I'm dumping oil down the drive shaft tube into the rear end. Every few weeks, I check and it is over full. I siphon it out and put in fresh gear oil. I think this will take an engine removal to fix, but what is causing it? I keep the front U joint and drive shaft cups full of grease till they ooze but it still leaks a lot of engine oil down the tube. What do I need to do?
Ball cap is wore out.
Lots of work, you could turn the 4th main 90 degrees, looking at it from the rear, clockwise so the oil hole is horizontal to the shaft. If you have an oil screen, try running with out it.
The next step would involve pulling the engine to replace the 4th main and getting both the 4th and tail shaft fitted so they have the proper clearance.
If you send your drive plate and ball cap to George King III (www.enginerestoration.com), he will re-pour the babbit and machine the ID of the new babbited ball cap to the precise OD of the drive plate shaft. That is what I had done and it stopped the leak of oil into the drive shaft housing. Jim Patrick
Are you adding grease and turning the grease cup in the driveshaft at the point close to the transmission?
If a worn out ball cap or drive plate tail shaft are not the culprits:
Like Mark Gregush suggests, if you have an accessory oil screen, remove it.
Don't over fill your crankcase. Based on various threads on the forum, there seems to be unnecessary confusion regarding how much oil to put in a Model T crankcase.
If the transmission was ever worked on in the past, it may be possible that the plug is missing from the drive plate tail shaft. (The plug can be seen in the tail shaft below.)
You're not over-filling the engine with oil, are you? Yes, your ball cap may be worn out, but over-filling the engine with oil would only make matters a whole lot worse. If you're not already doing so, keep the level between the spigots.
Can some one explain the connection to the "engine oil screen"!!!!
Your right Les, there isn't one.
Use a little less grease in the U joint and keep a drip pan under the car when parked.
All of the above suggestions will help. Jim Patrick's is the best. When you re-install things, be sure the shaft is centered in the bearing and the crankcase is straight so the bearing won't wear out soon. It will also be better for the crankshaft if the 4th runs centered. See other posts on fitting the 4th main. and straightening the crankcase
"Can some one explain the connection to the "engine oil screen"!!!!"
"Your right Les, there isn't one."
The missing plug, shown in Erik's photo, will cause the most severe leak of this kind, and yours sounds pretty severe. However, if this is a new problem in a car that hasn't had this trouble till now, I would lean towards the worn-out fourth main, as others suggest.
Another possible cause could be if you had a ball bearing fourth main with a worn out bearing seal in it.
i still wanna hear the theory leading to the screen causing any problems other than its intended purpose of catching the band wear and or other junk not good for the motor ?
I believe some people claim that the funnel in the screen directs a larger amount of oil to the ball cap area. I think this is what they are referring to. YMMV.
I had small but irritating oil leak at the universal ball joint. This was on a fairly fresh rebuilt motor with an overhauled transmission that included an NOS drive plate assembly and an NOS ball cap. A transmission screen was installed. NOTE: I DID NOT have a problem with oil being "pumped" down the driveshaft and into the differential. Also, I never fill the crankcase to the upper petcock but make sure it is always above the lower petcock before venturing out.
After researching the possible causes on the forum, I removed the transmission screen and that cured the problem.
One theory is that the transmission screen deflects more oil to the ball cap area than when a screen is not used.
Some have suggested turning the ball cap 90 degrees when using a transmission screen.
Before people start claiming that the oil screen cannot cause any problems, be aware of the following:
1) Model Ts never came from the factory with transmission screens
2) I believe that the transmission screen is a fairly recent invention and is not a period accessory. I don't recall seeing any in Western Auto catalogs.
3) there is more than one manufacturer of the "crap traps" and there have been variations in the transmission screens - this has been discussed on the forum in the past - see the thread below. Perhaps some screens cause problems while others do not.
Feel free to jump all over my post.
Here is a section view drawing of what I put in my car.
Modified a 4th main to take a CR-15450 seal. Shortened the bearing length from 1.45" to 1". No modification to the output shaft. Took about 1/8" off the bottom portion of the drive shaft housing bell for clearance.
I'm not ready to brag about it yet because I only have about 1600 miles on it. So far, it doesn't leak at the u-joint.
That's a great idea Art! I am bookmarking this thread.
I agree with Erik, if the rear ball cap is worn adding an oil screen will increase the amount of oil leakage significantly. If you have a worn out ball cap taking out the screen might keep the driveway cleaner and keep the rear axle from flooding.
On the other hand if the ball cap fits the U joint properly it should not be an issue. I use a screen in all of my cars.
A theory that the Oil Screen is contributing to excess oil down the driveshaft is akin to corollary, that Outside Oil line contributes to fouling the #1 plug in my opinion.
There were many types of oil defector devices, to pour over over the bands, and one style had a screen, but I don't have at hand a copy of that adv. Here are a couple.
Todays version is with a angled plate that diverts a stream to the band linings, and the screen is over the rear of the trans, still not right above the fourth main.
In use, with the flywheel running at road RPM's a lot of the oil goes into froth and foam spray, and that some is caught by the diverted plate and sent to the linings, with some being caught by the screen and continued on it way around the hogshead. I did a short test with the Oil Screen using a glass plate over the inspection opening.
Did this short video to show, if you watch the very last portion carefully, after I ran up the engine speed to fast idle,...you can see the majority of the screen is now clear, indicating only some small amount of oil is screened, and the majority of the oil is thrown by the magnets, ring gear and flywheel into the sump, and back, with only some probably getting to the gears and linings.
There is never a constant pour of thick oil to the rear main from an oil screen.
Here's an era band screen. It went on the lower half of the band access door.
The Atlas strainer pan was advertised in the March 1923 issue of Ford Owner and dealer magazine:
The ad is reprinted in the MTFCA transmission book, page 29. (Every T restorer should have a few of those: http://modeltstore.myshopify.com/products/service-manuals )
Steve, the black strainer fits in the upper half over the bands. I have one in my T.