Slow Moving Vehicle Sign Mounting

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2013: Slow Moving Vehicle Sign Mounting
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bud Holzschuh - Panama City, FL on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 09:17 pm:

Planning on taking the T on some longer rides this summer. Thought a slow moving vehicle sign would be a good idea as I can't always stick to sparsely traveled roads.



So I bought one from Amazon. Its stiff plastic.

But now the problem is ... how to mount it on the rear of my 15 Touring.

I'd rather not drill holes in the body, so does anyone have any good ideas ?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Stitt-Southern Oregon on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 09:19 pm:

Magnets?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By A. Gustaf Bryngelson on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 09:22 pm:

Make a bracket that will bolt to the frame from a long bit of steel strap. I connect one to my ambulance with a Murphey fastener, so it is quick to remove when showing


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By arnie johansen on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 10:25 pm:

If you cut a round whole in the center to clear the hubcap, you can mount it to the spare tire if you have one mounted in the rear.

Smaller holes in the triangle and nylon string wrapped around the wooden wheel spokes can hold it on the rear mounted spare.

Easy to remove when necessary! Do not know if it is legal, but from a safety point of view it is a good idea!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 10:51 pm:

Magnetic blinking lights are much more practical than an ugly farmer triangle. You can buy one for around $15.00 and move them from car to car. The ones I use take two double AA batteries and last a month or two. You can see them a long ways away.
light

light


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 10:53 pm:

light

light


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 10:56 pm:

I will try again;

light

light


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Mikeska, Denver CO on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 11:08 pm:

Bud,

All of us with slow old cars should do whatever we can to promote driving safety. My fear is that the average young person who is texting while driving has never seen a slow moving vehicle sign and as such will center punch the sign without ever knowing what they hit.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Verne Shirk on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 11:19 pm:

You may want to check your state laws. I believe in Kansas, it is illegal to have one of those triangular "slow moving vehicle" signs on a vehicle that is traveling over 15 mph.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Mikeska, Denver CO on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 11:41 pm:

Verne,

I bet that you are be right, but it doesn’t make much difference if you follow the letter of the law and get rear ended while going 16 mph. Just saying, a distracted driver that is speeding is not going to leave much rubber on the road before they ruin your day whatever your speed. The best bet for those of us that drive our T's a lot is to check your rear view mirror often and pull over and let the morons pass you.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Coiro on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 12:51 am:

What you need is one of these magnetized rubber signs. Because it is not the official Department of Traffic slow moving vehicle triangular emblem, there are no legalities with which to be concerned, yet it conveys your message at least as clearly.



You can buy one here:

http://www.incolor-inc.com/Caution-Slow-Moving-Vehicle-Decal-Sign-or-Magnetic_p_267.html


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter Kable on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 01:11 am:

It was suggested to me that one of the slow moving signs would be an advantage when we toured across the USA in 2008 and 2011. A few times I was mistaken for being Amish but I'm sure it was a help. At no time did any police officer object to it being there, they just wanted to see the Kamper.

Since returning the car to Australia I have left it on. On a tour last Easter someone commented to me that they could tell my car a long way away before the actual shape was recognisable because they could see the triangle.

back


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bud Holzschuh - Panama City, FL on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 08:14 am:

For some reason most drivers, including me, seem to be more tolerant of a vehicle doing 35 in a 55 mph zone if it has the safety triangle displayed.

I don't know why, may have something to do with being conditioned to seeing them and having to slow down until they can pass. Or maybe the triangle lends an air of legality to a slow moving vehicle.

I'll just take my chances with the law. Most of the deputies and troopers around here are so amazed to see a running T that they're more likely to want a ride than issue a warning. I do plan to use a flashing yellow at night though.

Since my car is a touring and I ride with the top down about 99% of the time, I think I'll try to attach it to the top when its in its stowed position. I'll post a picture when its done.

The magnet idea was a good one, but my top hangs out over the back so much I think it would be less visible or at least less noticeable.

