Hole in the head - Low head search.

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2012: Hole in the head - Low head search.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Semprez-Templeton, CA on Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 09:12 pm:

We have been scrounging the neighborhood for a '16 low head all this week. (Last week too).

We have two low (1916) heads one with a crack through the combustion chamber, the other with a one inch freeze hole out the side between #3&4 on the carb. side. Any thoughts on repairing these?

Anyone know of a good one in Central California (Paso Robles area)? I do not have a picture of the cracked heads at this time but will post one later today... hopefully.

BTW how much should we pay for one if we find it? - John semprez and Bill Dodd


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 03:17 pm:

Combustion chamber cracks are tough. Between the explosive forces and the uneven heat and expansion issues, any repair would have to be very well done by someone with a lot of experience.
Water jacket cracks can often be repaired with JB Weld. I like it because it is a basically "do no harm" repair. No high heat, or warping, creating new stress areas. In the future, the epoxy can be removed fairly easily to clear the way for a better repair (unlike brazing).
I have been toying around with some cast iron welding and so far am pleased with some of my results. Somewhere, I have a high head with a combustion dome crack that I would like to weld just to see if it would work well.
I do not have any spare low heads. In fact, one I intend to use will require some welding (one of the reasons I am finally working on that). I saw one on eBad last night. So I just did a quick search for "model t ford low head" and got two results. One has a starting bid of $125. The other at $150. I think those are a bit high, but who knows? Some T parts are going up. Others have come down. Just for consideration.
Good luck!
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Val Soupios on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 04:06 pm:

Combustion chamber repairs can be done effectively. I had a jug off of a two cylinder Autocar that was cracked to the point where it came apart in three pieces. I had it repaired by a fellow who taught welding and specialized in cast iron welding. Twenty five years later and the Autocar is still running strong! I doubt that it would make sense to repair your low head however because the cost of a replacement would probably be less than the cost of the repair. I did not have that option. With respect to a water jacket repair however there are several epoxy options that all work well and it would certainly be worth giving it a shot.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 08:32 pm:

Is Jack Zerkel still doing cast iron welding? A good job can be done if set up correctly and done by a knowledgeable welder.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Gruber- Spanaway, Wash. on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 08:39 pm:

Someone on here suggested using Permatex "The Right Stuff" in a veed out water jacket crack repair.
Piece of shim stock over it.
I tried it over a year ago and it's still holding.
Obviously this is not for combustion chamber cracks, but the Right Stuff seems like a good product.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill in Adelaida Calif on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 12:44 am:

I don't know if Jack is still welding but I do have a neighbor that was taught to weld by Jack. Thanks for reminding me, I may have to try to drag him out of retirement.

Bill


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Gilham Bellflower Ca. on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 02:03 am:

OK, I'm pretty new to all this. In 4 years of buying and selling I've had a few heads and only sold one. Don't know if it was a high or low and still don't know the difference to this day by just looking. I have a head I'm looking at right now. Came with the truck I bought this past weekend. The engine in the truck dates to March 1920 by the serial#. If I'm looking at this thing right the little casting date reads 1 11 12. I looked in the encyclopedia on this site and the made in USA came out later in march, that would be a 3. Have a look at the pics. Is this what you are looking for?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 02:19 am:

Scott, see this thread for example: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/29/29852.html
John Sizemore's pictures describes the differences well:
heads
heads 2
Note the ridges around the spark plug holes in the combustion chambers in the low head.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale Peterson on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 02:25 am:

Scott, Definitely low head. High head is thicker, or taller so there is more water jacket volume for improved cooling. Combustion chamber is also shaped different (smaller) to give a little higher compression.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Gilham Bellflower Ca. on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 02:29 am:

I have a ridge around the combustion chamber but no boss around the plug. And is near 2 11/16" at the head bolt bosses.High Head.I'm learning....


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 08:09 am:

The head that came on my 1927 Ford appeared to have a 1 4 15 Casting Date. It is a high head. Those early date casting schemes must have been used in a different manner or for a different purpose later in life.

Date


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Semprez-Templeton, CA on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 03:59 pm:

Here is what we have...



Pic#1 shows head with combustion chamber crack. Pic #2 shows both heads one right has freeze damage. Pic#3 shows freeze damage again.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill in Adelaida Calif on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 04:52 pm:

Note the mold marks at the back. the 12 20 on one head and 2 22 on the other head. Not the same method as on the high leads.
The crack in the first picture has been highlited with a marking pen. This is the head pictured on the left in the second picture.

Bill


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 11:28 pm:

Now, I like my JB Weld. But, even I would not attempt to repair that with epoxy and expect it to hold for any significant driving. Both of them are candidates proper cast iron welding.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Craig Anderson, central Wisconsin on Saturday, September 22, 2012 - 12:18 am:

John........take a look there >>> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Model-T-Ford-Low-Head-1913-1917-/180973417750?pt=Vintage _Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a22db3516&vxp=mtr


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Randy Driscoll on Saturday, September 22, 2012 - 11:12 am:

A low head should measure about 2 1/16" thick at the bolt holes. I wouldn't pay top dollar for a head that was less than 2". I have had a couple of heads that the more I milled the more rotten spots were exposed. Gave up and found a better head. There are plenty of them out there. Don't buy one with evidence of rust or you might find you can't clean up the surface with out taking off way too much.


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