l have taken this occassion to write under an anonomous name to protect both my good name on this forum and the recipient of this slag off.

l am quite sure that every club has one of these members, the one who is in your face about every aspect of the running and building of a particular thing, in our case it happens to be the model T.

l have been building my car from a very rough beginning for some time, only to have a member , try to inform me about how this is supposed to be, what item it should be, whats not right and how the car is not what it should be !

l have studied and asked questions , maybe spent more time with folks here than with my family who are here with me, but l think l have done the best l can with all of your assistance and with what the big book says are the correct parts and as close as is possible with a 90 something year old car in color.

l make only one observation to "the critical member who knows everything , has visited everywhere and has studied everything", Do you Have a 19** BUILT or even started to be built ?
NO YOU DONT !

l appreciate criticism where it is required to rectify an error , all personal criticisms given not only harms the overall want to be involved in any aspect where the overall FUN and ENJOYMENT of our old cars is taken aback by such sad individuals who think they are some what better the the rest of us........... Of course they are not.

Every club has one of YOU, please for the benefit of the reason we are members of this great club , be a member help with problems, DONT try to stand over and play little HERO.

You seem to have a considerable amount of repressed anger problems,with some one whom you have chosen to not identify. That is well as this is indeed not the best place for that. Perhaps if you contacted other forum members outside the forum,you could get the help you seem to desperatly seek. As for your good name, that remains to be determined as you have chosen to obscure it. I have built a bunch of cars from the ground up and am currently working on at least #6,so I know how that feels. Sometimes these have taken up to 10 years to get them as close to where I want them to be before finished.Good luck on solving all of your problems.

At a few car shows I have had a few "T" experts come up saying this is right or this is wrong and I always respond by saying "That's interesting, can I stop by your house and look at your car?" Gee, I am always suprised when they don't even have one to look at. It takes all kinds and I just shrug them off. If everybody liked the same things, it would be a pretty dull world.

Here's an interesting story I thought I would share.
I just recently turned 40.Last week I had the fellow who was the Principle of my elementary school call me hoping I could help him with his 1921 T.We were reunited a year ago when he had an antique phonograph needing repair,I knew he had a T,he found out I had a 1915 T....
Anyways,his problem was with his starter.I gladly fixed it for him.To my amazement,I found out his father bought his T from the fellow who bought it brand new.It had been in their little town all of it's existance.Sold there new,still there,having only 3 owners!
This car is as original as they come.Top,paint,upholstry,correct motor,etc...Everything just as Henry made it to the best of my knowledge.
So I ask him to join our local club and come out touring with us.He was tickled pink that I had asked him.He was a bit unsure getting involved with any club,thinking no one would be interested in seeing his old unrestored T.
I said:
ARE YOU KIDDING?!?!?!?
Most guys would swarm a car like yours because very few of us get to ever see an unrestored,unmolested T still roadworthy,up close.People will be looking at your car to see how to restore theirs!
Restored show cars are wonderful cars and huge positive testimony to the abilities of the craftsmen who restore them.
I told him,you can just jump into your T and GO! Don't have to worry about a little scratch here or there.Just drive it!
I'm glad he now has a new found interest/excitement to drive his T and bomb around with the rest of us.He's looking very forward to it now.
I think constructive club promotion is important.We are all ambassadors to our own clubs, national and local.I think it's a priority to promote how much fun we can have with our cars and more importantly,our friends.

Hmmm l think l had an occasion recently like that !

"...sad individuals who think they are some what better the the rest of us..."

Apparently YOU think you're better than the poor guy who, God forbid, wants to help the new guy out. Shame on him!

You've remained anonymous to protect your good name? When you use this forum to complain about people who only want to help you you have already ruined your "good" name. Apparently you know more than anyone else already. Why do you even belong to a club, with all those pesky people bothering you with well meant advice?

If you want to talk T's then use your real name and ask away, otherwise stay totally anonymous by going away.

