just came home today with an eisemann cross drive magneto mount that like most, is missing the cam gear. anybody got one? i know langs has em, but i wonder, many industrial things interchange with something else, like a tractor gear or what ever. any one know of an interchange, or anyone got a bad gear for me to study? thanks
I don't know of an interchange, but it also needs a special cam gear nut. The Bosch nut will not work.
I just installed one today.
yours looks much shinier, i'll trade ya. the nut looks easy enough to make, but i see no broched slot in the gear? do they not even use the for timing pin? more adjustable i suppose. what locks the nut? another nut? or, would it bottom on a shoulder on the cam and give no adjustment? edgecate me please (in spelling too!)
The cam nut holds the large timing gear in place. Mag gear is held by the nut used to hold the standard Model t roller timer.
Drive gear is not broched
Cam nut spec
Made from 1.250" Hex stock
Overall height 1.946"
Shoulder height .785"
thank you, what are you using to drive the mag itself? i have seen the old post about some rubber flex coupling, got a better idea? thanks
The left unit is a Bosch side drive with a male/female connection. The right unit is another Matco that used a rubber flex coupling. The part in between the two is the male part that goes with the unit mount on the engine block.
Hope that helps
looks like that oil line is just getting what flys of the timing gears, or got a funnel thing like a stock t oil line? mine has a similar coupler i think for rubber, one hole thru for a pin or somthing. sorry no camera in the shop tonight. thanks for your efforts here
I am having this special nut machined locally as it is not available anywhere I can find. The machinist would like a cam for test fitting purposes (knows nothing about Ts so wants to visualize how it is installed...). Does anyone have a junk cam (one we do not have to worry about hurting) they would be willing to sell me. It can be broken in two, busted lobes, etc., for all we care; just need the front half with good threads. I have one, but it is firmly rusted into the only spare engine I have. ;) PM me if you have one available for this good cause.
Mike has been extremely helpful to me in my setup via answering my many emails, for which I am grateful. Will post more photos here as progress is made on our project.
I have several Matco cross drive units...and one with complete gears. I searched for years for the drive gear and now I find that they are available from T parts vendors. And I thought I had something rare. Kinda takes the fun out of it. But I do have an original incremental/adjustable coupling which I think is an improvement over the rubber hose. Anyway, I can complete the second one with the repro parts.
Langs sold me a very nice set of gears, it is the nut that holds the gear between the timing gear and the Matco gear (with the corresponding shoulder shown in the first photo above). If you know of a vendor that sells that nut, or if you have one to sell, I would be interested. Mine is otherwise complete; it is the cam nut that has presented the challenge for us here.
brian, i can send you an old cam, where are you at? i need 2 nuts, mikes specs look like its not a big deal but i havnt had time to get to it. get me here, or at 612 919 2208, thanks
My contact information is in my profile, my cell is 307.272.5591. The point of the cam is that he feels the threads are an "odd" size on the inside of the cam nut, so he wants the male side to check fit. He has a brand new timing gear nut from me/Langs already, which I thought would be sufficient from which to work. Mike kindly provided me a detail drawing as well. When you hear what my machinist so called friend guy thinks this special nut is going to cost, you may not be so happy however. Anyway, look forward to talking to you.
So what is a cross drive. It appears to be a device to power some accessory? But what and why?
it is to drive a magneto across the front of the engine, so the stock generator outlet can still be used for charging a battary. no magneto used on the flywheel--make it lighter
I saw a complete Matco set up at the Bakersfield for sale today.
It powers an external magneto (in my case a Bosch DU4 but an alternative, an Eisenmann, can be seen here http://www.ebay.com/itm/170820197737?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649#ht_500wt_1413 ), which in turn powers the ignition system of the car, replacing the timer/coils. This is a high voltage mag, so no coils are used (see diagram). Timing is achieved via gearing inside this unit (I sure hope it will anyway). You can see the inside of the unit in the photos above.
The stock T timing gear cover is removed. The nut that holds the large timer gear is removed. A new nut is put in its place that both acts as a spacer to add a second gear, and provide a keyway for that second gear to keep from slipping out of time. The second drive gear engages another smaller gear on a "cross driving" shaft, that in turn drives the magneto. You can see all this in the photos above. The nut between the stock timing gear and the main drive gear is the issue I am working through right now. MAG-ES is the stock number for the drive gears if you wish to see them on Lang's site. This is all contained in a cover that replaces the stock T timing gear cover. In mine, there is a diverter inside the oil filer tube as well. There is an access bolt, as well as another bolt to control camshaft end play.
You can see in this photo the mag sits on a platform. In my case, on the driver side. Clayton's photos show both types, one of which replaces the generator. Not trying to get into the whole which is better and why this is worse argument versus a stock T. Gets to my project goals in a manner that it is better for me. With this, a Ruckstell, and maybe Stan rebuilding one of my OF carbs one day, I hope to achieve 31 MPH versus the current 30.
The pictured drive arrangement appears to be a direct-coupled magneto in lieu of an impulse-coupled unit. It may be difficult to start a T without an impulse coupling. There have been various discussions on this subject.
you are possibly correct john, i am not an expert yet, but i challenge you to hold the mag while i turn it by hand...nice blue spark, and the duplex du4 can be started on battery then switched to mag just like a stock t. mine is still a pile of parts, but i hope you are wrong!!
New gears from Lang's... and the cam nut picked up from the machinist today...
Could not have done it without ya Mike. Appreciate it.
Photo of the gear assembly installed. Note how the shoulder of the nut engages the drive gear.