Ruckstell shifts by itself

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2013: Ruckstell shifts by itself
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Moorehead on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 10:11 am:

I am having some issues with Ruckstell shifting itself. I did not realize really what was going on and because while backing the car out of the garage on a very slight incline, I ran into the wife's car and that cost me $1,000. When it would not stop when the brake was applied and because I did not think quick enough to engage the parking brake. Then is when I realized I had the problem. All this happened within 15 feet of travel and in the blink of an eye. It has been shifting good with no problems for the past 6 years and now this.
It shifts from low to high and back again with a solid snap, but one more time since "the accident" in the driveway, it has popped out.
I feel like it is something in the shifter, but not positive. Anyone have any ideas before I tear into it?
By the way, it was the huckster that I was driving when "the accident" happened. The collision was at the corner of the rear wood body and did very minor damage. But it tore the heck out of the plastic bumper on the GMC Envoy, like I said, $1,000 worth.
Thanks for any comments!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 10:38 am:

What you are saying is it jumped into neutral when the load was let off. The 6 years may have been borrowed time and it's time to tear it down for a rebuild and to add outside brakes as it sounds like you don't have them. Could be the detentes are worn, plunger spring is weak, or the teeth are worn in several parts. I would go with worn teeth as a Ruckstell should not have a neutral of any kind.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Gumbinger, Kenosha, WI on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 10:48 am:

Tom - Do you have the early style shifter or the late style?

Just wondering...

Thanks, Keith


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 11:45 am:

Glen Chaffin has written an MTFCA book on Ruckstell repair and restoration, and he sells the new parts. This sounds like a case where the book would be a good investment.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Robinson Salty Bottom, AL on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 02:04 pm:

Tom, maybe Stan Howe will chime in on this because he has rebuilt many.

There was a time when Chaffins didn't have any LH axle casings available so I purchased a rebuilt unit from Stan a couple of years back and am very pleased with the axle.

Just a note the he put the "long nosed shifter" on it and all shifts are smooth and positive. The long nose also has a built in grease fitting that helps, also.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By michael grady on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 02:42 pm:

Glad you're safe Tom.. Sounds like it could have been much worse.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Moorehead on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 02:58 pm:

Actually the internals all look good. I'm wondering if the spring in the shifter is weak. It has rocky mountains on it already. But when your backing up and trying to look behind so as not to hit anything and then you find out you have little or no braking action, it gets kind of fun for a second or two.
And it appears this only happens after a shift has just been completed. I have tried to get it to act up under different load conditions and it does well. Both instances were after a shift. Keep it in high or low, and no problems.
It has a small plunger!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Schedler, Sacramento on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 03:12 pm:

How often do we have to say: DO NOT install a Ruckstell or a Worford unless you have alternative brakes. (Rocky Mountain or Discs) . The RM brakes that I had did work when backing up.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan B on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 04:27 pm:

Hal - Sounds like he had RM brakes.

Tom - Have you had this axle apart? Is it a large or a small drum?

It may not be much comfort, but hitting your own car in your driveway sounds much better than being out on the road when it happened.

I rebuilt my ruckstell, and have not had any problems with it. Sounds like it was trouble free for you too. I'll be interested in what you find.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Schedler, Sacramento on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 07:58 pm:

I just re-read Tom's last post and this time I read more careful. Sorry, but having aux equipment in the drive line w/o outside brakes has become a pet peeve of mine. Milt Webb is concerned that our old cars may be banned from the highways and byways if we keep having accidents. Drive safe.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Saturday, October 19, 2013 - 09:24 pm:

How can you tell that the internals look good? Did you have it apart 6 years ago? You can't tell much by looking in the shifter hole.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Page on Sunday, October 20, 2013 - 02:57 am:

Tom ,
It is more than likely that the P 146 Sliding Gear is worn enough that the gear doesn't remain engaged. I had a problem many years ago with a worn P146. The R/axle kept jumping out of low.

Regards, John


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Moorehead on Sunday, October 20, 2013 - 07:49 am:

I may get into the tear down soon. The actual question is, only when shifting,is there a a potential problem in the shifter that would allow it not go go all the way in whatever position and stop in the middle? I can not make it jump out of gear in any condition. Believe me, I have tried. I just can't help but believe it is something in the shifter.
And agree about the brakes. Ruckstells should have auxiliary brakes and this car does. I just wish I could make it do it one more time and don't seem to be able to. I guess I could just drive it in high.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Sunday, October 20, 2013 - 09:03 am:

It has happened twice without anyone getting killed. Third time is coming. You just don't know when.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Smith on Sunday, October 20, 2013 - 09:53 pm:

I'm willing to bet, you have a lot more slop internally than the sliding gear shown. I'd take it apart and check it out.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Schedler, Sacramento on Sunday, October 20, 2013 - 11:02 pm:

On Saturday, November 16, Milt Webb is coming to my shop and giving a hands on seminar on the Ruckstell. We'll check all the parts for wear as we disassemble a rear end and put it back using new parts as needed. Tom, you, or anyone else, is invited. to join us. Waffles with ham, fruit, real maple syrup, real butter, coffee and juice. We call it our "Awful Waffle Seminar" and we do it quite often during the non-touring months...rain


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Schedler, Sacramento on Monday, October 21, 2013 - 01:37 am:

Don't know how the period snuck in there after "invited".


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Glen Chaffin on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 07:21 pm:

A properly rebuilt Ruckstell will never go into neutral regardless of which Ruckstell shifter you have. However, I cannot agree with Hal Schedler more. Outside Brakes are a good investment for any Model T.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Moorehead on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 08:56 pm:

Hal
Thanks for the invite but it is a little too far to come to eat waffles in CA when I live in KY.
But it sounds like a fun and informational time. Wish it were closer.
Tom


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Moorehead on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 08:59 pm:

Hal
Thanks for the invite but it is a little too far to come to eat waffles in CA when I live in KY.
But it sounds like a fun and informational time. Wish it were closer.
Tom


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