Crank alignment to Crankshaft

Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration
Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2012: Crank alignment to Crankshaft
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 09:08 am:

I had this crankcase aligned professionally, but somehow they missed the hand crank hole alignment in the nose piece. The bushing is not sloppy. The end of the crank contacts the end of the crankshaft about 1/4" below center. Of course, the crankcase is all bolted up and sealed to the block with Right Stuff. The fourth main aligns good.

I know the nose can be heated and bent or unbent so the shafts will line up, but I don't have a torch. The engine is still on the engine rotisserie, so I can't apply a lot of pressure. I did try a cold bend using an overhead chain fall, but its tie to the rafters is not rigid enough.

If I get my rocket scientist neighbor to bring his torch, how much heat should it take, and will that weaken the nose?

rdr


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 11:19 am:

Heating the nose could melt the solder around the front dam.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 11:36 am:

Ralph
How often do you actually use the crank?

I wouldn't really want to try straightening/adjusting it in place.

It wouldn't surprise me if it was like that from new. A off centre bushing would probably fix it (maybe)

But I will come back to my original comment. As I recall you have electric start?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Charlie B actually in Toms River N.J. on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 11:45 am:

I like the off center bushing idea myself. Especially since it's buttoned up pan wise. I have to admit though 1/4" seems like a lot. If it were me I'd like the crank to work too. After all that's what it's there for on a starter car. "Just in case"!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 01:33 pm:

Les, with this sidedraft early Winfield, I do cold starts with the electric commencer. After that it's the crank. Besides, what would a T be without a crank?

Here's from an email:

Use a cutting torch tip and heat it up red just past the part that fits in the spring mount and then put a rod in the hole and tweak it. Heat it quick and get out of there- you don't want to melt the solder in the front dam.- if you do, JB Weld on a clean surface will hold forever, but try not to need that.

The cutting torch tip is much more concentrated a flame than a rosebud- that area just behind the little spool shaped part is easy to heat up quick- keep some wet towels handy to cool the bigger part of the pan- funny, all KRW pan jugs have a way to check the crank hole- oh well.

Good luck

xx
------------

I took the lazy way, and hogged the sleeve at an angle with a 3/4" bit in my big 'ol drill motor. It works now.

Thanks, all.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gene Carrothers Huntington Beach on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 01:46 pm:

Wow, RDR Never heard of that one... I know your crank worked before teardown. I would not heat the nose for fear of compromising the brazed joint. The offset bushing is a good idea but I think the wall is too thin to help much? Since you can't get any leverage on the snout what about trying to align it a little better after its mounted in the car. Seems like a worn out bushing might allow the crank to engage easier.

Give me a holler and I'll come to give it a look and my opin for what that's worth.

With some thought, I do think its possible to heat the snout at the very front but it would have to be done by someone with experience.. If you know what I mean. A quick high heat to the front very narrow area and a some wet rags to limit the heat to the brazed area might work. Still think I would have it bolted in the car to limit the engine moving around.

I have a rig with the right torch, neighbor??


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Garnet on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 01:53 pm:

Ream it out off-center and nobody will be the wiser!

Garnet


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 01:55 pm:

Our posts must have crossed, Gene. This is a nicer pan than the one that was on the car before - after all we went to dimpling that one. This project is going much too sloow, giving me too much time to change my mind.

You can come over and point and giggle most any time. I'm done with most of your tools...

rdr


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 01:56 pm:

I was going to recommend a large, sharp, rat-tail file. With that you could carefully cut only the offending side to make it work. That much slop should not hurt anything.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kohnke Rebabbitting on Saturday, September 01, 2012 - 02:02 pm:

Take your pan off, and fix it right, don't Cobble it, you will never be at ease with it.

You cobble junk, it will always be Junk, no pride in that.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Tomaso - Milton,WA on Sunday, September 02, 2012 - 12:03 pm:

Ralph,

You stated that you had the crankcase "aligned professionally" - NOT SO if "they missed the crank hole alignment in the nose piece". The crankcase correctly aligned on a KRW pan jig or similar device would be in alignment front to back, side to side and flat. The KRW pan jig's first procedure is to replace that sleeve in the nose of the pan. I would have to agree with Herman that the crankcase should be rechecked but maybe not by the "professional" that did it the first time - just an opinion.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Harold Schwendeman - Sumner,WA on Sunday, September 02, 2012 - 12:59 pm:

Ralph - Not that this would help, but you said,..." The end of the crank contacts the end of the crankshaft about 1/4" below center".

That sounds to me like maybe the engine got dropped in handling rather than the engine rebuilder "missing" crank hole misalignment. The nose piece receiving a sharp blow at bottom front as it would if if fell could have bent it, or, if the crank was in place during handling of the engine, the crank striking something if the engine fell would be even more likely to cause such misalignment, unknown to anybody at the time. Wonder how much "handling" the engine got between the rebuilder and you taking possession of it,...???

Somebody mentioned dealing with the problem AFTER the engine is installed. It might make sense to see how far out of alignment the crank is after you tighten the two cap screws that retains the crank bushing in that little "saddle" in the front engine mount. After complete assembly, there are a lot of forces exerted upon the front crossmember from front spring, wishbone, engine mount, and the two big castle nuts that retain the front spring & engine mount. Might be that the misalignment could become much less than 1/4" and make a bit of "reaming" of the bushing seem like a more feasible "fix". For what it's worth,......harold


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Sunday, September 02, 2012 - 02:44 pm:

I think its an angle alignment problem. If so put a solid rod in the crank hole and using a long piece of pipe, see if you can bend the pan enough to line things up.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Sunday, September 02, 2012 - 03:26 pm:

If you do what Ted suggests, be sure to take out the two cap screws which hold the cap on the front motor mount so you don't break the motor mount.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Tomaso - Milton,WA on Sunday, September 02, 2012 - 04:53 pm:

Ted,

That is why the first step in the KRW process to straightening the crankcase is to install a new hand crank sleeve as there is a piece of round stock that locates the pan snout to the pan jig.


Posting is currently disabled in this topic. Contact your discussion moderator for more information.
Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration