Considering buying this '24 Coupe body

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2013: Considering buying this '24 Coupe body
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Stinchcomb, Trumbull, CT on Tuesday, May 28, 2013 - 02:04 pm:

Sorry for the poor pictures; they were sent by the seller. I found this Coupe body that is claimed to be a '24 T. Wood and body have been done but Iíll to look to see how well. The package price includes front and rear fenders, splash aprons, running boards, frame and anything else that is T. No chassis parts other than the frame. I'm hoping there are more trim pieces such as that around the windshield.

This is a perfect match for my í24 chassis project and it is local. I'll know more when I go out and look at it in person. Better pictures will be coming. I'm no expert when it comes to the construction of these bodies. I've looked over the forum and found some great references to these Coupe bodies and will gather the information together. Based on the pictures so far, does anything look not right or need more scrutiny?

Front view

Back view

Doors


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Tuesday, May 28, 2013 - 02:35 pm:

Cant tell by the pics but when you look at the Coupe body check to see if the windshield frames, door trim, body trim mouldings, dash rails, door handles and items that are specific for a 24-25 Coupe body are with it.
The fenders and chassis parts are easy to find BUT the rest is not being reproduced. That will determine the price for the body. Good luck finding some of those non-reproduced parts!

By the pic it looks like the floor risers are missing. Maybe the cowl vent also.

I have a restored 24 Coupe and I had a few other parts left from another body.

Email me if you need the floor risers and etc.

Hope this helps.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Harris on Tuesday, May 28, 2013 - 07:34 pm:

Rich If the gas tank is under the cowl----it might be a 26/27. Check that out.

Bill Harris


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker in Sumter SC on Tuesday, May 28, 2013 - 08:28 pm:

Bill -- it is not a 1926-27 as they were an "all metal" body with wood used only for attaching the top & upholstery. The 1924-25 closed cars also came with a cowl vent but the tank was not yet located in the cowl.

Rich please check your Spam folder --- I sent you two scans of articles from the "Vintage Ford" on rewooding 1925 Coupe bodies. The 1924 coupes are very similar. As mentioned before having the unique trim pieces is very important. Additionally how well the wood kit was installed is very important. While it can be removed and replaced if necessary -- that is a lot more work. Try a trial fit of the doors in the openings -- how do they look? Any history on who did the rewooding and when? Are they still available to talk with or someone from their club? Did they use a wood kit and if so from where? What type of wood did they use? Are the doors the earlier wood framed doors or the later metal framed doors?

Recommend you contact Dave Sosnoski who is writing a book about the 1924-25 coupes and is rewooding one himself. Sending him some good photos should answer a lot of your questions. You should be able to search on "Dave S." on the forum and get a current contact information. You can also go to one of his older posting I have saved at: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/80257/98934.html?1248218332 and click on his name and it will call up his e-mail.

Worse case -- it is missing all the trim, unique parts and the wood kit needs to be replaced. In that case if the metal is still good -- and the price is really low -accordingly -- it could make a good "long term project" over the years to collect other parts. That also would mean you need "free storage" -- at $50 a month -- it would not be worth keeping for years as you could purchase a complete driver in a ten years or so just on the storage cost. But if storage is free, -- building a speedster, hack, open depot, etc. body for the chassis would let you enjoy the chassis while you restored the body and/or looked for parts. Or if someone chimes in with "I have a 1924-25 that the tree fell on and I have the trim pieces but need the body you could work out a way for them to purchase it or sell you their wrecked body with the parts.

I like your Model A Page.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Sosnoski on Wednesday, May 29, 2013 - 07:45 am:

From what I can see it looks like a 1924 model year body. I need some more detail photos to determine exactly which variation.

Make sure all the little parts are there. I see the body molding which goes around the rear of the body, but I don't see the rest of them. There is one which runs under the windshield, one on each side of the quarter windows, two on the curved piece under the rear window and two on the sides of the rear body panel. Those pieces are pretty much impossible to find. Also, see if the window regulators are there - those are also hard to find. There are a bazillion other little pieces to the body which can be hard to find if missing.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Wednesday, May 29, 2013 - 09:34 am:

Rich one more thing to consider is the trunk lid hinges. Check to see if they are with the body.
Another unique item for the 23-25 Coupes. Tough to find! As Dave S. stated its those other pieces that can be hard if not impossible to find.
Sure hope the owner has a 'box or too' of those odd parts! Good luck!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Stinchcomb, Trumbull, CT on Thursday, May 30, 2013 - 10:25 pm:

Hi all

I ended up buying the Coupe body. Apparently it was restored by the sellerís grandfather who owned the car since he was 18 years old but unfortunately recently passed away. Most of the small parts were brought home and Iíll pick up the larger fenders and such later next week. The front risers donít seem to have a number on them. The belt moldings are aluminum. Iím not sure what type of wood was used but it looks like it was fitted together very well. I'll post some more pictures of the box contents in the trunk in the next post.

Front

Rear


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Stinchcomb, Trumbull, CT on Thursday, May 30, 2013 - 10:36 pm:

I did find this box of parts which is great to have but I think there should be more trim pieces. At least now I'll know better what to look for. The aluminum molding mounts below the front windshield above the cowl line. Correct me if I'm wrong; I'll attempt to id some of the parts.

Box

16aA

Photo A: #1 and #2 are a pair of outer steel covers for windshield posts. #3 I think is the "rocker" panel below the doors. Not sure what side but not a pair.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Stinchcomb, Trumbull, CT on Thursday, May 30, 2013 - 10:54 pm:

The body and doors still need to be delivered to my house. Otherwise I'd use some logic to see what fits. Speaking of doors, the right side door is a wood type and the wood has yet to be fitted. The left side door is all steel and from '25. I'm not sure if some of the 25 door pieces are interchangeable and some trim parts may be here. Either way, I plan to find an all wood type door for the left side. Anyone want to trade?

17aB

In photo B Pair #4 is door pull garnish molding. #6 (window tracks?) looks very similar but the holes aren't in the same location so one may not belong as a pair. Not sure what the other parts are for yet.

18aC

Photo C: #2 and 4 looks like they go to the quarter window. Need help with the rest. Oh and I have the rod that fits to the end of #4 (couple of nuts and a spring at one end/small handle at the other. You can just see it in the box of parts photo above.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Stinchcomb, Trumbull, CT on Thursday, May 30, 2013 - 10:59 pm:

Enough for tonight. This photo D has the aluminum trim pieces for the trunk area. Also a good working Type D window regulator was there too but not the other side. I thought I read in Bruce's book that these were interchangeable between the left and right doors.

19aD

Window reg


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Sosnoski on Thursday, May 30, 2013 - 11:25 pm:

Rich,

Photo A.
You are correct in your identification of the parts. There should be a left and right rocker. I'll have to look and see what the difference is between them as the look pretty much the same.

Photo B.
1. Garnish moldings for the bottom of the quarter windows.
2. Side moldings for the door windows. These go towards the back of the car.
3. Garnish molding for the top of the quarter windows. There should be a rubber U shaped piece inserted in the opening in the channel.
4. Door garnish moldings at the bottom of the door windows.
5. Side moldings for the door windows. These are shorter than #2 and go towards the front of the car.
6. Garnish molding for the top of the door windows. They should also have a rubber strip in them.

Photo C.
1. Bracket which goes on the door pillar along side the upper windshield. The swing arm on the windshield goes to the piece sticking out. There is a thumbscrew to hold the arm in position to hold the top windshield open. There should be a left and right of these.
2. Garnish molding for the side of the quarter window. This would fit on the front of the window. The rod with the spring you mention slides up inside this molding and the handle sticks out the slot.
3. Door glass channel - goes on the bottom of the door glass - the regulator roller fits into the small channel.
4. Can't tell from the photo.

Photo D.
Moldings for the outside of the quarter window. There should be 4 of these - one for each side of each window.
Moldings for the back body panel.
Moldings for the panel under the rear window.

The steel door is a 1925 door. It will fit on this body but is not correct. You should have the wooden framed doors. There is difference in the garnish moldings for the wood vs steel doors. From memory, the wood doors had 4 wood screws holding them on, and the steel doors used 3 machine screws.

The parts book lists the D regular for use on the right and left side. However there is a part number for the left and for the right D regulator. I need to look at the ones I have and see if they are all the same or if there really is a left and right one.

When you get the body can you post some photos of the inside of the body. I can narrow down the date more based on some of the interior construction details. If there is no number embossed in the metal floor board riser, that probably means this is a Ford built body.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Friday, May 31, 2013 - 09:38 am:

Rich, it looks like you got lucky! You have most of the window trim and moulding pieces!

Do you have the quarter window riser rods? They have a nickel plated brass handle on them.
The late 24 Coupe that I restored has wood framed doors with the window risers as your does.

