Hi Guys,
I'm trying to replace the rear leaf spring bushings on my 16 touring. I had to pound out the old ones from the leaf spring and pound in the new ones. There is no way I'll be able to get these into the perches - without a lot of hammering - and I don't think the u bolts will fit once they're in. What am I missing here??
Thanks,
Michael
just ordered the drill bit to drill out the correct holes for the u bolts. still wondering how to install the bushings into the perches????
Push them in with a vise, after taking off the spring is the easiest.
John ...I have them in the spring. It's getting them into the perches I'm worried about.
Michael
Use a big C-clamp.
Use a bolt and nut to pull them in. A 5" bolt, with a washer under the head, then the bush and then put the bolt through the perch. As you do the nut up the bush will be pulled into the perch. No pounding damage! If/when you run out of thread, put some more washers on and go again.
Hope this helps.
Allan from down under.
It's getting the old ones out that's been more of a problem for me - but after cutting the old bushings with a hack saw blade in one or two places they are much easier to pound out.
Thanks guys - I'll give both ideas a try. BTW, this reamer/drill the vendors sell. What is the size of the drill bit? - guess I could just pick one up locally rather than order it????
Michale
The vendor reamer is a china 14.5mm twist drill, with 1/2 shank to fit a power drill.
Size is good for new or NOS shackles, if your hangers are worn and undersized, a smaller dia. drill would be better to help make the fit less wiggly.
I've noticed that the steel in the modern replacement bushings is not near as hard as the originals. Don' know about the shackle pins as I don' think I've got any originals.
Thanks guys...how so these get lubricated? I see on the front perches an oil port.
Is it worth buying new u bolts?
The port hole in the perch, and the main leaf is for a spring loaded flip top oiler.
Oil can these oilers every 200 miles
Dan...My rear perches don't have holes for oilers. I guess the oil goes in through the rear of the u bold and finds it's way into and around the bushing as I look at it. Funny, my front perches do have the oilers.
Michael
Oops, forgot your T is a '16.
The shackles or hangers on the early cars have the oilers in them. A U shape shackle is later, your T should have early type hangers with built-in oiler fittings.
The front perches on your '16 must have been changed to later ones.
Early Mae West type, and a modified later perch, but shows the brass oiler fittings used in '15-'16 type hangers.
Dan...now i'm confused. So, my front perches should look like the photo you posted? And, what about the rear?
My front perches have u bolts and oilers at he top. Is that not correct for a 16?
I believe I have a set of brass oiler fittings - sort of bought them by accident.
Michael,
The style in Dan's picture of the grey front axle is what you should have on a 1916 model year car.
Here is the list of changes from the encyclopedia section of this web site:
OILERS
(Front axle tie rods, etc.)
11-20-07 T218 screw-in brass oiler adopted.
07-11-11 T283 steering spindle connecting rod oiler, two required
11-19-12 Design changed from Bowen 4-N to Zerk oilers.
03-07-13 Changed back to Bowen 4-N design.
01-08-14 Drawing changed to note that the same oiler was being used for T267 front and rear spring hangers and T283 spindle connecting rod oilers.
07-24-14 Spindle bolt redesigned to incorporate a built-in oiler
07-16-15 Spring hangers redesigned with an oiler in the perch and in the lower hanger.
07-11-16 Oilers removed from the hangers and press-in oilers added to the perches. (There was considerable overlap in production with combinations of old and new types being used.)
09-06-16 “Brought drawing up to date with oilers as they are being made by changing the design from 4N Bowen. The new type was the Winkley.
09-30-16 T2944 spring oilers. These were used on the springs, replacing the hanger oilers. They were Winkley 1-G “Special Winkley Oiler.” They appear to have a spring-loaded ball as a “door.” Push the ball down to add the oil and then the ball seals the hole. They were zinc plated.
11-29-16 Changed from the above Winkley to the man-hole style, also made by Winkley, and were initially raven finished but later Zinc coated. This oiler was also used on the commutator.
12-13-16 Changed to Winkley oiler #3, Style R.
02-08-17 This same oiler now used on the spindle bolts.
03-15-18 No longer used on the commutator.
