these items to cover the repair.

Some more expenses for the self employed.
Fed, State and local taxes.
Personal property taxes.
Full health insurance premiums. (No employer kicking in half or more.)
Trash and hazardous material disposal.
Snow plowing (if your in the northern states)
Liability insurance.
Building/equipment maintenance.

Don't forget paying the employer share of SS contributions, the Self-Employment Tax.

a educated business person knows these obsicals. A mom & pop operation who thinks this is is still a hobby business doesn't understand operating costs on the product they are manufacturing and what the catalog industry wants for profit.

Glen, I have to correct you on what you said earlier you said (Most of the parts manufacturers in the hobby are comitted to making a correct quality part..) Certain products that you sell and you have expressed in earlier forum topics that you have purchased from vendors that maufacture in the "Good Old USA" that does not meet upto a quality part. You talk like a pure business person who's out for profit than a quality part.

Anyone remember the time i think i asked about the springbronze contacts? There was a guy who said he had a roll of left over springbronze from something that might be suitable for making contacts. Whoever makes the copper plated steel ones now might be interested in buying the left over roll of springbronze to make the contacts with. Just a thought i had while reading this.

Stan
Well said except the shot at Lawyers...We don't charge $100/hr. My office is the least expensive in Oakland County and I charge $225/hr. and my perps aren't guilty...they are wrongly charged by a government that does not care about expenses to prosecute!

Oh yes, my errors and ommissions insurance (malpractice) is $20 per hour, nearly 10% of my billings! Add medical, auto, building fire, and social security and you are at a significant cost. And no I don't give out hats at events.

I came from a manufacturing background (GM) and many of my clients are automotive suppliers. The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence.

I've never understood people who constantly complain about prices but never do anything about it. Then again nine times out of ten, these are the same people who will look down on a person for being successful instead of looking up to them and seeking their knowledge and finding out how they became successful.

My dad looked into making brass lights. It was all pretty easy to do until it came to the Chimney. You have to sell a lot of lights to recoupe the $200,000 it costs to have that mold made.

Peter, You could not be any more wrong. First, what I said previously was that the vendors would not sell an inferior part unless it was all that was available. The customer then has the choice of buying it or looking for a good used one. There is nothing deceitful or dishonest about that. Most of the inferior parts are imported. I find it offensive that you would accuse me of being a pure business person out to make a hefty profit at the expense of quality. You obviously have never bought anything from us before. Every part we manufacture except for one is manufactured in the USA to strict specifications. We seldom have a problem with quality and if we do we fix it before any one knows. It obviously costs more to manufacture parts in the USA but you have better quality control and that is why we do it. This drives up the cost but we still keep our prices competative to prevent some other vendor from making the part offshore and cutting our throat. So don't accuse me of being greedy and not caring about quality. You are dead wrong. If I received the profit you claim I would be driving a Mercedes instead of a nine year old Chevy. Our goal has always been to provide quality parts at competative prices in support of those in the hobby. I do not understand why you find this offensive.

How many automobiles that were manufactured 100 years ago, can you today, pick up a catalog and order a new crankshaft? Have you priced a new crankshaft from your Chevy or Ford dealer? We should be thankful to have the parts support we have for our Model T Fords.

If you really want to see high priced parts, try John Deere.

Peter Vanlare:

You are dead wrong. lChaffin's makes quality parts. I have over the year used many, many of his parts particularly Ruckstell Parts and have ALWAYS FOUND THEM TO BE TOP QUALITY.

I am yet to have any problems with my Chaffin Ruckstell. Mr Vanlare, Everybody has there own opinion but on this your wrong

Sorry fellows,

I seem to have touch a raw nerve here. Some of you seem not to have read my last paragraph where I am thankful for and give due credit for the wonderful service the vendors give us in our hobby.

I was trying to get my head around how the cost of production was multiplied by a factor of four at the retail end. If this is indicative of the market as a whole, then Glen Chaffin's excellent 26-7 Ruckstel kits which retail at $2016 must cost just $500 to manufacture. I don't think so!

As a cereal farmer and wool producer, I am not so far removed from the pressures of running a business as some would presume. We have to take what we get on the international market for our grains, often in competition with heavily subsidised producers in other countries. To get out of this "Take what the market offers" situation we market our own wool directly to end users. Much is processed into felting batts and knitting yarns, in Australia, rather than the cheap Chinese option. The transport and processing costs and then the stock holding costs are a real drain on our resources, but we value our products and do our best to keep faith with our craftspeople. However, we could never expect to retail our goods at four times the cost of production.

If you compare the componentry supplied in the outside oil line kit for $24.95 and the pair of hardened and ground tie rod end bolts with a stepped thread, a drilled and threaded head, nuts, cotter pins, bushes and a three piece brass oiler for $39.95, then the EZ slider at $36.75 does not seem good value to me.

I repeat, I was not being critical of the vendors and the service they give. We could not do what we do without them. I was questioning the high
pricing of one particular component.

Forgive me fellows for my temerity.

