Pinpointing 1910 touring and its original owner w/ shout-outs to Kim Dobbins and Bernard Paulsen

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2012: Pinpointing 1910 touring and its original owner w/ shout-outs to Kim Dobbins and Bernard Paulsen
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Tuesday, May 15, 2012 - 10:43 pm:

Thought I'd show you the fun I had in 20 minutes with an old photo I recently stumbled upon.

The car in the photo has Minnesota 1912-13-14 license plate #11703.

My father is a collector of early Minnesota license plates and has a lot of early registration information in his files. I was able to look up the license plate in the Minnesota Official State Automobile Directory for 1914 which identified the owner as Samuel Gibeau of Red Lake Falls, Minnesota.

Once I identified the owner, I was then able look up the 1910 registration information from the Minnesota government ledger which also includes the serial number for this car which is 15480.

According to the info compiled by Bruce McCaulley listed in the online encyclopedia, the car was originally sold in January 1910. (Sorry but I don't have the Bruce's black book in handy to provide the exact date.)

Doing a quick Google search, I found out that the owner Samuel Gibeau was a very prominent and accomplished businessman in Red Lake County and was involved in a number of endeavors including banking, commerce and government. In 1912 he was elected Vice President of the Minnesota State Automobile Association (note the "AAA" badge on the radiator).

To Kim Dobbins: thought you'd be especially interested in this. Feel free to pass it along to cousin Ken.

To Bernard Paulsen: you had mentioned on another post with a period photograph what a real Model T Ford should look like. Because the 1910 Ford in this photo has a Minnesota 1912-13-14 license plate, the car is at least two years old yet the brass has been polished/maintained and the car is quite clean and presentable. Some owners actually washed and polished their cars including the brass 100 years ago (or hired someone to do it for them).

Note that the bulb for the horn is missing.

1


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Tuesday, May 15, 2012 - 10:56 pm:

Here is another view of the same car.

However, there is no license plate on the windshield filler board. This indicates that the photo was probably taken in 1910 or 1911 as Minnesota required only one plate to be displayed on rear of the car in those two years. (In 1910, Minnesota plates were originally issued in pairs, then as singles and in 1911 only singles were issued).

Also note that it is the same two women but their headwear is not the same as the prior photo. Also notice the absence of the AAA emblem on the radiator.
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Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rob Heyen - Nebraska on Tuesday, May 15, 2012 - 11:06 pm:

Erik,

Great pics. Do you think the chains/covers on the tires (all four in the first pic, only on the fronts in the second photo) are to protect the tire or are chains?

Thanks for posting,

Rob


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Tuesday, May 15, 2012 - 11:12 pm:

They appear to be studded booties, not chains.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bernard Paulsen, San Buenaventura, Calif on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 01:04 am:

Agreed.
Exceptions confirm the rule.
Jay Leno's Model T ain't muddy either.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 01:21 am:

This is my unrestored '17 roadster. Not muddy or greasy (that's original paint with the exception of the radiator shell that I stole from my dad).

1917


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Craig Anderson, central Wisconsin on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 01:37 am:

^ Now THAT'S what I call a nice survivor!....... :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 01:47 am:

It looks nicer than it really is because I took the picture of the "good side" of the car with the camera lens toward the sun.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dane Hawley Near Melbourne Australia on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 06:21 am:

Erik, what a great job of research. I'm impressed, and the photos are terrific too.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alan George Long on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 06:47 am:

Rands even height windscreens??

It seems that the 1910's had Rands even, uneven and Merzer screens?

Alan in Western Australia


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 07:13 am:

Eric,

Great photos! Thanks so much for sharing your research. It helps date the two bolt front body mount (horn tubing is between the top and bottom bolt) that the car has showing in the first photo. From Bruce’s shipping invoice listing on page 486 and also in his CD – the car most likely would have been manufactured around the end of Jan or first week in Feb 1910.

15,400 was manufactured Jan 26, 1910
15,500 was manufactured Jan 31, 1910
15,517 was manufactured Feb 1, 1910
15,600 was manufactured Jan 31, 1910
15,667 was manufactured Feb 1, 1910

It is amazing the details that can be put together if the information survived and is still available. Again thank you for sharing the information!

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By A. Gustaf Bryngelson on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 10:12 am:

Hey Rob, the studded booties would be for traction, it is not uncommon to put chains on the steering axle of a rear wheel drive vehicle to keep the front wheels turning in slick muddy conditions, it improves steering and reduces power needed to push through the mud.
Best
Gus


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kim Dobbins on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 11:13 am:

Thanks Eric, That is a great picture. Looks like they removed the ford script and add something else to the radiator in the second picture.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kim Dobbins on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 11:16 am:

Also great job on the research Eric. I with Wisconsin had those kind of records available. I could easily tell who was the original owner of my 10 Touring if they did.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 01:44 pm:

The non-Ford script logo is an AAA badge (American Automobile Association).

In 1912, the owner was elected vice president of the Minnesota State Automobile Association which was affiliated with the AAA.

My dad also collects early AAA badges for Minnesota like the one in the photo (they usually have the town engraved on them).


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bernard Paulsen, San Buenaventura, Calif on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 01:53 pm:

Great looking car Erik!

To get your radiator shell to match, wet-sand with 2000, grit, then follow up with 2500 grit, nothing coarser! "Massage in" Mother's aluminum wheel polish, wipe off, walk away.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Baker on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 02:25 pm:

Erik,

Great pictures,what can you tell use about the AAA Badges I have a Minnesota Badge with Kenyon my town, always wanted more information on them.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 03:08 pm:

Bernard: I have a shell with original paint hanging in the garage but it is missing the apron. (My car had an accessory nickel plated shell and honeycomb radiator but they were so bad removed them).

David: Regarding AAA badges, you'd need to discuss that with my father as I am not up on that information. (I remember that we met and had a fun conversation with you at Mark Cameron's place last fall.)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alan George Long on Thursday, May 17, 2012 - 08:10 am:

Hi Erik

Could you possibly send me a higher resolution of both of those 1910's ?? Would be much appreciated. Note the gas hose through the valance panel

Alan in Western Australia


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