Slowly learning.....

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2012: Slowly learning.....
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Ragan on Sunday, October 14, 2012 - 01:44 pm:

I've had my '19 depot hack for about 2 months now and am slowly learning about owning/driving/maintaining a Model T. Yesterday morning I took it for its weekly trip to the town square and had a flat. The valve stem was sheared off. What could have caused that? Could air pressure have been so low that the tire/tube shifted on the wheel?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rob from Nova Scotia on Sunday, October 14, 2012 - 02:27 pm:

yup, thats exactly what happened. cost me a 20 dollar tube to learn that 55 psi means just that!!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Ragan on Sunday, October 14, 2012 - 03:18 pm:

The bad thing was I had just stopped at the local service station to check the air in my tires when I discovered the flat. There is a pressure gauge in my T's tool box now.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Susanne on Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 04:18 pm:

The original formula for clinchers was 20 PSI per inch of width (and I still follow that, BTW) - while it seems high by today's standard, it locked the bead to the rim, and modern Bike Tires (also made in Viet Nam) run pressures way in excess of that formula for the same reason.

The only T tube I've ever torn (and that one a brass stem) was when someone decided to inflate the tires to 40 PSI because, well, "60 and 70 are just too high"...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Garrison on Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 05:09 pm:

I checked all my tires and made sure they were at 55 lbs. At the end of a 75 mile run I had a flat tire. The valve stem was sheared off. I never had a problem with the tire leaking air a bit in the last year and a half.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 05:14 pm:

If you put the tube in and the tire on the rim with lube or powder, that stuff can stay there.

I mount clinchers dry, and have had them down to 20 psi without ripping the stem off.

rdr


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 08:16 pm:

Since my famous blowout in May, I've run my clinchers at 65 psi. So far so good.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Bohlen, Severn MD on Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 08:21 pm:

Hey Steve,

Did you ever find the tire?

Larry


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Thursday, October 18, 2012 - 08:30 pm:

Yep, the farmer found it when he cut the wheat. At first glance it looked OK, but it was cut by a sharp rim I won't be using again.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill dugger on Friday, October 19, 2012 - 11:05 am:

That sure was a nice wheat field that I saw near Steve's place. Mill that wheat and make a lot of bread

Bill D


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Garrison on Friday, October 19, 2012 - 11:16 am:

The tires have been on my car for as long as I've owned it. I've always maintained my air pressure at 55 psi because that's where most people including the manufacturers suggest they run. And yet I still sheared off a valve stem. When I took the tube out it was dry and clean. The only thing I saw that I didn't like was there were no flaps or anything even resembling a flap. Not even the magic Duct tape. But I don't think that would cause the valve stem to shear off. The only thing I can think of that happened is I must have punctured the tube and when the air pressure got low enough during the trip the tube slipped enough to shear the valve stem. Sorry about being so long winded.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Friday, October 19, 2012 - 09:39 pm:

55 PSI is too low, the tire will rotate on the rim at that low pressure. You need to run 65 PSI in 30 X 3 1/2 tires minimum. 60 is ok for 30 X 3 tires.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Saturday, October 20, 2012 - 12:57 am:

Model T people used to talk about rim cuts often. It was common advice to newcomers to check rims to make sure they were not sharp at all. I still worry to this day that I am not smoothing them enough.
So, Steve, how sharp was that rim?
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By keith g barrier on Saturday, October 20, 2012 - 07:02 am:

My Grandad owned one car in his life, a model T, after buying it he decided to take a trip to Florence Al to visit relatives. The distance was about 65 miles and took about 14 hours because of a bad clincher rim, they had 20 flats that day. After getting to Florence my eldest uncle and his buddy found a good rim and they made the return trip with only one flat on a different wheel. My uncle did all the driving, Granddad never learned how nor got out in that car again. The T was used that fall to run a pea thresher then was sold for ten dollars. KB


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker on Saturday, October 20, 2012 - 09:07 am:

Larry,

Several things can cause the valve stem to be cut. I checked but I did not see a photo of your depot hack on your profile page. One item that does not occur too often but is very predictable for cutting the valve stem is installing the wrong rim on the rear wheels. It will consistently cause the valve stem to be cut even if the clincher is inflated to the proper pressure. This might also occur on the front wheel – but is less likely because it is not used for stopping or transmitting the engine’s power to the ground.

“IF” you have demountable clincher rims on the rear and “IF” you have mounted a Ford supplied [manufactured by Firestone and also Cleveland] 2845C or 2845D rim onto a wheel/felloe that is designed for one of the other rims [Kelsey 2845, Hayes 2845, or Ford 2845B] you can easily cut the valve stem. Below information is from the Jan 1924 Ford Service Bulletins (available from the vendors in paper and electronic versions).





Mounting the 2845C or 2845D on the wrong wheel / felloe gives you a combination that does NOT have a positive mechanical lock to prevent the rim from rotating a little bit on the felloe. And it doesn't take a lot of rotation to cause a leak which will cause loss of air which will cause the rest of the problem. Or with a panic stop the valve stem is can also be cut when the rear wheels stops but the rim slips enough to slice the valve stem (or cause the leak that allows the tire to go flat and then turn on the rim). On the front wheels it sometimes works "ok" as there are no brakes etc. to cause the rim to move. If you have the fixed lug Hayes or Ford style 2845 or 2845B rims – that should not be an issue. But if you have the 2845C or 2845D lose lug rims recommend you read the posting at: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/131483.html also http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/80257/92314.html to get a better understanding of why the rim can rotate and then either obtain the correct wheel/felloe for the rim or more likely obtain the correct rim for the existing felloe that you have. In some cases it can be as simple as swapping the rims that you have on the car to another wheel that has the correct felloe. While NOT recommended by Ford – it appears from other MTFCA forum posting that you can modify just about any wheel / felloe to accept the fixed lug rims.

Another possible cause mentioned on a previous thread is sometimes the hole where the valve stem comes through the rim has rusted and become sharp. Be sure it is also smooth – from the posting at: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/172401.html?1290636407 .

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Saturday, October 20, 2012 - 11:54 am:


Wayne, I've seen plenty worse, but apparently it was sharp enough to do the job. I'm not sure low pressure wasn't a contributing factor. Getting a MIG welder and restoring rims is on my list of possible projects. There are a lot of them that would be good to use except for a few sharp inches.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Saturday, October 20, 2012 - 03:25 pm:

I have seen many a lot worse. I was taught to run a file around inside until it is smooth. I was told that you can take a lot off and the rim would still work fine, but I didn't believe it. I have a bunch of marginal rims that I think would wind up with not enough "clinch".
I use a Crescent Wrench to pull those dimples back up into line. Then I have a grinding disc on my bench grinder which gives me a better reach into the rim (and also likes to take chunks out of my fingers). I grind the edge until I get a smooth line about a sixteenth of an inch wide clear around the rim. That leaves a sharp edge all the way around. But now it only takes a couple minutes with a good rat-tail file to smooth the grinders edge. I have done eight rims this way in the past two weeks. I have about five more to do.
And I still worry that they may not be smooth enough.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


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