Allan from down under




Allan from down under

Allan,

I think it is simply a case of you not recognizing the labor that went into making the part. You or anyone else would have a hard time making that part for $36.75 if you paid yourself anything for your own time. It is fair for anyone to be compensated for their hard work and ingenuity.

As another person said above if you think it is such a bad deal then vote with your wallet and make one yourself. You already voted did you not?

Allen

Agree that sometimes value is what the customer expectations are. The price for mfg goods is rather complicated, but most times, volume production lowers costs. So with our Model T parts, the market size is low, leads to higher costs most times.

Good point is the Timken front wheel bearings, you would think a large corp with all the equipment could keep cost down, but low volume can lead to that......$72 for a bearing seems high to me too. But glad we can get them, as a bearing will last a lifetime if cared for by maintenance.



As for that EZ slider, my thinking (and I made my career in designing, mfg, and marketing medical devices with their associated costs of regulatory and product liability too) is a good value.



Would take some fixtures to get accurate bend for a batch, milling work, finish, and weld, inspect, assemble and package, labor time, and then you add the overhead of operations for cost of goods, put on a tidy profit if the item can take it, and then wholesale it to vendors. Add a bunch more to cost of sales if you try to sell direct, that will take you to a retail price to the customer.

I am just real glad this hobby has so many dedicated industrious persons who make replacement parts for the T.

Other antique car orphan brands are most difficult to built and operate as no parts can be found, and no ones makes them.

There are two sides to every coin and quite frankly I'd just as soon have a forum open to figure out the great from perhaps the not so great. If nothing else is available, the not so great then becomes the price point buy, doesn't it? Trouble is...that doesn't work! Folks try to hammer in mushroomed keys into new axles, hit the edges with a file and then blame the new axles when the wheel won't come back off...someone in one of the mags just tore into a suppler about something that failed (and if I read it correctly the failed part was something he bought from GM to add to his kit) and we never seem to find balance and relativity. And then we had that S&H 'diversion'...oh my!
So it goes in the modern world.

That said...we have the conundrum of off-shore v. USA made. I don't mind (and have purchased lot's) what I see for the USA made stuff. By and large the supplier to the supplier knows the quality angle...and yes....on tacked and brazed items I 'might' have wanted to do the brazing myself but being realistic, alot of those parts are out of sight, out of mind once 'in', and I didn't have to get 'around to it' to finish it. Ergo, value is there. If I have to file something or 'shoe-shine' something to make it fit...that goes with the territory also as far as I see it. I'd rather have more material than not enough.

The off-shore though does bother me a bit and quite frankly someday I'll get over it. Commodity casting out of China go .55$ a pound or less. Near investment grade fine phenolic sand castings go .70$ a pound. OK..thats after pattern cost but for the quantities our hobby needs we are talking wood patterns and not alum/ iron ones, something an hour or two in the woodshop can make and the Chinese 'might' charge 25 bucks to make for the supplier. When I see something that goes less than 2 pounds, has two standard holes drilled in it, and is faced off on a sanding belt...seeing it listed for 89 bucks IS a bit hard to swallow! But then again...like I say above for the USA items, 'when in Rome' and I need one and can't find a good used...have to pay the piper!

For a while one of the vendors use to label alot of his stuff something like 'restoration grade' or 'good enough' grade or even 'better than nothing grade'. I actually liked that because you bought the 'better than nothing' my own expectations were low, actually extremely low, and when I paid the $$$$ for the 'restoration grade' well, it better be right and correct out of the box! I think now that was probably my imagination as I don't see any vendor 'selling' that way now except on a few little items.

For those that make a real business out of it, 'bless you' and you deserve to make a buck. For those that are buying complete out of a place like China for 8.90 tops and selling for 89 just for pushing papers because no one else has had that thought yet...don't count on that to cover retirement in the long run, consumers do eventually figure it out

People are people...there's a story about one of the 'new' business models for the 'new' America. Why the customer feedback forms are bunk. People hate service depts at car dealers...one new enterprising guy decided he would build his business on a 100.00% service model, selling the cars just went along for the ride. Within 24 months of opening from scratch he was already one of the top 10 in the nation. His service rating? 99.999! The amazing part is that all 1000's of service orders have in fact been 5's, save one person and he gave it a 1! Why? because he expected his car to be apparently compounded and waxed inclusive even though that was not on the service list...on pick up he brought a light and caught every scratch and swirl in his car and of course claimed none of them were there on arrival. So he just goes and launches his '1' when the dealer said 'I don't think so!'...then the dealer called and offered a free rub-out and wax...the guy goes back which is yet another service order and you guessed it...he gives this one a '1' also because there were some scratches that wouldn't come out and he expected them to now be air-brushed over! The dealer is fit to be tied, the damage is done, so in the hopes of maybe getting a good supplier rating or at least a 'satisfied' comment on the internet page, the dealer offers to add a back up sensor beeper free of charge. Guy says sure...and yet another '1' as he expected new undercoating in the wheel wells once the wires were run through the frame holes! Points out, you just can't win with all the people, no matter how hard you try!