I have met several people that post here and all are good people .No complaints.

Rough begining,Hum,what are you building Mr.Anom? I repair and use some of the worst parts imaginable,I have a appreciation of others that do the same. Let's see what ye got.

The best that you can do with someone like that is to use the information that is helpful, and ignore the rest. Don't let him get to you. I have encountered many "experts" who can tell you all about things that never even existed. There is always someone at a show or event who will tell you that something is not correct on your car. Maybe they think that they are being helpful, but it doesn't seem like it when they are doing it. My response to them is that 99% of the people who see my cars are thrilled to see an old car, and really don't know or care if it is 100% correct. My cars are USED CARS! REALLY USED CARS! In the last 90 years, a few parts have been changed! Ford made changes when the cars were new. Check the service bulletins, as parts were redesigned, old designs were discontinued, and it was recommended that the new design parts be used to repair older cars. That is why there aren't any 2 pedal, 2 lever cars around. They were all upgraded at the dealers. My '85 pickup has worn out a few parts in the last 22 years, and 250,000 miles, and many were replaced with aftermarket/non original parts, but it is still an '85 pickup! Same goes for my T's.

my response to such "know it alls" is:- "I would rather have my car on the road than have it sitting in the workshop waiting for the correct part. If you can supply me with the correct part I will gladly fit it"
Gavin

For: “Sorry but Anonom”

Some of us are not as quick to pick up on subtle hints as others. I don’t think you are referencing me (I’m always an optimist!). Although I love to dig into the details and share them – I try to do that when people ask and in away that is helpful. Just in case, if you are upset at something I have shared please click on http://www.mtfca.com/cgi-bin/discus/board-profile.cgi?action=view_profile&profil e=hap_tucker-users . Then click on “click here” to send private message, check the “do not include my e-mail box” and then you can send me an anonymous note through the forum. If I’ve messed up – just let me know. You can click on my name on this post and send me an e-mail – but it won’t be anonymous. My computer crashed and it is in the repair shop. I’m borrowing the kid’s computer and I don’t know my password for my profile. And for those who think I’m ok – thanks – I’m not trying to divert the thread – so please don’t post about me (you know one nice compliment and it could go to my head).

By the way, lots of people tell us all everyday that what we have isn’t good enough. From the car we own to the toothpaste we use all the commercials I hear say I’m wrong. As was shared above, if someone shares something worthwhile hang onto it and if not – just let it go. And don’t let one or two bad experiences deter you from the hobby. I remember one of my very first posting on the forum. If I had let the tone of the response stop me, I would have missed meeting a lot of other great friends and sharing some good times. And some of us are still a little “rough around the edges.”

Good luck and if we can be of any help let folks know.

Hap Tucker 1915 Model T Touring cut off and made into a pickup truck and 1907 Model S Runabout. Sumter, SC

Jerry Van, I for one agree with the original poster. People who know it all are unpleasant to be around. I would never tell anyone that this is wrong for their car.

I inheirited the 1917 delivery truck my dad bought as a kid. After cleaning it up and getting it running I took it to the local town parade for the 4th of July. I was quite proud of what I had done with it (I was awarded the grand marshall ribbon) especially considering how far gone it was. It was basically a parts car when I started with it.

Then I had the distinct misfortune of running into Mr. Pick it apart. He started in with, " that should have 30 X 3's on the front and Ford didn't offer demountables until 1919, bla, bla, bla.

I thanked him for correcting me and told him to figure the cost of new wheels (and anything else he found wrong) and make the check payable to G-A-R-Y T-I-L-L-.... He walked off.

Not everyone wants to hear from people like that. If I wanted to hear from one of those I would eat beans or cabbage.

I knew demountables were not correct for the car, I knew the spokes shouldn't be varnished, etc., etc. I also knew my dad had handled those wheels as a kid changing flat tires and I wouldn't have taken $100,000 for those particular incorrect wheels.