Thanks all for the suggestions.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By A. Gustaf Bryngelson on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 08:51 am:

It is interesting that the SMV laws are not standard, in Idaho, I believe that the limit is 35mph. If you get rear ended, and you are displaying a SMV, it does not matter what speed you are traveling, the offending driver will not be able to claim that they did not know you were going slower than the traffic. If we will not drive because we fear being rear ended, then it would be best to take the bus, as it has been shown on another thread that one can be rear ended by a speeding motorcycle while doing the speed limit. No matter what you are driving, you need to be vigilant of what is around you, and when you are driving a slow vehicle, the first rule of Italian road racing does not apply.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Dufault on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 09:36 am:

" the first rule of Italian road racing "

And that would be????

Sorry for my ignorance....I'll take the answer in a PM Gus


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bernard Paulsen, San Buenaventura, Calif on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 10:05 am:

It *may* make sense to mount such a triangle or even a flashing amber light when traveling on roads with heavy or much faster traffic, but it surely uglifies an antique car. Still, you can paint your model T in fire engine red and have reflective tape around the body and you nonetheless can get hit by a texting driver or moron going twice the speed limit on a crotch rocket. The only way to avoid this is by staying home. My defense is to stay away from those roads if at all possible and expect everybody to be an idiot. Most people are. First, double your insurance value. If you get hit, you at least will make money off of it. "Make 'em pay."


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Horlick in Penn Valley, CA on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 10:18 am:

Apparently in California the triangle is only allowed on vehicles not licensed for road use... like tractors and combines. It is not supposed to be placed on a passenger vehicle.

The flashing red lights likewise are illegal to place on your car in Cali.

Ok, I doubt a Chip officer would cite you for these infractions and not getting splattered on the front of a Kenworth is a good thing, so do what you think is safe.

I got some red led flashers a little smaller than Dave's at the hardware store for under $2 each back in 1998. They run on a hearing aid battery and turn on when you push the little button on them. I used them for an hour or two total on my 1913 car. Last week I found them in a drawer and pushed the button... still work great and are highly visible. I guess they are also visible to a police officer, but none ever bothered me about them when I used them 15 years ago

TH


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Nathan Bright on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 11:02 am:

I know in NC you are supposed to have a flashing red/amber/yellow light at night attached to your load on a trailer or truck if it protrudes more than 6 feet (I think) off the back of your truck/trailer. If its during the day all you have to have is a 1ft by 1ft flag that is orange or red.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Markham on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 06:43 pm:

In NY it is illegal to have a SMV sign on anything that' is registered my friend had one on his T and got a ticket


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By A. Gustaf Bryngelson on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 08:29 pm:

Hey Dave,
I think the "first rule of Italian road racing" came frm the movie Cannonball Run, and is "what is behind you is not important"
Best
Gus


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Tuesday, May 21, 2013 - 11:30 pm:

John,
It is probably illegal to to put a SMV sign on a car in all states. This is from Wiki:
"A slow moving vehicle (or SMV) is a vehicle or caravan of vehicles operated on a street or highway at speeds of less than 25 miles per hour or 40 kilometers per hour. An individual vehicle, a vehicle which is being towed, or caravans of vehicles, which are unable to reach the above speed, are required by law in both Canada and the United States to display a special reflective emblem sign (shown to the right) at the rear of the vehicle or vehicles, or on the rear vehicle in the caravan."

And:
"The sign appears as a "cut" triangle consisting of a triangle with the corners cut off in red, as a border surrounding an orange uncut triangle in the center, with the edge separating the orange and red being black or white. The United States Department of Transportation as well as the various Canadian provinces, have established regulations that dictate the minimum required size of the sign, and grant exemptions for displaying the sign for certain religious groups having an objection to displaying a sign, which are operating horse-drawn carriages or wagons on public highways, provided they use an alternative reflective marking on the rear of the wagon or carriage."

I guess an easy way to get around this would be to make a sign that was similar but different. Maybe a round, square of some other shape. As long as it was not the official triangle SMV sign, they could not say anything. At least that would be my story.

Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Katy, Texas on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 12:15 am:

Dave, Where do you buy those battery powered lights?