Thank you friends for your vote of confidence. It is nice to know that some appreciate what the vendors do. It makes no sense to offer shoddy parts for sale in the hope of getting rich. A happy customer is more important to most dealers than trying to sell junk. Snyders, Bobs and Chaffin's all manufacture and sell quality parts. After all expenses we are lucky if we make 30 percent. This is a lobor of love for the hobby and the customer. If it were not so we would all close our doors and go into politics. A happy customer makes it all worth while. A thoughtless, ininformed snide remark makes you want to throw in the towell and say to hell with it. I choose to ignore the uninformed and enjoy the hobby and the many wonderful friends we have made.

If I was able to make anything for the Model T and sell it commercially, I'd either sell only to the established vendors or forget about it. There are too many headaches like insurance, patents, whiney-bitchy-cheap buyers (oops did I say that?), people that want something for nothing, people that think you shouldn't be selling things to actually make money (gasp), etc etc etc. I can find things in the catalogs that are overpriced. However, do I have the time to make all of them? Do I have confidence that my part will be safe? What if I make a couple of things and sell them; will I ever be sued?

Nope, too much of a headache. The guys that actually make these parts available to us are great. The vendors are great. Anyone loaning parts out to be reproduced is great. To be able to purchase so many items for cars that are all approaching 100 years old is GREAT!!

Craig

We are lucky to have at our disposal the amount of quality and reasonably priced parts for an 80 to 100 year old vehicle. Look around, the T is about the cheapest vehicle to maintain and restore. We should regularly say thanks to the vendors that make this possible. Thanks vendors.

Andy

I just wanted to say thanks to the venders. I would be stuck without parts here in utah. No t fleas here. Thank you all. I hope you make a profit off me and my t friends. If it keeps you in business.

I'll add another "expense" of doing business. When the "help" decides his personal soap opera is more important than showing up for work, you get to do your work AND his. Too many sixty or seventy hour weeks can get you down. If I were starting a new business again I'd be reluctant to hire anybody who didn't have gray hair.

You said it, Steve! The worst is not finding out about his soap opera until the next day, because he couldn't be bothered to lift up his cell phone and call and tell you he wasn't going to show.

Then this is all multiplied by two when he gets a car.

Then, by four, when he gets a girlfriend.

FWIW, my new guy has grey hair.

Do many people use Foxnews as their home page? Just wondering about that as some Model T posters do. I noticed this on the first post. Not being devious but just curious. To each their own.

Then there's the vendor whose S&H forgot to account for size of parts. I just ordered a couple of small items and a pair of runningboard truss rods from FunProjects just an hour ago. Shipping was $7 !! Those truss rods are about four feet long, and won't hardly go into a prepaid priority box.

John, if you want to charge me additional shipping cost, that's ok. Or did you build it into the sell price?

The price of an item is governed by the competition, not what it costs to make. Competition is sometimes direct, item for item, and sometimes new vs. used, or buy vs. make.

rdr

If the price of something is too high, do what I do. I make it myself. When I got my old truck it didn't have any coils in it. When I saw them in Snyders I was overwhelmed. So I made a home made CD system and stuffed it in the coil box.

Or if I can't find something. I may rework something. I wanted a tack, so I took a cheap one from JC W. and opened it up. With some black paint I change the 8 into a 2 and the 4 into a 1, painted out the others, fiddled with the timing circuits and recalibrated so 2000 would be the top.

I forgot that we can "write off" work vehicles.
Shucks I think I will run out tomorrow and by a brand NEW van or maybe a NEW RollsRoyce and just "write it off" as a business expense.
I can write-off my electric bill too but I don't leave the lights on when I go home.

If I lost a tool this year and bought another for $5 that just means I pay income tax on $5 less than if I hadn't bought the tool......But I'm still out the $5.

Twice between '89 and '99 I took on partners that wanted to run the same business I was in.
We worked to gether for a year and then I gave them my share for free.
In both cases they folded in 6 months.
The first lost his rear end-and his wife, the second lost so much weight he got sick and worried himself so bad his Dr. told him to get out NOW!
In Ca. 90% of restaurants fail the first year.
The rest fold as soon as the owner runs out of money.

I forgot that we can "write off" work vehicles.
Shucks I think I will run out tomorrow and by a brand NEW van or maybe a NEW RollsRoyce and just "write it off" as a business expense.
I can write-off my electric bill too but I don't leave the lights on when I go home.

If I lost a tool this year and bought another for $5 that just means I pay income tax on $5 less than if I hadn't bought the tool......But I'm still out the $5.

Twice between '89 and '99 I took on partners that wanted to run the same auto repair business I was in.
We worked to gether for a year and then I gave them my share for free.
In both cases they folded in 6 months.
The first lost his rear end-and his wife, the second lost so much weight he got sick and worried himself so bad his Dr. told him to get out NOW!
In Ca. 90% of restaurants fail the first year.
The rest fold as soon as the owner runs out of money.