07-03-19 A larger oiler was now used on the spindle bolts.
08-07-19 This larger oiler was also used on the tie rod bolts.
04-03-22 T2944-A3 “flip top” oiler now specified. These were made by Bowen and were zinc plated, and were used until the end of Model T production.
Michael -- The perches in Dan's picture of the gray front axle are 1919 and later perches. A 1916 perch should have holes through it for the wishbone to mount into. The shackles and oilers in Dan's picture are the type you should have.
All...for some reason, I'm still a bit confused. Please excuse my ignorance. I'm trying to get this correct. I've included photos of what I have and what I took off the car (16 touring) if something else is correct or an improvement, I'd rather use. Especially in light of the recent thread of tragic accident.
Also, I realize that I have the u-bolt on in the wrong direction.
Michael
The 'proper' perch and spring hangers (shackles) for a '13-'18 should be the 'figure eight' shackle with oiler hole, using brass oilers screwed into the each opposite face of the hanger.
The perches should not have oiler holes.
Your front perch is the '17--'19 style with oiler hole
Your rear perch seems correct.
Your hanger in the first photo, the U style is for '23-'27.
Your 2nd photo hanger is not Model T.
Another easy way to install bushings is to put a piece of large threaded rod through the bushing and perch with washers and nuts on both ends, and tighten them to press the bushing in.
so with the 16 touring, is this what I need to be 'correct"? http://www.modeltford.com/item/3813-40B.aspx
And, these to go with them: http://www.modeltford.com/item/2718SA.aspx
would I need the brass oilers on the front and rear?
Sorry to seem so ignorant here...but I am.
Michael
Michael
Worry none...in the Model T world, parts can be right&wrong for any particular model year. The many branches assembling cars used transitional parts, so you can have a mismatch of parts and still be correct for your T.
Here is the club encly on shackles.
http://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/S-T.htm#sprshk
The 'Figure 8' shown in your post would be correct, but at some time in 1916 the perches with oiler hole showed up, so those would use the 2-piece riveted type shackle.
The famous Rip Van Winkle 1917 in Bruce's big book is of that era, front and rear perches and hangers aren't matched.
So your '16 could have the oiler perch up front, esp if the main leaf in front has the oiler hole, that would mean the type shackle should be without oilers, as the leaf spring and perch would have the cup oilers.
Your rear spring main leaf may not have an oiler hole in the leaf, and that would mate with the non-oiler perch now in place, so that the shackles or hangers would need to be the Figure 8 with the brass oilers in the opposite arms of those hangers.
Hope this is clear?
Thanks Dan..I 'think' I'm getting it.
Actually, I had to order a new main leaf, because a couple of the springs on the old one were broken.
The new main leaf doesn't have any oiler holes. So, I think at this point, my plan will be to order the figure 8 shackles for front and back: http://www.modeltford.com/item/3813-40B.aspx
and then add the brass oilers to them :http://www.modeltford.com/item/3817.aspx
I guess I'll just put a couple oilers in the holes that are on the front perches as well...otherwise they will just be open.
One last question....there are holes in the bushings. do they need to line up with the holes in the perches, or with the addition of the threaded brass oilers it wouldn't matter?
Thanks so much for all your patience.
Michael
Gals to help, you got the idea now.....
The bushings have holes to align with the holes in the perch, that way the oil goes into the oiler cap, thru the perch hole and into the hole in the bushing to run oil around the shackle.
Your main leaf did look new, so that is correct for shackles with oilers. If you wanted to 'look authentic' on the front perch that now has that hole, you can fill it with something, solder, JB weld, ect, and paint over, no one would know, that would disguise the later perch.
What the goal is to match the shackle (spring hanger) type with the type of perch and main leaf. Lubrication means is different between the styles.
One way to get them in....
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bruckzone/4353656312/
Erich's picture is about like mine would be if I had a picture.
I would like to point out the shackle in the photo that Dan posted is in backwards!
Larry...what is backwards about it?
Thanks Larry
You do point out the errors...should have known better, the 'bust' up and 'hips' down on Mae West
Correct shackles on this real nice '09