If I was new to the hobby and asked him if he saw anything incorrect then he would have been welcome to comment. The original poster was merely stating not everyone welcomes the comments of the local brainiac on old cars.

You stated that those guys are only trying to help. I find they are usually only being critical and very seldom helpfull. Look up the definition of help, you won't find "being critical". Being helpfull would be a comment like, "You can decrease your chance of vapor lock if you re-route your fuel line like this. The further it is from the exhaust pipe the better." or, "if you'll put a little permatex on those plug threads it will seal better and you won't get that oil puddling."

There is a huge difference between being helpfull and picking things apart. I for one do not find that later of the two fitting in with the first.

The bad thing about cowardly anoymous blanket accusations is that they could be aimed at anyone that ever took the time to offer advice to the accuser. Anyone who knows more than someone else and offers to share his knowledge could be accused of being a "Know it all". Thing is, on a Forum like this,that is designed to dissiminate information, it is the "Know it alls" whose advice we most seek. I don't want advice from "Know nothings".

This guy just wants attention and if we ignore him, maybe he will just go away.

I suggest that, in the future, we ignore anyone who refuses to register under their real name and post a profile in order to remain anonymous and that includes offering them advice. Especially to this guy who, obviously, does not want or need it, since he feels he is too good to appear on the Forum with all us "Know it alls" in order to "protect his good name". In order to protect a good name, one needs to first, have a good name.

Mr. Anom, your fifteen minutes of fame are over. Now, please go away and play in your sandbox so the adults can talk. You have wasted enough of our time. 'Nuff said. Jim

I say Lets get back to fixen T's and eating barbecue and slaw prepared southern style.With some Nanner puddin' on the side.

Sounds like a plan, Mack. My wife will cook up the baked beans. Jim

Mack, If I have any more BBQ, slaw and banana pudding I'm gonna have to start looking for a "fat man" steering wheel!!!! ...Michael Pawelek

ANNOYMOUS! Jim Patrick, (first line in your post above), you just created a new word worthy of the Washington Post annual contest, "Rearrange two letters in a word and change it's meaning."

Annoymous (n.) A person who publicly critizes others while hiding own identity.

See, something new and useful comes out of even this thread. How do we enter the the contest?

rdr

Rick. Brilliant observation! Of course that was intentional.....

Annoymous or better yet, annoynymous? Feel free to submit it. I'll split the prize money with you. LOL! Jim

Jeff, I like that!

I don't have a 1924 Model T Ford, I have a 100% authentic 2007 Used Car. <g>

Anon,i know how you feel,when i started fixing my coupe four years ago i would pose questions on this forum and get a variety of answers and the usual "its not like Henry built it",who cares what Henry wanted if he wants to buy my car he can do what he wants,i have a distributor ,Pertronix electronic ignition,no mag ring or magnets,12 volt alternator and a six volt battery for the starter only,two large flashing stoplights,its my car to do with as i please just like the guys with the Rajo and Fronty engines.Take the information available from the "know it alls" and digest it with the rest of the comments and decide for yourself and have a good laugh now and then,i am 67 and know that life is too short to worry about "experts"
Rick

Richard. I just looked at the picture you have posted and that is one Beautiful '26 T Coupe! I have one just like it that I purchased for $600.00 in 1970 when I was 16 and took 2 years to restore, finally finishing it in 1972. No matter what you have under the hood, on the outside, it sure looks like Henry would have wanted it. You did a fantastic job. Jim

I am not a big fan of Annie Nomus and her three children they, them and those. I dealt with them enough on the railroad when the trainmasters would call you in to say the they, them and those had observed some misdeed.
I have more respect for the person who speaks face to face of a problem or a truth as they percieve it at the moment than to deal with the faceless they, them and those who speak from the shadows.
Our country has faced and is facing enough of those folk.
Sometimes, if you listen, there could be some helpful info that filters through. As an oldhead on the railroad told me once: "Even the village idiot can speak the truth occasionally."

