The Kay Fleischmann Special – A Jewel-Like Early Supercharged T Racing Car: This very interesting photo shows the Kay Fleischmann Special parked next to a Duesenberg straight eight apparently just before the start of a race. It appears that the Fleischmann Special was built by Green Engineering and it is equipped with one of their superchargers as seen out in front of the Miller-style radiator. See and learn more @ http://theoldmotor.com/?p=99626
I'm having trouble seeing what, other than a wheel in each corner, this chassis has in common with a Model T.
Gil, It is based on a Model T Ford w/ a T block, trans and rear end and In thing a few more T parts.
It is one of the most advanced of its type and we will be doing a series of posts on The Old Motor starting tomorrow morning all about the T racing equipment that was available from about 1915 on.
Here is a link to three pages of Fronty Ford related posts and Model T accessories http://theoldmotor.com/?s=Frontenac+Ford
Thank you for the heads up about the thread on the racer using the Model T engine.
I’m not quite sure why your profile has you listed as this being your second posting on the forum when you have been posting for a good while and mentioned your “Old Motor” web site back in 2011 at http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/179374/253132.html?1323897492 . It is amazing what was offered for to make the Model T into a very competitive race car – winning the 1922 Pike’s Peak climb, coming in 5 in the Indianapolis 500 etc. And of course still competing even after the Model A Fords came out.
Some of the supercharger photos & text on your site appear to have come from the “Ford Dealer and Service Field” 1926 – reprinted on pages 173-175 of “Model T Ford in Speed and Sport.” If you are looking for additional leads on the what Green manufactured, there is one small paragraph on page 66 of “The Fast Ford Handbook” by Murray Fahnestock. “IF” Green patented his speed equipment, then the patents might offer some additional details.
Again thank you for sharing the information and the link to the additional details. Racing Model Ts and Model T parts is a unique part of our hobby. See: http://www.mtfca.com/HOF/speedster.html I would guess that the Northwest Vintage Speedsters would also appreciate a link to that page.
Hap l9l5 cut off
I can't believe that car has a T engine in it. Nothing suggests that it is based on a T chassis.
As they continue their research they should be able to confirm what type of engine or engines powered the Kay Fleischmann Special. It was not uncommon to swap engines in race cars. Usually folks would stick with the same basic type of engine as the mounts and ever thing were set up for that one already. I'm looking forward to what they continue to discover about that car.
Note the Ford powered cars that raced at Indy 1922-1924 did not look much like a T either but they were powered by a T block with the Frontenac head. There are some photos and a good write up on pages 164-168 of Lindsay Brooke's book "Ford Model T The Car that Put the World on Wheels." If you go to: http://books.google.com/books?id=dvZjf-4qbeAC&pg=PA165&lpg=PA165&dq=1922+Ford+indy+car&source=bl&ots=0mHPJEaVA5&sig=aJ0CrzGPjXV-sU_o-LVhEUmET1w&hl=en&sa=X&ei=VjpJUo6kJ5GE9QS194GIBA&ved=0CEAQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=1922%20Ford%20indy%20car&f=false and then page 164 it is a fascinating part of Model T Ford history. Fronty-Ford powered might be the better way to describe them.
The Ford Powered 1922 Indy car is shown below:
And a Barber-Warnock 1923 Ford powered Indy car is shown below:
And one of the three Barber-Warnock Ford powered specials in the 1924 Indy race. Henry, Edsel, and Barney Oldfields.
Note according to the information on the MTFCA RACERS and SPEEDSTERS of FAME at: http://www.mtfca.com/HOF/Fame.htm BARBER-WARNOCK FORD SPECIAL NO. 27
Inducted 2005 The three cars, numbered 26, 27, and 28, were assembled primarily of Ford production parts (75% indicated) plus Frontenac race parts produced by the Chevrolet Manufacturing Company, also from Indianapolis. Photo below is from: http://trackthoughts.com/2008/09/13/2008-mhar-race-gp-1a/
I had found a Flicker photo site that had lots of the old photos -- but I cannot locate it again so I am not able to post the link.
See also: http://www.rokemneedlearts.com/carsindepth/wordpressblog/?p=3483
And I enjoyed the photo that shows Indy driver Jimmy Clark in a Model T Sprint car in the background and the Lotus-Ford from 1965ish in front. It is copyrighted but can be viewed at: http://www.autogiftgarage.com/carculture/2011/10/jimmy-clark-in-a-sprint-car/ While that is NOT a T that raced at Indy – it is still a nice photo showing the contrast between the 1920s and 1960s.
Hap l9l5 cut off
Here is a photo from the Green catalog showing the chassis and specifications of a slightly different variation from the supercharged car at the beginning of the post.
All the info and details are here http://theoldmotor.com/?p=99626
That is a nifty illustration of the chassis, showing how it works with the Ford driveline. At $750 for just the chassis, you could buy two new Fords for that money.
There was some much engineering and new parts in the Green design, they look very professional, but I wonder why bother with the Model T connection. The above design seems to use the front chassis cross member, the pan and the rear axle which is modified. I gather they used the two speed transmission with reverse removed. I wonder if they used the Ford transmission brake?
I wonder if they used the Ford transmission brake?
Tony, Most of the time in T Ford racing cars the Ford transmission was used. The flywheel was turned down to as small as possible and reverse was left out. Special small flywheels were also produced.
Later on as we will show in the series http://theoldmotor.com/?p=102142 after the Model A came out, many of the speed merchants made special lower crankcase for use with an AR Model A multiple disc clutch. You can see one here http://theoldmotor.com/?p=44904