It took me 3-4 years to find the regulator for the drivers side door. And it was by chanch I found it on Ebay. It was rusted up very badly but I did restore it.
They are interchangeable for either door.
I have been to Chickasha and other meets many times over the years and never saw one.
At least you have one to start with.

I hope you have the door locks also. Good luck!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Monday, June 10, 2013 - 12:02 am:

I wouldn't complain about having steel doors.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tony Bowker on Monday, June 10, 2013 - 12:51 am:

My 24 coupe has aluminum doors, Bruce told me that only the Fordor had such doors. If he was correct, they must be interchangeable


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Sosnoski on Monday, June 10, 2013 - 08:53 am:

The early Fordor had aluminum doors. They are the same size as the Coupe doors. With the wooden doors you can tell a Fordor door by the bead around the edge of the door. On the Coupe doors the bead running around the edge is formed as part of the door. On the Fordor it is a seperate nailed on "T" shaped piece - similar to the earlier Coupe and Centerdoor doors. The steel doors are the same for the Coupe and Fordor.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Stinchcomb, Trumbull, CT on Monday, June 10, 2013 - 09:55 pm:

I can't thank everyone enough for the great information that has been provided. I've been looking through the archives looking up older threads on everything coupe. The body is about an hour from my house but I did get up there this weekend to pick up the doors, fenders, etc. Unfortunately the door latches, hinges and some other trim were not found. Most of the original wood for the right door has been found as well. Not much of the original body wood, in fact only two small pieces. One of the wood pieces is a half section of the seat riser and was apparently used incorrectly as a pattern. It can be seen in the photos below.

The new wood looks like it is fitted very well although I would have used knot free wood if I had spent the time making this by hand. Time will tell if the metal work holds up but for now it looks very presentable on the outside. I personally prefer butt-welded metal work but overall Iím very happy with the body. These pictures were taken with my cell phone but help to show the wood structure. The previous owner looks to have been faithful in replicating the structure and any comments to help narrow down the production date range would be appreciated. I hope to have the body at my house this week if the rain holds off.

1

2

Rich


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Stinchcomb, Trumbull, CT on Monday, June 10, 2013 - 09:56 pm:

One more

3


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Stinchcomb, Trumbull, CT on Monday, June 10, 2013 - 11:30 pm:

Still trying to figure out pieces. I suspect these are windshield related.

720

722


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Sosnoski on Tuesday, June 11, 2013 - 01:51 pm:

Brian,

It's what I refer to as a Type III body. They were built between Jan 1924 and August 1924. After that there was a transition period into the Type IV body which is the "typical" 1925 body.

The seat riser block is typical of the Type II body. The Type III block extended backwards farther and had another notch in the top that the seat back sits into.

Something is not right with the rear cross member. That should be a single 1-1/4" thick piece. It appears from the photos that this one is made of two pieces, or has an additional piece added on top.

Also, I've never seen the metal strip on the inside of the door pillar where the striker plate is. I'm guessing that was put there as someplace for the latch to grab onto. The latch should grab onto the striker plate and there is no need for those strips.

The two pieces you show go across the front of the body. The one on the left goes under the windshield, the one on the right goes over it.

The package try looks to wide. It should have a small curved block on each side to better fit curve on the back of the seat. There should also be a notch in the center with a cast bracket bolted to the bottom for the seat back to slide into.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Tuesday, June 11, 2013 - 02:08 pm:

Rich when you go back to pick up the body give the area and any other bldgs close by a good going over for any more parts and pieces. Hope you find the rest of them.
You might try Model T Haven for any more small parts for the Coupe body. They have piles and stacks of bodies and pieces.
Good luck


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Stinchcomb, Trumbull, CT on Tuesday, June 11, 2013 - 05:51 pm:

I took the liberty of cropping the Coupe wood from the Fordwood.com site. The full image can be found here: http://www.fordwood.com/images/cpe23new.jpg

wood

I didn't notice the two extra pieces at the rear crossmember. They look to be on top of the x-member so perhaps that is easy to correct. I plan on buying the set of plans for reference from Ron Buckley. I'll keep in mind the metal strap on the door post.

My remaining seat riser piece looks to be the back half of part #458.

rider


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Sosnoski on Wednesday, June 12, 2013 - 07:35 am:

Here's what that block should look like.

Seat Riser Block

I need to order a set of Ron's plans myself. Just be aware that he based his plans off a Canadian coupe. They may not be the same.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Sosnoski on Wednesday, June 12, 2013 - 07:43 am:

Here's the door striker plate. No metal strip on the inside.

Door Striker Plate

Dave S.


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