Joe R.

Yes and even a broken clock is right twice per day. Jim

Oh,you would have to remind the villiage is missing it's idoit.You all have a good day,I gota go.Duty calls.

Jim,thanks, my coupe is a Model T Haven special,"engine turns over" 0 compression.
Rick

I have only two things to say about the correctness of MY own assembled '15 T :

1. It ain't correct.
2. It ain't yours.

Correctness is for those who wish to be judged. I'd rather drive.

Be_Zero_Be

AMEN BOB!

Bob,
Another Amen, only judging I want is in the Market parking lot & driving through town & the only trophies, smiles & waves.

Alex

I agree Bob. I drive my T's alot, and so there are a few non original things such as rear view mirrors, stoplights and turn signals, and demountable wheels, to make things a little safer, and easier. I know that they are not correct for an original concours restoration, but as far as I am concerned, they are correct for my regularly driven-in-traffic car. Besides, like I said, it is a used car. I'm sure that the first owner probably made a few trips to Western Auto for some accessories or improvements, and I'm just keeping up the tradition.

When I got my first T, the guy who sold it to me said;"Now you need to join the Model T club." I told him that I had no interest in being in a club, since my prior experiences with them was like those described by "Annonomous". I really don't care if all of my cotter pins are pointing in the same direction, or if all of the slots in my screws are aligned etc. etc. Luckily, the club that I joined is less concerned with being 100% correct, and more concerned with being safe and having fun, while driving the wheels off of our cars.

I realize that there are those in this hobby whose idea of fun is restoring a car to the closest to the way that it rolled off of the assembly line. They enjoy polishing their brass, and shining their paint, and they wrap their white tires in plastic so that they do not get dirty when they load the car onto the trailer to take it to the show. Then there are those who derive their fun by driving their old, semi correct Model T's as much as they possibly can. I fall into the latter group.

In defense of "annonomous", I don't think that he was trying to hide his identity, as much as he was trying to ask if anyone else has experienced the same kind of "help", and how we dealt with it. By asking annonomously, he saved the "helper" from being embarrassed publicly on this forum, and possibly in his own club. I don't see the reason to attack him for his questions. It seems that he has struck some nerves here.

Thanks for all the hard work you do for the Long Beach Club, President Hood. You are an excellent leader, and a great example.

I won't tell who took this pic, if you don't..

rdr

Posted earlier by Jeff Hood--In defense of "annonomous", I don't think that he was trying to hide his identity, as much as he was trying to ask if anyone else has experienced the same kind of "help", and how we dealt with it. By asking annonomously, he saved the "helper" from being embarrassed publicly on this forum, and possibly in his own club. I don't see the reason to attack him for his questions. It seems that he has struck some nerves here.

I agree with Jeff, when I first saw the start of this thread my thought was, I know where this guy is coming from. I know an individual who knows all there is to know about Model T’s although his T is always ‘broke down’’. Whenever an engine/transmission or something major needs a rebuild it is sent out to a shop and returned complete from front pulley to fourth main, but he knows it all. I listen and simply leave it into my good left ear, I found I can’t get anything into my right ear; it does work good for dumping so I let the useless verbage freely dump out the right---works for me, to damn old to let minor things like the above to bother me, have enough trouble trying to remember what time the next pill is scheduled

Jeff,

Very well stated. In all fairness to the "Correctness and Judging" segment of our hobby, If it wasn't for their voice the Model T would have been re-engineered into who knows what by now. In reality , the voice of correctness helps keep the Model T a Model T. Sometimes it just needs to be muted for a while.

As you can see, I am more rebel then conformist !!


