Improved model Fan off water outlet housing

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2012: Improved model Fan off water outlet housing
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Hoshield on Monday, August 06, 2012 - 08:19 pm:

I don't remember seeing photos of anyone having a fan pulley off the water outlet housing. Seems like it wouldn't be a good idea, as far as strength .. but getting the fan a bit higher .. would have also allowed for a larger fan diameter.

Is it beneficial to go the 'improved model' way ... or just not worth it?

Mine are pretty doggy looking. Towards the end of the 'season', I might pull it off and see what they look like after cleaning, but they certainly feel flimsy.
Fan-Driver's side

Fan-Passenger's Side

I sold 2 sets of fans, support arm and pulleys, along with a bunch of other piece parts, after I first brought the T 'home'. Just didn't have room for all the stuff. Looking back at the photos ... one of the fans was in really nice shape!

Space wise, and pound foolish, I guess ..

Dennis


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Monday, August 06, 2012 - 08:23 pm:

What you have there is a combination Ford never put together. You have an early (1912 - 16 perhaps)fan pulley and a large crank pulley. So the fan is probably turning double the normal speed. The water pump of course is not going to help anything.

If that was my car I would find the proper 1917 - 25 fan and pulley, and trash the water pump.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Monday, August 06, 2012 - 08:45 pm:

My 1923 Fordor came with some 26-27 parts on it, including the fan pulley. I suppose they work just as well, but I'm going back to the proper 1923 parts because a 1923 car should look the part. As much as possible, the parts on a car should be right for the year. But it's a free country. I'm not going to lose any sleep over all the Johnny Cash cars.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Hoshield on Monday, August 06, 2012 - 09:22 pm:

Wonderful .... well ... add a couple more pieces to the shopping list! :-) That's what I'm here for! Looks like the arm is correct, though, eh? It's straight, not with the 'bent' end like the earlier ones .. and doesn't appear to be brass, although I've not tried taking it off to clean yet, either. It'll probably need bushing, shaft, blades, etc etc....

That's going to add up, so will probably have to wait a bit. Gotta prioritize these things, don't ya know .... I would think the blade spinning a bit too fast won't hurt anything .. short of shortening the life of the bushing, etc.

The fan did seem a bit wimpy for the job at hand.

I've been on the lookout of a lower water housing, so I can indeed get rid of the pump. Well .. duh ... I just realized ... I HAVE one, on the spare engine. It's a 19-20 or so engine, but as long as it's not a '16 or before, it should be fine then? Might as well replace the hoses while I'm at it.

But to answer my initial question ... did the upper fan mount catch on, a dismal failure, or ??? Looks like raising the fan's center point, they could have increased the diameter of the blade by an inch or two.

Thanks,
Dennis


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Monday, August 06, 2012 - 09:59 pm:

There was no catching on or failure for the outlet-mounted fan pulley. It was just part of the Model T for 1926-1927, like the engine-mounted coil box or the headlight bar. Not necessarily better or worse, just different. Now watch. Somebody will explain why it was a big improvement.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rick Goelz-Knoxville,TN on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 09:58 am:

My 24 has the 26/27 outlet but it came to me like that and since it works i am not going to change it and since i have 26 i need only carry one fan belt for both cars.

Rick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Hoshield on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 10:32 am:

Rick,
Does it us the same size fan as the pre '26's??


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rick Goelz-Knoxville,TN on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 10:46 am:

Dennis, i don't know, the fan bolts directly to the pulley.

Rick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale L Myers on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 11:25 am:

With two current threads about fan brackets I'm not sure which one to post this in.
This is the fan & bracket on my October 1925 built 1926 roadster. Is it possible this is original?
My May built 1926 Tudor had an early style water outlet mounted bracket which I broke when I tried to adjust it without knowing how to do it properly. The later style outlet mounted bracket is more idiot proof.
Please ignore the water pump.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 11:40 am:

My july 27 1925 engine (first day of the 1926 type) has the first version of the water outlet fan bracket. They were prone to break and was redesigned by Ford later, so it's likely your october engine also had one of them that broke sometime in the past - and an earlier type was mounted instead. If it works, no need to change. I would pull the fan belt and check if the car will run cool enough w/o the fan - if it works, you'll have more available power and won't risk a flying fan blade through the radiator. If a parade comes up or if you're getting stuck in traffic you can pull to the side and put the fan belt back :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 11:45 am:

Oh, I see you also have a water pump - likely the thin two row radiator Ford put on the "improved" car to save money - no gain in pulling the fan belt then, ok, you can try if it'll cool w/o the water pump first and if not think about a recore or a new radiator..


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale L Myers on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 04:59 pm:

I had suspected it was a replacement but it seems to me it would have been easier to replace the broken outlet mounted one.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 06:39 pm:

if it broke during the depression in the thirties they could get a replacement in the back lot of any garage (or field..), perhaps parts from an older type was available for free while the correct type cost money. Then the choice was easy..


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Hoshield on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 07:17 pm:

My radiator is a 3 core .. and the water outlet is indeed a different color than the head and block. So .. it's certainly possi

ble it had the higher fan assembly, originally. My question was more of curiosity. To me .. without a substantially beefed up outlet housing, to hold the fan assembly, I would think it would be a poor structural design. I did see a beefier designed one in Snyder's or Langs. Most likely, they didn't increase the diameter of the fan, which it seems like a higher location on the radiator would allow.

In any case ... I'll 'update', by removing the water pump, and eventually installing a correct fan assembly, and sorting out the fan belt, accordingly.

Thanks, all!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Richard Bennett on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 08:00 pm:

Dennis, I can't see where you tell us what year car yours is. The fan you have is a 16-20 model with iron fan hub. The earlier ones were similar but had a brass hub. The arm is 16-26, prior to the two types mounted on the top outlet.
The later fans had an aluminium hub with four screws holding the blades to it. I have seen two types of blades. The earlier ones have tapered blades while later ones have parallel sides and reinforcing ribs pressed into the centre. I do not know when the later style was introduced.

Hope this helps.

Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Hoshield on Tuesday, August 07, 2012 - 08:34 pm:

Allan ...

Theoretically, it's a '24. I think someone corrected me some time back, based on my engine number ... 10586936.

I've seen 'skinny' blades, and 'fat blades'...
I 'HAD' (but sold along with a bunch of parts, when I first brought the car 'home' ...) ... both:
http://youraccordion.com/images/ForSale/index.php?pic=Lot5-Misc-4F.jpg

http://youraccordion.com/images/ForSale/index.php?pic=Lot5-Misc-4R.jpg

I sent an e-mail to the guy I sold them to, to see if I could by the green one back! :-) He took the whole pile .. and may not have needed the blades.

So far .. it appears the arm might be correct, but not so much on the rest.

Dennis


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Richard Bennett on Wednesday, August 08, 2012 - 10:27 pm:

Dennis, the red fan is the one more familiar to me. I believe it predates the green one, but when the change was made I have no idea. They are prone to cracking near the hub, but being reasonably plentiful here, good replacements can be found. The ones the vendors sell are like the green one. I presume the pressed in grooves are to strengthen the blades at the hub.

Allan from down under.


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