Paul, You don't have to text to get in trouble. Recently I had to drive from Houston to Dallas on I 45 and back in one day. North of Fairfield, Texas, I was humming along doing the 75 MPH speed limit and came upon a large motor coach towing a car. The car was fully engulfed in flame and was scorching the motor coach. Well, the idiot in front of me decided to slow down because he'd never seen a car on fire. I had a split second to decide whether to give him whiplash and customize his ride, or take to the center median to miss him. When I shot past him on the left like a Saturn rocket, he decide it wasn't such a safe idea to slow down to see a car fire.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tillie the 15 on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 05:49 am:

terry-
the wireless lights can be purchased here

theegyptgarage.com

they are a simple design and are easy to install.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 06:01 am:

Terry Woods:

I get them at a business that works on Trucks and also has a parts department. It is amazing to me how long the batteries last. I often forget to turn them off and go out to the shop in the morning and they are still blinking. I use mine every day as I drive to town each morning for coffee with the gang. I don't keep track but even when I forget to turn them off I am sure I am still getting a couple months out the two AA batteries.
By the way a blinking light can be seen from a lot further than an ugly farmer triangle, especially on an overcast or stormy day

picture


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 06:03 am:

Terry Woods:

I get them at a business that works on Trucks and also has a parts department. It is amazing to me how long the batteries last. I often forget to turn them off and go out to the shop in the morning and they are still blinking. I use mine every day as I drive to town each morning for coffee with the gang. I don't keep track but even when I forget to turn them off I am sure I am still getting a couple months out the two AA batteries.
By the way a blinking light can be seen from a lot further than an ugly farmer triangle, especially on an overcast or stormy day

picture


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 06:14 am:

Bud Holzchuh:

My 16 would be the same as your T with the top down. I just move the light further down and it can still be seen from behind.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 06:37 am:

Terry Horlick:

The Lights I use are NOT RED. The are yellow, orange or marigold, what ever color you want to call them. As I said above I go to town every day. Once I get to a paved road, its four lane with very heavy traffic with State Patrol. I have never been stopped on the road or by the town officers when I get to town.

light


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 10:08 am:

Where a flashing red light would be illegal I expect a flashing yellow light would be OK in most places. But given the proclivity of some legislatures to enact goofy laws, I'd check with the local cops to see what's kosher where you are.

What do I mean by goofy laws? One large eastern state says YOM plates may not be restored. A large western state requires that YOM plates must be restored. In either case, how do they know whether a plate has been restored or not?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 10:19 am:

Dave,
If you get right down to it, a single non-synchronized orange or red flashing light on a car is not legal. They just make sense sometimes. I agree that a person would be more likely to get by with orange then red, you would not want Johny Law to be seeing red.

Maybe someone should start a national effort to make them legal on any older vehicle without hazard flashers that drive below the speed limit or have other safety handicaps. Some handicaps include; almost no brakes, no turn signals, no hazard flashers and maybe no brake lights.

Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jeff V on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 11:14 am:

Michigan law says the SMV sign can be used on any vehicle with a maximum speed of not more than 25 MPH, so I can use one on a TT but not a T. Apparently, if you CAN drive more than 25 but choose not to, that doesn't count as a legal SMV. Ohio law says the same thing, but with more confusing language. Just be aware of the laws of the states you will be traveling in.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bernard Paulsen, San Buenaventura, Calif on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 11:57 am:

Jeff:

"One large eastern state says YOM plates may not be restored. A large western state requires that YOM plates must be restored. In either case, how do they know whether a plate has been restored or not?"

Competence. If the restoration has been done to such a professional standard that it can't be told whether or not the plates have been restored, the goal has been achieved.

Same with cars. Looking at a 50 year-old classic car, inspecting it from up-close, looking for masking lines or any signs of a repaint and being unable to do so without a device measuring the distance from the paint surface to the metal, or doing a chemical analysis of the paint, in short, being unable to tell whether or not the car has been repainted or not, it's a job well done, if there was one.

