Using the spoke press (with a couple of adaptations}

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2012: Using the spoke press (with a couple of adaptations}
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 09:05 pm:

Yesterday I used the Regan spoke press for the first time to squeeze a wheel together. It worked very well, but today when I did the second wheel I added a couple of things to the basic design to make it even better.


To keep the felloe from wandering out of position I drilled four holes in the top of the press and drove in lug bolts.

Yesterday I mentioned the difficulty of keeping the "spoke tepee" in place. One suggestion posted was balloons under the spokes. Another was a paper cup to hold up the spokes. I went with the second idea, but with a change. Instead of a paper cup, I made a 6.5" stiff paper cylinder with a cardboard disk on top of it.






The disk stayed on the hub to hold up the spokes, and the cylinder was under it to make sure it didn't slide down.


The disk worked perfectly to hold up the spokes.


When it came to putting in the last couple of spokes, the disk made it easy to lift the hub and put them in without dropping any of the other spokes.


A little grease on the post is a good idea.


With the post greased and the paper cylinder removed, it was a simple thing to run down the bottom nut and turn the top nut to press the spokes into place.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Hoshield on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 10:02 pm:

Nice job, as always, Steve! Man, is it ALWays 98+ degrees there??? LOL
Who takes the pictures that you are in? .. or timer? Your informational posts are always clear and concise.

Best regards,
Dennis


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 10:13 pm:

Dennis, you guys up there in the frozen tundra are missing all the fun. Today's high was 104º, and the forecast for the next three days shows 107º, 109º, and 108º. But by next weekend we're supposed to cool down to 100º. This is the time of year when I bed down on the front porch swing in the evening to catch a little breeze.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Cole ---- Earth on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 10:40 pm:

Thanks Steve for posting.
I just bought a piece of 1 inch fine thread rod and 4 nuts to make a spoke press for my TT wheels.I will probably post a thread later on in august with some questions after I get stuff blasted and painted


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Friday, July 27, 2012 - 11:44 pm:

Here's the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKZ7WrfHdf8&list=UUFVx528ORtpDgCPJXbFCA6w&index=1 &feature=plpp_video.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Matthiesen on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 12:25 am:

Steve - thanks for your great posts. As a newbie, I have learned soooo much from you and look forward to learning more in the future.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Lovejoy, So Cal on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 12:37 am:

Very cool, I am doing the same thing Mack. I think we are going to need a bigger press :-) The back spokes on my TT were really in there tight!I am trying to use my old spokes again in the back. The fronts were shot and I had to git new ones.The back ones are weather beaten big time, but are tight and look as strong as ever.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Hjortnaes, Men Falls, WI on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 01:53 am:

John Regan would be proud!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 02:50 am:

Beautiful wheel and press. Excellent work as always. I wish I could get a picture right now of my spoke press. It looks nothing like yours (I used old scrap lumber and didn't even clean it up), but it worked great!
Thank you for the wonderful as always posting!
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry Lewin - Shingle Springs, CA on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 08:41 am:

Steve, I see in the video that the hub wants to turn when you first start to press in the spokes. How do you adjust the spokes to line up with the holes in the hub before you drill for the hub bolts?l


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John F. Regan on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 09:16 am:

I never argue with a system that works but many folks kinda miss part of the spoke press concept. There are many ways to press the hub down that all work - Fat lady sitting on it - bumper jack under the axle of a big tuck - house leveling jack under a basement steel beam... While holding the felloe in place works if you then figure out a way to hold the spokes with the hub flopping around, the idea is that the hub is NOT flopping around. It is held firmly in place via a nut above and below the hub. Thus is cannot flop around. The spokes as they are inserted will scoot the felloe as needed to center the fellow below the hub. Holding the hub firmly in mid air at just the right height prevents the spokes from tumbling. Once they are all in place and you have determined that height, it is easy to repeat it by simply measuring how high the hub spoke surface is above the floor of the press. If you hold the felloe from turning then you have to deal with the hub flopping around but whatever works the best for you is fine by me :-). The final product is all that really matters.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 09:53 am:

Jerry, the video doesn't show it, but if the hub starts to turn you loosen the nut until you can turn it back, then hold it so it won't turn again as you tighten. Now that I've done a couple of wheels I know that I need to hold it in place at the start until it's too tight to turn.

