Coupe Belt Rail Moldings

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2005: Coupe Belt Rail Moldings
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Saturday, March 01, 2008 - 10:21 am:

I've come across two variations in the snap on belt rail moldings used on the 1925 Coupes. I am not sure at this point if there really were two different ones, or if someone modified one of them. The difference is where the molding wraps around the door latch pillar. Both moldings run under the dovetail. One molding has two countersunk holes just before the dovetail which appears to at one time held screws. The second type does not have these holds.

Could those of you with 25 coupes with the steel doors look at this area and let me know which type you have. Also, if someone could post a photo of the one without the screw holes I'd appreciate it.

Rear Belt Rail

Thanks,
Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Underwood on Sunday, March 02, 2008 - 10:14 am:

Dave. my 25 does not have the screw holes. Molding tapers down to about 1 1/8" and would appear to have a bend to hold that end. Not up to speed on the picture thing.

Bob


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Jeandrevin on Sunday, March 02, 2008 - 11:17 am:

Dave,
Good luck finding body molding. I hope you can, but I sure couldn't find any for my Tudor. I ended up making the molding from wood. Here is what I did:


yours will be a lot harder though, more intricate, and you don't have a wooden frame to fasten to.

Tim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Sunday, March 02, 2008 - 12:45 pm:

Bob,

Thanks. That is what I believe is the correct way it was done. It tapers down and goes under the dovetail and is secured with a single nail.

Tim,

Fortunatly, I have all the moldings for my 24 coupes. I am in the process of writing a book on the 24-25 coupes and am documenting all of the parts and all of the changes. I'm trying to finish up the chapter on the moldings. Unfortunately, there are no drawings for them, and the Change Notice gives the date they were adopted and the date they were obsoleted and nothing else. That means all of the documentation must come from physical examples. This was easy for the aluminum moldings used on the 24 Coupe as I have one nice original body that is untouched since it came from the factory, and one that is all apart for a complete restoration. I'm able to photograph the moldings on the car, plus I have a second set that is off the car to photograph the details. It's a little harder for me for the 25 model year since they changed to the snap on moldings and I don't have a 25 Coupe or a set of 25 Coupe moldings. Compounding the issue here is that I photographed the end of this molding on a 25 coupe, but when I contacted a few people I know with 25 coupes to see what screw went in the hole, they didn't have any screw holes there! I'm thinking that these screw holes were added by someone later - but it could also be a change made by Ford - hence the request here to see if anyone else has a car with these screw holes. I also need a photograph of the correct end of the molding to put in the book as the one above is either incorrect, or only tells part of the story.

So - if anyone has the coupe with the two piece snap on moldings, and can provide some detail photo's - or even let me borrow them to photograph, I would greatly appreciate it.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Kuehn on Tuesday, March 04, 2008 - 12:16 pm:

Hello Dave! Is there any varations on the rear of the 23-25 Coupes as far as the molding is concerned? I am restoring my 24 and mine clip over the nailing strips that are below them. These strips go over the seams of the rear of the trunk area. Any advice would be appreciated. John


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Tuesday, March 04, 2008 - 09:42 pm:

John,

According to the change notices, the 1924 model year coupes, and very early 1925 model year coupes used the solid aluminum moldings. They adopted the two piece snap on moldings in December of 1924. These moldings probably appeared in production sometime shortly after that. The documentation does not mention any changes to these parts so I would say the same moldings were used from Jan - Aug 1925.

Does your car have the steel doors?

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Kuehn on Wednesday, March 05, 2008 - 09:48 am:

Thanks for the info. Dave! Yes my car has the snap on mouldings at the trunk area. It has wooden frame doors. Is there any source of the snap on mouldings? I kind of doubt it. My coupe must be a crossover from very late 24 to the 25 year model. Thanks again John


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Wednesday, March 05, 2008 - 10:07 am:

John,

Thanks for sharing the info. It's interesting that your car has the wooden doors. The change to the wooden doors happened in October 1924, while the change to the moldings happened in Dec 1924. I would have thought that the steel doors would have been in use by that time.

Is there a serial number on either the metal passengers side floorboard riser, or stamped into the wooden sill body sill just inside either door between the door jam and floorboards? Also, is the package tray held in with metal brackets or is it screwed to the top of the wooden blocks that support the rear belt rail? Is the front belt rail a separate piece or is it stamped as part of the cowl?

Nobody makes these moldings. I've been looking for a while now.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Wednesday, March 05, 2008 - 12:21 pm:

Dave,
I believe I emailed you some pics over a year ago and we both determined the coupe I have is really a 25. It does have the some numbers stamped in the wooden sill body sill. After looking back at the engine serial number I believe it is a late oct date. And the old licence receipts sometimes would show 1924 or 1925!! The title shows 1924!?
Anyway mine must be a crossover model using 24 parts,etc on an early 25. Thanks for yor interest. John


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Wednesday, March 05, 2008 - 01:28 pm:

Hi John,

Sorry about that. I talk with so many people about Coupes that I loose track of who's who. If we emailed then I have the info here in my pile (I tend to keep everything).

There was definitely a transition between the "24" model year and the "25" model year. Not all the changes happened at once. They seem to be spread out between Sept. and Dec. 1924. After that they stayed pretty much the same until Aug. with the 26 models. It's interesting that late Oct. would be the time when the steel doors were just coming out - so the wooden doors could still be being used. However, according to the documentation the moldings change was approved in early Dec. 1924. I guess it's possible they were using them before they made the change to the documents. I've seen lots of notes on the Change Notices where they say "Updating print to the way the parts are currently being made" so the documentation did sometimes come after the parts were being used. The documentation for the Coupe body is lousy. They didn't document anything until Feb 1924. At that time they seemed to assign part numbers and make change notices but most of the change notices say only "New Part No Drawing", then "Obsoleted".

One more piece to the puzzle - now I just have to figure out where it fits!

Thanks,
Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Joseph Wayne Rudzik on Thursday, March 06, 2008 - 05:25 pm:

Dave,
Tried to leave a message last night, guess it didn't get through.
I went out to look at my '25 Coupe, it's original, and the belt moulding goes under the latch and does not have any screw holes on either side.
Those may have been a quick fix or for some option we'll never know about.
Also, Ms. Priss has Budd steel doors original to the car.
I will look to see about what month, day she was born.
Hope this helps ya.

Joe R.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Thursday, March 06, 2008 - 11:51 pm:

Hi Joe,

Sorry - didn't get any messages. I appreciate the info. I'm pretty sure the one car I photographed was modified - figures!

Any info you can provide especially if there is a body number on the floorboard riser or on the sills just inside the doors would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Dave S.


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