Rear axle measurements.Need input.

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2005: Rear axle measurements.Need input.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Friday, April 20, 2007 - 11:29 pm:

Ok here i am been saveing money thinking well now is the time to build the rear end for my T.I had been putting it off because all my ring gears looked bad and I thought I would need new.
well I got ahold of a good second hand set that has little if any markings that it was ever used,machine marks still there.and they are attached to a early houseing with studs.I measured the gear case houseings and this is what I get on the holes the axle gears fit in. 1.811 on the ring gear side,1.807-8 on the other side.The gears measure 1.803 and 1.805 .From what I hear on the tape,1.807 is what the book says.
Are these ok to use? Also,what effect would a defective fiber washer have between the 2 axles?The 1 in the axle I am fixing has a dimple on both sides in the middle,and is flared out around the edges like it is mashed in. I know this comes in the gasket set and I will put in the new 1.I had a member of the club check the axle movement a long while back when i was going to do this job and it was a little to much.So I scared up more parts and reassembled it with better gears and houseings.I got to worrying about just a little movement in the axle and houseing and I looked at this washer I put a very thin plastic washer in there with the fiber 1.The axles turned and no slop .It just plain felt right.
So that is why I am wanting to know what the effects of a defective fiber washer would be.Also,if I were to use these best parts I have along with the good brass thrust washers and bearing sleeves and such what affect would a little movement be in these axle gear caseings?.I will check response to this thread early saterday morning but after that I cant respond till sunday evening,so please dont think just because I dont respond I wont appreciate your input.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Saturday, April 21, 2007 - 10:31 pm:

Howdy,checking from a friends computer or at least going to try.I hope to get some info on this in case I need to go to a machine shop or something before I order the thrust washers and such.
thanks for any help.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Monday, April 23, 2007 - 12:12 am:

bump


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Monday, April 23, 2007 - 10:05 pm:

Well I ordered the parts today like oil seals and so forth and they will be here thursday.So I will be getting started on it then.The best I can fiqure i will put together the best stuff I have,if any problems arise I will have a set of houseings and gears repaired at a machine shop and take the thing back apart and fix it.Aint like it is rocket science.But if someone reads these measurements and has any ideas,let me know.thanks.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Thursday, April 26, 2007 - 12:13 am:

Well I took my parts I have been worried about to a old fellow that has done machine work for years.He felt of the play in the axle gear and the gear case and said I didnt have any problems,there was very little play there and heat and oil would take care of it.Said if it were any tighter heat would seize it up.
My parts came from snyders today.The inside sleeves in my houseings were both lefts and in great shape so I just ordered 2 rights.I took the stuff to a local man that has messed with t's since the 50's and he said the stuff like the 2 left sleeves was good.Said my axle houseings were nice and was surprized to see the pins that hold the thrust spacers not sheered off.He said someone must have screwed up and used the wrong sleeve in the right houseing on the inside.I checked the outside right hand sleeve and it was correct.But worn slam out.,
I have the sleeves in and will clean up the gear case tommorow and put all that together.

I would like to know how you all make sure you get the thrust washer sanded uniformaly if the axles are to tight in the houseing?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jack daron on Thursday, April 26, 2007 - 12:27 am:

I've never had to sand one down. I have two coffee cans full of old steel washers which I have miced and labeled. If it is to tight I get a slightly more worn washer ,or two and try that. If you stay with it long enough,you can usually get a combination that fits well.Those washers vary in thickness from about 0.085-0.090 or slightly larger so you can easily get 8-10 thousands clearance there.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By james dimit on Thursday, April 26, 2007 - 07:03 am:

When I set up my rear axle I used the rear axle book from the club. I used a full size brass washer, a ring gear shim, and 1 new,1 used steel to get the backlash where I wanted it.

I then used the 2 thinest steel washers I had and still had to sand the brass thrust washer to get clearance. I just put a piece of sand paper on the table top and worked it back and forth, turning ocasionally. I checked it with a mic before I started, and after removing a few thousandths, did a test fit.

I got it to where it was snug but could be turned with my thumb with the housings bolted together with no gasket between. Then when you add the gasket it turns freely.

It does help to have a few used steels, I miced then before I started and wrote the size on each with marking pen so i could change them out and know if I was gaining more or less. Hope this makes sense, Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By VRay on Thursday, April 26, 2007 - 10:08 am:

okay, a question. The steel washers being refered to I am assuming go between the axles. Where do I get a hold of them? Is it better to replace the fiber one with steel washers? Can I adjust the thrust washer clearance by just changing the thickness of the washers that go between the axles? Are these washers just what one might buy at a hardware store? I too am near to rear end rebuild and I read these posts with interest.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jack daron on Thursday, April 26, 2007 - 11:33 am:

We are refering to the steel thrust washers. (one on each side of the bronze thrust washer.)I use the fibre washers between the axles,sometime one old,one new to stop end play. If you have a shop manual,read that whole section on rear end rebuilding very closely.It explains everything.Remember you may encounter some worn parts and may have to compensate /replace some.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Thursday, April 26, 2007 - 09:30 pm:

well,after takeing the brass washers to a machinst and haveing him take about 10'thousandths off each 1,came home,followed Jacks advice and measured all my metal washers and used the thinest 1's,I got that part right.I had to also make a shim out of header gasket material to go between the axles.The fiber washer with the gasket set was to thin,the old 1 I picked out made it to thick so I just made a shim gasket to go along with the new 1..Then I got my drive shaft ready,had 2 houseings to choose from,used the best 1.I had the matching pinion that went to the ring gear I used.The ring gear I used still shows machine marks on the teeth along with the pinion so that part should be good for a long time.I installed a nice snug ujoint and all seems fine.I can grab the ujoint with 2 fingers and give it a twist and it is easy to turn and the axles turn fine.I used a vise grip on 1 axle and let it bump the table so I could see if the spider gears worked,they did like a charm.I used lithum grease as a prelube on all the bearings and the thrust washers and such.yesterday I had installed the internal oil seals,OOPS.I decided it would be best to take the bearing sleeve and oil seal out till I was done takeing the houseing apart.
I sent a peice of paper thru the ring gear and pinion and it came out accordian.
I really dont hear any racket. I was a bit concerned about a minor "clic" when I turned the ujoint but I noticed I had not tightened all the bolts in the houseing to pull things together.
Should there be any gear noise at all or should I feel any "clic" when I turn the ujoint? I do feel a slight clic when I turn the ujoint but it is very suttle .


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jack daron on Thursday, April 26, 2007 - 10:24 pm:

There will be a slight amount of back lash in any gear set up. It sounds like you're there.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Thursday, April 26, 2007 - 11:09 pm:

Thanks for the advice and help.The video someone,sorry I aint good with names,sent me a while back helped alot to familarize me with the task.It is a heavy thing,the rear end with the drive shaft attached. My plan is to reline the brakes,install them,install the radius rods,then install the rear hubs and wheels on it ,then roll it out of the shed.May be next week as I am headed to a engine-tractor show this weekend.


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