John, I added the holes and lug bolts because the slightest movement of the felloe caused most of the spokes to drop. After others suggested something underneath to keep the spokes from falling, I hit upon the idea of the corrugated collar pressed onto the hub. That worked so well that I probably could have left the felloe free to slide. I'll try it on the next wheel and see how it goes.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Patrick on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 10:50 am:

I saw in a past thread the suggestion to use a large styrofoam cup trimmed to the correct height which holds the tepee in place until the spokes are held in place by the upper hub pressure.

When I did mine I found that the most important thing was to not get in a hurry and tighten down with very small turns making sure to align the spoke edges with eachother after each incremental turn of the nut, until reaching a point whereby they can no longer be adjusted by hand due to the pressure.
After reaching the point where the spokes cannot be adjusted by hand, if they are not perfectly straight and aligned, or the hub is not vertically positioned, back off and do it again, because if the hub is not perfectly straight, or the spokes are twisted and uneven and you continue, you will wind up with a crooked hub and a very bad wobble. Jim Patrick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Zahorik on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 11:00 am:

Steve, looks like you are getting great results. A couple guys here in Wisconsin (It's a little cooler here) are also pressing spokes. The Regan is working excellent here also. I also have trouble with the initial tee pee, and may try your method. When you use the paper cylinder are you using the bottom nut on the hub? Just to compare notes this is my method.
1. Set the hub at about 8" above the inside floor of the press. The hub is pinch between the two nuts. By the way a friend of mine purchase a length of ACME threaded rod to use as the screw.



2. Then center the wheel rim by using opposite spokes. I have not had any trouble with the rim moving around. Once a little pressure was on it, it stayed put. I also used some old carpet instead of padding. Sorry John. Once centered the Tee Pee is started.



Here I am practicing with old spokes and some of them will fall out. Here is where your paper cylinder would really help out. I just left the tendon end lay on the press until starting to push on the press. Then you have to pay attention to keeping the tendons in the holes and make sure that the hub bolt holes are over the spoke joints.







3. Then slowly lower the hub by loosening the bottom nut and tightening the upper nut. All the time watching the tendons and the bolt holes so they stay in place. Also wiggle the spokes so they align as the hub comes down and to keep the spoke bevel close to the hub flange. I also found that a tap with dead blow hammer will also aide in influencing the spokes into place.

Another improvement or change we made was to insert a short section of pipe in the press to reduce the dimples the screw rod nuts make in the base wood. A little practice and this seems to work just fine.

Nice work Steve.

Mike


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Patrick on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 11:14 am:

Mike. I like the name you came up with to call the spoke press. "The Regan". Jim Patrick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 11:22 am:

Yep, still using the bottom nut to support the hub. It occurs to me that instead of using a paper cylinder to keep the cardboard collar on the hub, a little duct tape would serve the same purpose and I wouldn't have to remove anything to reach the lower nut. I'll have to do a revised video once I really get the hang of this.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 03:29 pm:

Steve,
What about a piece of PVC pipe cut to length, with a slot cut in one side big enough to slip over the threaded rod? (easy job on a table saw, but messy) If the disk were made of something ridged, it could also hold the hub up, then all you do is pull the pipe out, the disk falls down, and now you can start tightening the press?
Just some ideas off the top of my head without having done this yet!
T'
David D.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 04:17 pm:

I suspect the cardboard collar pressed onto the hub, maybe with a little duct tape to keep it in place, is the way to go. When you lift the hub a bit to insert that last spoke, the collar stays with the hub to keep the other spokes from dropping.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 05:09 pm:

Steve,
Ah, I see the idea--good point. I was also trying to avoid the nut underneath that has to be loosened.
I'll be watching, 'cause someday, I'll have to be dong this too!
T'
David D.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Patrick on Saturday, July 28, 2012 - 05:19 pm:

I did mine without the nut underneath. It is most important to take your time and make incremental adjustments by pulling each spoke up tight against the underside of the hub and twisting each spoke straight, whenever it starts twist and making sure each tenon is centered in the hole. It requires constant inspection of each spoke throughout the entire process. Jim Patrick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John F. Regan on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 09:00 am:

Jim Patrick has it correct to stress the importance of getting all the spokes up tight against the bottom of the hub before pressing the spokes "home".

