Hi Folks,
As a newbie,I would like to start by congradulating you all on a fine website and forum.Anyway my question is as follows:

I am an avid Ford collector and drive a European 1952 Ford E494a Anglia. I would like to expand my collection to a model T. I am looking for a '26 or '27 Tudor sedan(to carry the Mrs and little ones, gone are my roadster days). As regards condition, I would like a car that is very good shape, preferably restored or at least with reconditioned engine and running gear.I have no time to restore but I am used to maintaining old fords. What should I pay????

I have seen cars like this going for $8000 and for silly money ($30,000 Yikes!!).

Can someone with more T experience tell me what sounds appropriate? also does anyone recommend any dealer in particular?

Any help will be greatly appreciated,

Very best regards,
Shane de Barra.

P.S.- Matching numbers and originality doesn't matter much,as I want to drive the car (a lot).

Shane, I see from your profile that you are in Ireland. I wonder how much validity U.S. prices would have over there, or were you planning to buy a car in the U.S. and take it home?

There's a thread farther down the forum that offers a lot of good contacts in England. You might want to take a look at that.

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/29/22059.html?1166388023

I am living in Ireland but because the Euro is strong it is worth taking a trip to the US to pick up a nice T. The bigest factor isn't the money though, Our weather here is wet most of the year and damp the rest of it, so finding any decent cars is impossible unless imported. Also the classic scene over here is almost non-existant.(T's were made in Cork which is about 60 miles from my house but there are none around.

In short, English prices are to high for you get,and there are virtually no irish T's. So a trip in Febuary will find me a decent car with any luck.

By the way, I hope nobody is offended by the idea of exporting a T, I do not intend harvest cars or anything of the sort.

Best regards,
Shane de Barra.

Shane, anyone who likes and wants to continue to preserve and drive Model T's should have at least one, no matter where you live. A nice Tudor Sedan would probably be priced in the $8000 - $13,000 range. A very nice one, maybe $15,000 but I wouldn't go much higher.

Shane, maybe you're aware of this already but the MTFCI has a chapter in Ireland. Maybe those folks would be a good resource for you.

http://www.modelt.org/chapter/default.htm

Just click on the Irish flag on the left.

Shane, I have no trouble associating Model T's with Ireland. St. Louis has the second or third largest St Patrick's Day parade in the U.S. and our local Model T club has participated every year since the parade's inception 36 years ago. In 2000, it was snowing and I was the only one who made it all the way downtown to be in the parade. Our record remained intact, though!

Although you can't tell in the picture, under the raccoon coat I'm wearing a green sweater, white shirt and orange tie.

Hi Folks,
Thanks for the information Jerry, I was not aware of an Irish model T chapter, but I will check them out. As for the prices you suggest, they sound like pretty much what I had expected.

Nice picture Dick, your weather over there looks a bit more severe than ours on March 17th. Over here it just seems to rain and rain, not that you notice when your sipping a nice whiskey in front of the fire (mmmmmmm).

Thanks again to you both,

Best regards,
Shane de Barra.

Shane. I also can make a direct connection with Model T's and Ireland. Click on my profile and you will see an Ireland Model T. Dave.

http://www.bolandmotors.com/about.htm shows a photo of a 1912 Touring with text The Irish Model T Club was established by John Boland (our Managing Director) in 1990 and today has over 20 members.

Hi Shane,

Here is a 3+ year old pricing guide that Mr. Stewart created and is useful for thinking or as a reference.

Regards, Roland
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Model T Price List

Ignoring the impossibility of such a request, I submit my observations in the hope that they may provide some orientation to some uninitiated soul who would like some guidance without having to become an expert.

Model T Values - Thumbnail sketch, in United States 48 contiguous states as of Monday 10 March 2003:

Cars and original depot hacks and pie wagons 1917-27:
Parts car only, not restorable: <$1000 (Steve Braymen)
Not complete, restorable with a lot of work, engine may or may not run: $1,000 (Steve Braymen)
Mostly complete, correct, disassembled, restorable: $2,000.
Mostly complete, correct, recently assembled, restorable: $2,500.
Complete, correct, never disassembled, restorable: $3,500.
Runs, drives, correct, needs total restoration $4,500 (Steve Braymen)
Runs and drives, mostly correct, looks like a 10 year old used car: $6,000.
Everything works, not correct (wrong year engine, etc.), looks decent: $6,000.
Everything works, almost all correct, looks decent: $7,500.
Show room condition, correct, needs nothing functionally or cosmetically: $10,000.
Completely "restored" but with incorrect "upgrades" such as pre-1919 starter, incorrect accessories, etc.: $10,000 but buyers will be a different group than previous item.
Rip van Wrinkle: Car stored inside since new, less than 1000 miles: $20,000.
Complete factory type restoration, every nut and bolt reconditioned, completely correct: Ought to be worth $20,000, but the market will not pay much more than $12,000.

Trucks other than original pie wagons: Deduct 50%.
Depot hacks, reproduction bodies: Deduct 50%.
Speedsters, reproduction bodies: Deduct 50%.
Town cars with original bodies: Add 100%.
Pre-1917: Add $1000 for each year down to 1909.

Body only: 60% of the value of the car.
Chassis only: 40% of the value of the car.

Generally, cars needing total restoration are overpriced because they are a liability, not an asset, and the cost of restoring them far exceeds their finished value. Unfair, but true. Generally, cars restored with thousands of hours of expert work are under-priced, but no one will pay their true value. Unfair, but true.

If you want to make money restoring cars, the best way to do it is to buy a car that is complete, original, basically sound, but does not run. Spend 50 hours and $500 on it fixing only what is broken and give it a nice paint job so that when you're done it runs, everything works, and it looks decent, and advertise it for twice what you paid for it.

If you want to do it right [partial translation: take everything completely apart], forget about making money. Subsidize it with your regular job. Buy a good working car to enjoy until you get this one done. It will take longer than you thought. It will cost more than you thought.

It is impossible to restore any part without complete dismantling. You never know what you have until you take it apart.

Caution: For any car that has been "restored" request a photographic record of each stage, and information on the experience, background, and motivation of the restorer. The word means ten different things to ten different people.

David Grant Stewart, Sr. (303) 670-1375
28089 Pine Drive
Evergreen, Colorado 84039

Think about limiting your choice to a 1926-27 tudor. They are a yery common model and are the first T to have an all steel body which may be an advantage in a damp rainy area. Plus there are mechanical improvements which were made in the last two years on Model T production.

Shane,
18 months ago my wife and I attended a Model T rally in and around Cork, oganised by the Irish Model T Club. At least 15 Irish T's attended and around 20 from the U.K. It was a superb rally! They regularly attend rallies here in the U.K. too.
The Irish club, although small is very active and now publish their own newsletter as well as having several dedicated pages in the MTFRGB magazine. I have a Cork built 1922 tourer, and took it back to visit Clonakilty, the village it spent most of its life in. The Irish Model T club is very friendly, and would certainly welcome you with open arms, as they did us, so join 'em!
Reg Harris.

My cousin just sold a very good gray and black 27 Coupe with a Ruckstell and Rocky Mountain brakes and wire wheels for $11,000 in California. Open cars are more valuable here than closed ones.