Be_Zero_Be

Actually, I think this has been a pretty good thread, some interesting info, a few good pics (Out of Order, LOL!) not much flaming either.
AND!!! Maked me wonder if I've ever been that "This ain't correct, son" person. Hmm, probably once at least, if so, I'm SORRY! But I do know I've been quiet too. Once saw a beautiful '15 touring, with bondo so thick on the front fenders, there weren't any visible rivets! I had to look at that twice, just to make certain what I wuz lookin' at! Still, car was purty, and everyone around was enjoying themselves. Not the way I'd do a car, but. . . Fortunately there are quite a few Ts left to enjoy.
I dunno where I'm goin' here, just wanted to say that I think this thread was/is worthwile.
T'ake care,
David D.

I still can't get that pesky upload attachment window to accept a photograph . . . hmmmmm

Anyway, As an old retired professor and eventually a retired Dean of Instruction and Curriculum, We always directed the instructors to refer to the text books, list required reading and additional references so that the students could make up their own minds and form their own opinions.

Remember that the committee that designed the horse actually invented the camel. In our case with the Model T's some are trying to turn the camel back into a horse while others like the camel as they found it.

"Remember that the committee that designed the horse actually invented the camel."

Frank, when I was at Little Rock AFB in the '60's, we had a Titan II missile wing there. The line heard around then was, "How did the elephant come about?" "Martin Marietta contracted to build a mouse!"

lt would seem some got the point and others missed it as mearly wingeing, the fact of the matter is simple , we do our best to do what we do and dont need the "NIT PICKERS" who will walk past criticise our work and walk off, to them l give the big RASPBERRY.
l applaude those who are willing to help with advice and a correction when needed but that is all part of what we do in this hobby, the other is mearly a detraction.
To those who got it and those who didn't , now you do, as l see by the change in thoughts as this thread grows.

"lt would seem some got the point and others missed it as mearly [merely] wingeing..."

Aha! A clue! "Winge" is UK, Australian or New Zealand English for "whine." Americans don't use it. That tells us something about the source of the post....

Well if all of ye can get this mess out of ye system then we can git back to the shed and play with t models.

Btw I am gona to post undur a anonymous,erroneous "handle" to purtekt my good name.:>)

"Aha! A clue! "Winge" is UK, Australian or New Zealand English for "whine." Americans don't use it. That tells us something about the source of the post...."

That was the second clue. The first was "slag off" in the first sentence.

To "Slag off" and to "Winge" are not commonly used in Australia either... my pick is either South Africa, Japan, or Sweden. Ha Ha.
There are T Modellers who are "picky" in Australia as well. Everyone is an expert, but the cars that are out there and being seen are at least being used even if they aren't totally correct. The "correct" cars only come out on special occassions and we all know, the more we use our T's, the grubbier they get.
The US and Australian T Model scene sounds exactly the same.
David.

I can beat all of these expert stories. I drove my 26 Coupe to get lunch one day not to long ago. Some expert walked up and asked me about the car. When I told him it was a 26 T Coupe he told me that I did not know what I was driving because Ford did not build T's in 1926. He knew this because his dad owned a 26 Model A.

Paul

EXPERT: We all know that an ex is a has been and that a Spert is a drip under high pressure. HMMMMMMMMM, I like the camel story better . . . . I can't post pictures any more so ......oink oink oink.

G'day Jonesy hows it hangin, there's a bit of fun to be ad ere l's rekun, lets pull this sucker and see's wot comes !

EXPERT: Ex is the unknown factor and a spurt is a drip under pressure.

If you fiqure out who it is,what will you do with the info? I got to thinking this morning,there is several people I aint seen post on here in a long while and it is a shame because they allways had stuff I couldnt afford or can do better work than myself and it was motivating to see it and read about it.
If you ever intend to excell in anything you need to hang around people that are better at it than you,so you will be motivated to work your self UP instead of down or no change at all.
Criticism can be taken wrong or as constructive,depending on the ears or eyes that assorb it into the greyish,pink blob between our eyes and how it uses it.

What would they do with the info?

Who knows and who cares?

Be_Zero_Be said it best.