Mike:

In your second picture above the hub is way higher than when I did mine since there is even a visible gap between the top of the spokes and the underside of the hub surface where the spokes will eventually sit. If that works for you - no problem but I think the spokes will tumble and with that method I can see why you need something underneath. Having said that - go with whatever works for you and produces a good straight wheel.

Carpet or rubber makes no difference so long as it is cheap. It is absolutely wrong and not in the spirit of the Model T hobby to have paid more than $20 for your press materials :-)

It is rewarding to me that so many of you guys are doing your own wheels and the knowledge base is growing on various techniques and ideas on methods of assembling a T wheel.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Zahorik on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 09:25 am:

Yes, I start it high but as Jim states lower the hub slowly and adjust the spokes a lot, watching the tendons, the bolt holes and the fit of the spokes at the top. There is a lot of adjustment while the Teepee is still loose. The real press beginnings once the spokes start to tighten up. Then either have everything right or back out and start again.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 09:40 am:

John, you know I'm Mister Thrifty. My carpet padding was free scraps and my 4 x 4 was out of my lumber scrap pile. But it's no longer possible to buy the materials to make the press for under $20 since they started making plywood and pipe fittings out of gold.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By michael grady on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 11:16 am:

Steve...

I saw your post a while back where you had the spokes hanging from that piece of farm equipment to dry. Can you elaborate on how you cleaned them up? Did you just hand sand each one by holding it with your other hand?

Is there a link to the "Reagan"

Thanks,

Michael


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By michael grady on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 11:17 am:

PS...
Steve..how did you finish the fellos?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Cascisa - Poulsbo, Washington on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 11:54 am:

I am sure "Mr. Thrifty (also known as For Free Franky Frugal)" would agree that a good place to find scrap hardwoods and plywood is in the the "Pallet Pile" behind many businesses. A lot of good usable wood goes to the dump from these piles.

Here is the link to the "Reagan Press"

http://www.funprojects.com/pdf/WheelpressA2.pdf

Be_Zero_Be


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 01:38 pm:

Michael, the spokes were new, from Stutzman's. All I had to do was prime and sand, prime and sand, then paint. Yep, hand held.

After the felloes were sandblasted, the process was prime and wet sand, prime and wet sand, prime and wet sand, all with 220, until the worst of the pits were filled, then prime and wet sand with 600, then paint. The paint was rattle cans of appliance epoxy enamel from Ace Hardware. Rustoleum makes it too, but none of the stores here in Podunk carry the Rustoleum version in black.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Harold Schwendeman - Sumner,WA on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 03:44 pm:

Steve - That "prime and wet sand, prime and wet sand, prime and.....etc, etc," is the reason I made that comment on the forum the other day that your finished spokes reminded me of the pictures of the black metal ones I saw on the forum awhile back. You're getting to be known as a "T" guy that NEVER does just a half a$$ed job of anything Steve! And by the way, you made a comment that I just saw someplace on the forum today that made me feel pretty old! You mentioned something about,......"in 1951 when you were 10"! Well, I was also born in 1941 and I don't have half the energy (or skill) that you have! Sheeesh,......slow down a bit and start acting your age, will ya'?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 05:12 pm:

Heck no! I don't have time for that.

I may have inherited some of Dad's perfectionistic tendencies. When he built a house Mom claimed that he took time to sand the studs. She may have been exaggerating a little bit.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Patrick on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 05:37 pm:

I'm sure others have noticed by the thermostat on the tree that you're not even breaking a sweat in 99 degree weather.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Sunday, July 29, 2012 - 08:35 pm:

But as the saying goes, it's a dry heat. It's so dry that even the weeds are dying. The other day a single raindrop fell out of a passing cloud and struck a local guy in the face. He fainted from the shock and we had to throw a bucket of dust in his face to revive him.


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