I need a diagram and instructions about installing metal stem tubes that are now available in wood feloe wheels. (working on a 1915) Unclear to me of the placement of the bridge and nut supplied with the new tubes.
Universal Tire counter display at Hershey
You must use old stock valve stems of the correct size. The ones I've seen that are supplied vulcanized to the tubes are not correct.
Dan,Is there a flap in the picture?? Thank's Bud.
David, the bridge washer and the nut are part of the installation of the valve stem in the tube. They should be in place when the tube comes to you. There is no need to disturb them. Just fit the tube as is.
Hope this helps.
Allan from down under.
When I buy metal stem tubes they don't come with any of the hardware installed. I've bought them from Chaffins, Langs, Snyders, Universal, Coker, Lucas and Wallace Wade. No hardware included so far unless I pay extra, and then it comes in a separate bag.
If there's someone giving away free nuts and bridge washers with their tubes Alan please let us know who it is.
It really doesn't matter if anyone is supplying the hardware for metal stemmed tubes anyway, because the stems are still the wrong size, unless someone has come to the rescue with the correct stems! They can't even vulcanize the correct rubber stems on the tubes either!
So get some old metal ones and install like shown in the link.
Royce, I must admit I have not bought a metal stemmed tube since at least last century. Are you indicating that the new metal stemmed tubes come with no nut and bridge washer? Are the stems threaded for a nut?
We get truck tubes with bent metal stems which come with no nut and no thread to take a nut and washer. Are the new T tubes like that?
To save otherwise good tubes, I replace bad rubber stems with old metal ones as Mark suggests.
Down under we can still buy thin rubber stemmed stick on valve stems which do the job nicely on all T wheels. Larry mentions vulcanising stems on. In Aus, vulcanising means using heat to fix the stem. This has not worked for many years, since the introduction of synthetic tubes. The stick on ones work really well on Butyl rubber tubes, but I have not yet tried them on silicone rubber types.
Dill made valve caps, with a valve removal tool on the end, which have a sliding thread within. I use these on rubber stem tubes to hide the stem. They will accommodate stems of varying length and being period pieces, they do not look at all out of place.
Just for interest.
Allan from down under.
I just got a full set of new metal stemmed tubed from Universal. They are nice, heavy rubber, marked 'Made in EEC'. The metal stems DO have the bridge washer and nut.
Ron,Great news,now to get them out of the boxes and rounded out with air.I keep my tubes hidden in spare tires under flaps and slightly inflated.I rember well thinking i had brand new tubes in boxes that i would simply open as needed!Bud.
The metal stem tubes do not come with the hardware. Whoever is making the tubes only makes the tubes. Other vendors supply the various hardware pieces. If someone is selling the tubes with the bridge washer and nut then they are installing them on the tubes. Not sure why someone would think that the hardware should come free. Someone has to pay for the manufacturing costs to make it. If it came with the tubes it would just be added to the price of the tube making the tube more expensive. Buying it separately lets you just get a tube if you already have the hardware. If you look in Lang's catalog, there is a part number for just the metal stem tube. There is a different part number for the kit which includes the tube, bridge washer, lock nut, rim washer and cap.
The stems do come threaded. There are two sizes of stems, one for the wood wheels, and one for the wire wheels. The stem on the wire wheel is smaller than the one for the wood wheels.
I'm not aware of a problem with the size of the metal stems. I bought some a few years ago to put on my original 24 Coupe. I used new tubes, bridge washers and lock nuts, but found some nice original rim washers and caps that had just the right patina. Everything fit together fine - no problem mixing new and old parts. I don't think anything has changed since - the lock nuts, rim washers and caps still fit the stems of the new tubes.
I know the stems on the rubber stemmed tubes are the wrong size. Can someone elaborate on what the problem with the metal stem tubes are?
Ron, made in EEC indicates the tubes were made in the European Economic Community. Probably one of the eastern countries, as those in the west usually use the country of origin.
David, presumably the new metal stemmed tubes you mention are threaded for the washer nuts. Can the tubes be fitted for use without the bridge washer and nut? I am under the impression that the bridge washer and the retaining nut are necessary to seal the stem in the tube. Am I wrong here? This was certainly the case with the old tubes.
Just trying to understand.
Allan from down under.