"There are T Modelers who are "picky" in Australia as well."
Yeah !but I think its very rare ! Man 90% of the Ts to begin with "Down under" are painted anything but black to start with.That doesn't sound picky to me ...They call the Black Ts "hearses"(and shudder at the thought and more often than not they will chrome anything they can take off.They have some real sporty machines.
That doesn't sound to picky to me.. They're a fun group and drive pretty much as fast as they dare in the little crates to boot! I have a T freind that Vactioned there during a big "T" event a few years ago and hooked up with many T'ers there.He brought back 100's of terrific pics of the event, full of a Polychrome Model Ts.

I know nothing about Model T's and learn everyday. I understand why someone on occasion would post a message as anonymous, it appears that if someone says something on the forum that gets under the skin of another using their real identity that they are crucified and thus they feel the need for the "anonymous" shelter. I would remind those that admonish people that do this as cowards, or something similar in verbiage, that many of the changes that helped turned the Colonies into the United States and other changes throughout the world, were started by these so called cowards that used anonymous or an alias to bring forward to all what was being discussed privately. The ambiguity of the “who said it” was not important but the main idea was. They did this to diminish the potential onslaught or retaliation from the authorities that was sure to follow as evidenced in this thread and others. What will happen, as is happening even here, is that we will reduce the number of people that are willing to post. We will create a vacuum that is even emerging now where only we elite will discuss whatever we decide is important and aside from the occasional newbie that has not been properly dressed down, we elite will argue amongst ourselves and then turn on each other in our own T world. "Let them eat cake" comes to mind when a sovereign was once told of the plight of the common folk. We are better than this aren't we? What is happening here? We have lost some great members that have passed and are missed, others that have quit and some that have just stopped posting, We can not change the loss of those that have died but there is a reason for people that quit and / or stop posting. “We have met the enemy and it is us.” I have been reading the forum for years and about 18 months ago it seems the tenor of the discussions began to change to a less friendly version. The funny thing about it is that we control it. Lets continue to be the help center that is wonderfully demonstrated here for the most part and try to make it fun again. One of the best threads I recall in a while was the First model t memory. That thread was worthy of T modeling and us. I post this as a concerned hobbyist.

John Tannehill

I agree John. We don't need to be chasing people away from the Model T hobby! We need new blood to keep us alive. There are no dumb questions when it comes to T's either. They are unusual and different, and sometimes they are hard to understand. We don't want anyone to be afraid to ask for help here. Sure, there may be several opinions, but just because someone does not agree with one, doesn't make it wrong. Sometimes we just have to agree to disagree.

As far as the "experts" go, you just have to bear with them, and sift out the information that is useful, and ignore the rest. You just can't let them get to you. Everyone has their own idea of what they want their car to be, and it may not be the same as what the "expert" thinks it should be. If you solicit an opinion, that is one thing, but if it is given unsolicited, it is quite another.

The "experts" are everywhere too. They are not limited to our hobby. This just happened to my wife and I, and I immediately thought of this thread. We were out for a walk, and had our dog along too. We met a lady coming the other way with her dog, and as she got close, she commented on our dog, and asked what kind it was. I told her that it was an XXX, She replied that it was not an XXX, she knew what an XXX looked like, and our dog was not one of those. In her opinion, our dog was an XYZ, no doubt about it. (I paid a lot of money for our XXX, and got it from a reputable XXX breeder, and I'm quite sure that it is an XXX.) I'm not sure what this lady's qualifications were, or why she cared what kind of dog it was, or why she even asked, since she already knew what kind of dog it was. Just another "expert".

I was in Arkansaw a week ago looking at some T stuff and a guy drove up, got out and told the owner and myself that he could tell us what everything was, that he had been doing T's for 20 years. He did seem to know what he was talking about but he was just too stuck on himself for me to be around. I would have liked to have had a few of the parts but it wasn't worth having to hear all the crxx. I left the Tspert with the owner and came on back to Texas. I have owned Ts for 44 years and have meet some wonderful people and then there is an expert now and then.

