Survey - Coupe body and engine numbers

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2011: Survey - Coupe body and engine numbers
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Sosnoski on Friday, December 23, 2011 - 11:14 am:

Recently there has been several posts regarding body serial numbers on the 24 - 25 Coupes. I have been doing a lot of research on these Coupes and have accumulated a lot of information about them. One of the projects I've been working on is trying to correlate the body serial numbers with production dates. I managed to locate the monthly production figures for the Coupe. Given that Briggs was building most of the Coupe bodies during the 1924 model year, I have been able to extrapolate out the range of serial numbers for a given month. Based on the very limited number of serial numbers and engine numbers I have, some of them are way off, but some of them are surprisingly close to what I predicted. The ones that are way off are probably due to the engine not being the original one for that body.

What I need is a much larger sample size of engine and body serial numbers. Could everyone with a 24 or 25 Coupe send me the serial numbers of the body and of the engine (or the date the engine was assembled). The body number may be in one of two places:

- On the passenger's side floor board riser (the metal piece which runs from the sill to the firewall and holds up the floor boards). This would be a series of numbers ending in a B.

- Stamped into the wood on the top of the sill just inside the driver's door. Open the door and look down - between the rocker (piece below the door) and the floor boards. This is a Ford branch plant number and will contain a series of numbers and some letters which would indicate the branch the body was assembled at.

Some bodies do not have serial numbers located anywhere. That is important information as well so I would like to know even if your body does not have a serial number.

Thanks for your participation.

Dave S


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Danial Davis of Veneta, Oregon on Friday, December 23, 2011 - 12:39 pm:

Us 27ers are feeling a little left out...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By "Hap" Harold Tucker on Friday, December 23, 2011 - 02:24 pm:

And if you know of someone with a 24-25 coupe -- please contact them and see if they will let you provide the data to Dave. A lot of our T folks don't use the forum (my Dad never did - but he a lot information in the garage). While not up there with solving world peace -- it could help provide the missing piece Dave needs to confirm or correct a listing of 1924-25 coupe body numbers that he has compared to dates of assembly.

Dave -- if "way off" is a couple months -- then Ford's occasional practice of stock piling engines for various reasons or even having the engine assembled at a branch plant and the body shipped there for assembly could be part of the difference in dates. For example at: http://mtfca.com/encyclo/doc24.htm

MAR 18, 1924 Letter from Chicago Branch
"We hear stories that some salesmen are telling their customers to be sure and look at the motor number of any car when they buy in order to be sure they get a late motor number. These particular salesmen are just making a lot of trouble for themselves because at the new plant we have hundreds of motors that have been standing there for thirty days or more and will be going into the cars in the course of production. This means that all dealers will receive motor numbers from the Burnham plant that will be considerably lower in number than those motors received from the Chicago plant so just stop your salesmen making any remarks at all about motor numbers because in so doing they are going to make a lot of trouble for you when we start shipping from the new plant."
A.W.L. Gilpin
Branch Manager
P.S. In correspondence the old Ford plant in Chicago is referred to as the Chicago plant and the new plant is referred to as the Burnham plant because it is near the Burnham railroad yards.

Again thank you for taking the time and effort to document the 1924-25 coupes so thoroughly. Many of us are looking forward to seeing your book.

Dan -- as a 1927 owner you can check for a Branch Assembly number on your car. As far as I know the coupe bodies were no longer purchased from outside body suppliers for the "improved model" coupes. Not all the plants stamped an assembly plant number on their cars but several did. With the introduction of the Model A Ford in 1928 most Branch Assembly plants stamped a number on the body. If your "improved" USA body has one, it will probably be located on the top side of one of the metal channels that holds up the largest front floor board. It could be on either side or the channel that between the two sides. See: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/80257/111490.html for additional details. [For Canadian and Australian 1926-27 production the Branch Assembly Plant code is normally on the firewall on the engine side a little below the radiator support rod.

Again Dave thank you for taking the time to better document this area about our Model Ts. And for anyone with access to a 1924-25 coupe -- please see if you can provide Dave with some addtional data points.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brian Holcomb on Friday, December 23, 2011 - 03:28 pm:

Dave,
My engine number is 9990426
Body numer is 223349B
Should come out to be June of '24 ???
How is the book coming?
Thanks for your knowledge.
Brian Holcomb


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Danial Davis of Veneta, Oregon on Friday, December 23, 2011 - 04:10 pm:

Hey thanks Hap. I'll check that out when I get home from work today.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Saturday, December 24, 2011 - 04:05 am:

My coupe has engine number 97059xx indicating an April 12, 1924 engine build. The body number appears to be 182419B. It was difficult to read. The metal appeared to have been scraped with a screw driver when the car was restored about forty years ago. Also, the numbers appear to be raised, as though they were stamped from the backside in reverse of the usual number stamp sets. Is that usual?

I also would be very interested in your finished work.
Drive carefully, and enjoy Christmas! W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Sosnoski on Saturday, December 24, 2011 - 09:52 am:

Thanks for the information. So far these two new numbers don't fit in with how I thought the numbers should work, but, they do seem to fit into a pattern. Up to Jan 1924 they seem to correlate with the production numbers. Then for some reason they seem to be consistently off by two months. I have a couple of June cars which according to the production numbers would place the bodies as being built in April. Wayne, your car from April would have been built in Feb. according to the production numbers. Something else is going on here, it may be that Ford started building bodies sooner than I thought.

NEED MORE DATA!!!

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Page on Wednesday, December 28, 2011 - 03:50 pm:

Bump


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Bartlett on Wednesday, December 28, 2011 - 05:57 pm:

Dave, I don't know if you need this info but...The body # on my suicide door coupe,which might be a 22, is B8682820


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