If RM auctions restores a Duesenberg for hundreds of thousands of dollars today, it will be difficult to tell if it has been restored at all 60 years from now. I have seen cars that I could have sworn were original paint, unless I took out the measuring device.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By A. Gustaf Bryngelson on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 12:05 pm:

One important thing to remember, do anything you can to make yourself and others safer, no matter what you do, it will be against a law or a regulation. If we lived so that we did not violate any laws or rules, we would not be able to do anything.
Two classic examples: There is a law that forbids employers to hire anyone with out documentation, but if you refuse to hire a person who lacks documentation, they are allowed to sue for discrimination.
The second is the regulation imposed by OSHA that requires all restrooms or out houses to have screening on them that will not allow flys to enter, but it is complicated by the regulation on the next page that requires screening to be large enough to allow flys to get out.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry Petrino in Modesto, CA on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 12:21 pm:

So Gus, are you (like us all) a little frustrated? :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Davis-SE Georgia on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 12:33 pm:

What is the practical difference between a magnetically attached flashing red light and a permanently attached flashing red tail light (a la 'emergency flashers')?

I'm glad I don't live where some of you guys live. Seems some of your cops have nothing better to do than to harass old car owners. I have been pulled over three times in an antique car. One time the cop was technically right, but IMHO should have looked the other way. The other two times, I was in the right, but what I was doing, though legal, could have been construed to be unsafe. Both times, the cop was concerned for my safety, not that I had violated some minor lower case letter of the law. I was let go with no tickets or even written warnings on all three occasions.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 01:14 pm:

Hal,
You asked, "What is the practical difference between a magnetically attached flashing red light and a permanently attached flashing red tail light (a la 'emergency flashers')?"

Here is some differences.
Emergency flashers have to two lights, one on each corner and the flashing has to be synchronized. Driver have a right to expect that two synchronized flashing lights have a car between them.

A single flashing light off to one side could easily be confused with a turn signal.

A single flashing light in the center at night could confused with a turn signal or a hazard flasher with one light out. An approaching driver would not know if you are signaling to turn or if it is a hazard flasher with one light out and not knowing what side the car is on.

On the surface a magnetically attached flashing light makes a lot of scene but common sense does not prevail when push comes to shove and lawyers get involved. You could be sued for having a non-approve flashing light or you could be dead right and not sued.

Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Prince Madras, Oregon on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 03:28 pm:

I use a slow moving sign that is designed for bike riders that you strap around you, they are highly reflective and can be removed quickly and mounted on most anything.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By A. Gustaf Bryngelson on Wednesday, May 22, 2013 - 03:31 pm:

Hey Henry,
I took care of my frustration many years ago by laying off all my employees and changing my business so I did not need any outside labour. The problem is that this country is divided into two factions, the employees and the employers. One faction has supported heavy regulations that make it possible for only the mega corporations to be able to employ people with out being fined out of existence. It used to be that small businesses were the back bone of this country, they were the first step for an employee to become an employer. The 1% has managed to get the majority of the 99% to regulate upward mobility out of existence.
Ouch, crap the top of my soap box just broke, I guess I better go fill the grease cups.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Thursday, May 23, 2013 - 01:04 am:

Dennis,
Cool car and photo!

Your bicycle flag/sign should be a reasonable alternative to an official SMV sign. By definition the bicycle flag is not a SMV sign because there is no red outer border on it. Anyone should be free to use that anyway they want and it should serve the purpose.

Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Aaron Griffey, Hayward Ca. on Thursday, May 23, 2013 - 11:22 am:

A similar topic:
Yesterday I followed a motorcycle that had a stop light that stayed on about 2 seconds and then flashed 3 times and again stayed on about 2 seconds and back to flashing again. Very noticeable.
Think of all the hassle Hank could have saved us if he'd of let buyers have any color they wanted as long as it was International safety orange.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Davis-SE Georgia on Thursday, May 23, 2013 - 07:48 pm:

Gee, I don't know about a brake light that isn't a steady 'on'. Sounds like it could be illegal in 37 states and could confuse drivers into thinking he might turn.

Sorry. Couldn't help myself.


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