Valve seat insert

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2013: Valve seat insert
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark H Whisenand on Thursday, May 09, 2013 - 06:25 pm:

what inserts are available and what is the size ? thanks


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Thursday, May 09, 2013 - 07:26 pm:

They're listed on Page 53 in Lang's catalogue, but the size isn't given. You could phone Lang's and ask.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Sunday, May 12, 2013 - 11:25 pm:

Your best bet might be to take it to an automotive machine shop and have seats installed and guides reamed for Chevy 350 valves. Royce will tell you that you can recut the seats and ream the guides for Fordson tractor valves.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Scott Owens on Sunday, May 12, 2013 - 11:43 pm:

You can also use Ford 351 Windsor valves. They are a bit larger than the c%#@y vlaves and you still have quality parts in your motor. Scott


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale Peterson on Monday, May 13, 2013 - 01:09 am:

The machinists prefer you let them use the seats they have available as their machining is set up for the seats they use. I prefer the 350 exhaust valves as they are correct length for the adjustable tappets and the stems are slightly larger so the guides need to be reamed, taking care of worn guides. Remember the seats and reaming of the guides need to be done together!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Lovejoy, So Cal on Tuesday, May 14, 2013 - 12:12 am:

I called Langs today as I am going to try and do my seats - they gave this info - seat is .732 thick,od 1 5/8th" id 1 5/16ths"


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Richard Bennett on Tuesday, May 14, 2013 - 03:19 am:

Tom, I think something is amiss with your Lang's seat dimensions. 0.732" is almost 3/4". Should the 7 be a 2?
I would be interested in how you intend to fit the seats. The machine shop I use has some rather sophisticated cutters and alignment tools for the job, not something I have seen in a home shop.

Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Michael Rogers on Tuesday, May 14, 2013 - 06:40 am:

Allen is correct. Sounds like another block gone.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By J and M Machine Co Inc on Tuesday, May 14, 2013 - 09:51 am:

Tom:From what you have said the dimensions are off.
Instead of .732 it should be 7/32" or .218"
That's what is shown below typical model T seat we use.





Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark H Whisenand on Tuesday, May 14, 2013 - 10:39 am:

are they cast iron or alloy? mark


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By J and M Machine Co Inc on Tuesday, May 14, 2013 - 03:16 pm:

Mark: The seats we use are an alloy nickel stellite seat.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Lovejoy, So Cal on Wednesday, May 15, 2013 - 12:13 am:

I think you guys are right, sorry bout that I can't read my own writing :-)my eyes are not what they once were. oh yeah, I ordered mine from Mac's not Lang's. Their catalog says the seats are made of cast iron. I have not got them yet, still in the mail. Allen - I am going to try and do it - I picked up a Kwik - way valve seat insert tool model M-049 on E Bay, brand new never used best I can tell. Really lucked out as their quite expensive. Got it for about the price of a single cutter.I have never done anything like it. But I do know a couple skilled machinist who have offered to assist. Both have done valve seat inserts in several vehicles including model T's. So hopefully it well go ok. Thanks for pointing out my error's


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Richard Bennett on Wednesday, May 15, 2013 - 12:42 am:

Good buy Tom. I am not familiar with that tool. I hope it works for you. The seats have to be an interference fit. The cutter which makes the hole needs to be matched to the inserts to achieve this.

I am a little bit unsure about your proposal to use cast iron seats. The hardened seats in J and M's post will allow the use of unleaded fuels. These are tough little buggers. They need to be, to stand up to the hammer-in fitting process. I would be hesitant to fit cast iron seats in this way because of the risk of breaking them. I can see no advantage in using cast iron seats over the hardened seats.

Perhaps you skilled machinist helpers will be able to advise.

Yours with caution,

Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By kep on Wednesday, May 15, 2013 - 02:51 am:

Doing it at home? Just under .015 interference fit. Wart removal kit with the liquid nitrogen, shrink it in.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Wednesday, May 15, 2013 - 06:32 am:

Allan, unleaded fuels isn't a threat to the valve seats in a T like it is in more modern 30's to 60's higher revving engines.

I've read an english test from the 90's when unleaded was introduced here in Sweden & everybody was worried about their vintage cars. Their results: Almost all the extra wear cast iron seats gets without lead or equivalent protection in the fuel comes over 3000 rpm - and standard T driving is well below that, more like 1400 rpm.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Conger on Wednesday, May 15, 2013 - 12:50 pm:

Kep

I think that you have the decimal point off...

Allan/Roger

Lead wasn't added to gasoline commercially until 1923. The model T engine was designed for use with fuels not containing lead, so anyone stating that you need hardened seats for use with unleaded fuel is making an unsupportable statement. Hardened seats have merit for some reasons, but mitigation for damage brought on by the use of modern unleaded fuels isn't one of them.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William L Vanderburg on Wednesday, May 15, 2013 - 08:04 pm:

After Lead was added to gas commercially in 1923, there was a moratorium put on it for testing purposes. (I suppose to prove that it wasn't harmful to people). Leaded gas took off after 1928.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Aaron Griffey, Hayward Ca. on Wednesday, May 15, 2013 - 11:32 pm:

I think .0015" ( one point five thousandths) would be just right for the interference fit.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kerry van Ekeren (Australia) on Thursday, May 16, 2013 - 12:10 am:

I've only had to fit them to aluminium heads back in the 1970's,(Toyota) .007 was for that, checked my old ref book from back then for cast heads and .003 to .005 for them,(this is press fit) has it changed for what the seats are made from for today's specs?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By kep on Thursday, May 16, 2013 - 02:18 am:

So i forced my valve seats in far too tight?


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