Here's how a brand new one looks straight out of the bag. They MUST be used with a bridge washer and nut. Sold separately. This one came from Wallace Wade.
Yes, the stems are threaded all the way down. I could be wrong but I don't think the bridge washer is meant to seal the stem to the tube. I think it's probably just spread the load across a larger area. Just like you would put a flat washer under a bolt or nut. It's shaped funny so it clears the nut.
Uh oh, I may have made a newbie mistake. My 1923 touring/pickup has 30x3.5 Hayes demountable rims. The car came with several spare rims, so I had the best one blasted, powder coated. I bought a metal stem tube, a flap, and a new Universal T-driver tire from Lang's. Since the tube didn't come with a bridge washer or nut and I didn't know better, I installed the tube without them. Do I need to get a washer and nut, dismount the tire, and install them?
Royce, is that valve stem you pictured above the correct diameter, or is it the large one? Who makes the tubes?
I recently received new brass stemmed tubes from both Coker and Lucas. The Coker 30x3.5 tubes included the bridge washer and nut as did the 30x3.5 from Lucas but the 30 x 3 from Coker came un-equipped.
Mark, the bridge washer would be good. Also, you really need a lock nut under the rim and a larger brass nut on the outside of the rim, as shown here:
Thanks for the info, since the spare has been holding air fine for the month or so since I put it together, I think I'll leave it as-is for now. I really had to wrestle with the tire to get it on the rim the first time, I'm worried about pinching the tube or causing other damage if I pull it apart now just to install a bridge washer and nut. I'll order the parts so that I have them when the time comes to remove the tire again.
If the bridge washer is there mainly to prevent rotation of the stem, I can do that by watching the flats of the stem to make sure it doesn't rotate when or if I use the spare.
As for the large nut, doesn't it and the dust cover go on the stem after the demountable rim has been installed on the wheel?
If I end up using the spare some day and it blows out right away due to the missing bridge washer and inner nut, I'll let you all know and you can all tell me that you told me so ;>)
Just a few thoughts, probably mis-guided. Original tubes with metal the threaded metal stems were fitted in a thicker part of the tube which was often re-inforced with a fabric layer. The stems were fitted, post tube manufacture, with the bridge washer having a raised lip around the hole. The nut was used to tighten the stem in the hole, the seal being a mechanical one made by the pressure exerted on the washer by the nut.
It would appear that the new ones are vulcanised into the tubes and they will hold air without the washer and nut, as Mark has found out.
Then some would have it that a bridge washer and nut are still needed when fitting the tube.
If this is so, I would consider that the washer and nut should be installed and supplied by the vendors/ manufacturers. When you buy new modern shockers, they come with nuts, washers and rubbers for the installation. Good on Coker and Lucas for supplying them ready for fitting.
Allan from down under.
There is some mis-information here. I've said at least twice there are two sizes of stems. I'm not talking about length, I'm talking DIAMETER! The stuff I've seen is way too big for a Model T. Too long, and too big a diameter. The only people that have it figured out are the Model A boys, and they all have wire wheels! The main consideration we have here is WEIGHT. We don't drive 15 or 20 miles per hour any more, therefore, it is imperative that we try to keep the weight down. The longest stem anyone with grasp on the situation would want to use is a Schrader 777 or equivilant
Larry, Did your article on valve stems get published? The May 2012 thread provides more detail on the different stem diameters, but does not give "the rest of the story," as Paul Harvey might say.
Original Model T valve stems were made like this. The dust cap does not thread on to the stem, it threads on to the nut.
That makes sense. Seems like a lot of work screwing the new ones done the entire length than folks would have put up with.
Thank you Royce for posting that picture. Maybe someone will take note! I have the article done, and lots of pictures too. The problem is, some of the pictures are not real clear, because I always seem to move when taking them. So, I need to re-shoot some of them.
I just opened a 30x3 tube I got last week from Universal and it had a bridge washer and nut on it ($29.00)
I will have to print this tread I have a box of Original metal stems but did not know how to install them , I thought it would be more complicated. Thanks Guys With the crank broke I have lots of time to do this.
Note the bridge washer in the photo Royce supplied above. The washer part is stamped into the bridge. Some of the earlier bridge washers have a separate washer that does the same thing.
Here it is taken apart. Wish that someone would make them correctly today.