My old friend Lewis Rector was born in 1903 and went to work in a Ford garage in 1915. He was still working on them, answering questions and helping others with their work on them in 2003 when he was 100, the last time I visited him in his home in Sacramento, even tho he was nearly blind. He and I lived about a mile apart for over 25 years and did a lot of things together during the years from 1962 to 1996 that he was the head of the restoration shop for the Towe Ford Collection. One of the things that griped him the worst was the people who would come to the Towe museums in Deer Lodge or Sacramento and start in on how this was wrong or that was wrong and how Ford never made a red T or a blue one and they never made one with two levers, etc. He enjoyed being at the museums and loved to talk Fords with people who had some knowledge and really enjoyed showing and helping those who were truely interested but he told me more than once that you can't change an "experts" mind about anything because he doesn't have ears that work, just a mouth. (that is the clean and politically correct version of what he said) He usually would tell them that he would make a note to tell Ed they had done it wrong and they would call the guy if they needed help getting it right or something like that to get rid of the "expert."

I bought my Pasco wire wheel set from him and nearly his entire library and collection of literature when they moved to California. Also some of his timers and carbs. He was fine man who made friends wherever he went and was much revered by the younger generations for his knowledge and helpfulness. I never once heard him volunteer what was wrong with somebody's car or tell them what they were doing wrong without being asked and if he did tell them it was almost always with an offer to help. And he really WAS an expert.

What a difference in his attitude and the one of the Australian guy who stomped up to me at the Post Falls tour and asked if that was my car. When I acknowledged that it was he told me that in Australia if I brought a piece of .... like that to a tour I would be sent packing and to make sure I didn't park anywhere close to him for the photos. Since I was only about 300 miles from home I had been going to invite some of them to stop when they came through on their way to see Yellowstone and Glacier parks and spend a couple days touring locally and invite them to stay at my cabin in the mountains or my ranch for a few days and take them around to some of the lesser known places here. I decided if they didn't like my T they damn sure wouldn't like my cabin or my ranch and probably wouldn't think much of my shop or all my parts either. I guess they probably had a good time without seeing a great private collection near here and seeing some local sights. I never checked.

I am humbled by the knowledge that most here possess. I just wish that they wouldn't chase off some of the others that I enjoying reading posts from. Have you noticed that Craig Sutton hasn't posted in over 6 months and Sue may not be back at all. If your "correct information" is not asked for than it is worth nothing. I enjoy learning the "correct" way to do things, but I also like to make up my own mind as to how I am going to do it. I am still open to others ideas, but just because I choose not to do that, I still should be treated with respect as you should also. Many people that I have spoken with, won't come near this forum becuase of all of the bashing that has gone on. Just something to keep in mind when the new guys down the road decide it's just easier to cut up the cars and make rods out of them. I guess we can help each other or watch our cars simply go away. It's our choice.

Don't assume everyone who has gone missing was "chased away" or left because of the tone of the forum. Sometimes folks move on to other interests or changes in priorities. I used to post frequently on a couple of Model A sites; now I rarely visit them but I wasn't chased away. My recollection is that Sue had lots going on in her life besides Model T including a potential move.

I conversed with Craig Sutton a few days ago by email. He's not mad at anybody, just dealing with some "personal issues" that are taking up his time. I expect he'll be back when time permits.

I'm glad to hear that. I realized it had been a while since I had heard from some. Some people leave loudly and others very quietly.

l read with some thought that my original point has now been taken , if the NIT PICKERS , the WHINERS , WINGERS , those who comment on things believing they are the ultimate wise authority , have read these posts and maybe taken some notice , then all is well in the world of T's.
Help but dont be a F*%$#n Pain in the A**.
My Domocile / origin bares no concequence in this matter , as l am everywhere and so as it would seem is the member who knows everything there is to know about everything.

l now sign out and draw this post to a close and get back to my real self.

Why would your "Domocile / origin" expose itself?