POORMAN'S RAJO ADAPTER PLATE

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Model T Ford Forum: Classifieds: POORMAN'S RAJO ADAPTER PLATE
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott J Hansen on Thursday, September 21, 2017 - 03:22 pm:

HI MY NAME IS SCOTT J HANSEN, I HAVE FINISHED ALL THE ORIGINAL DESIGN WORK, CNC PROGRAMS AND HAVE MACHINED QUANITY 12 PRODUCTION ADAPTER PLATES AND BILLET WATER ADAPTERS I CAN START SHIPPING NEXT WEEK. THE CURRENT PRICE IS $560.00 FOR THE TWO PIECE SET , I WILL TRY TO POST SOME PHOTOS SOON, THANK YOU


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees _____Tax Capital, NY on Thursday, September 21, 2017 - 08:13 pm:

Scott, what other details do you have. What head gaskets are used? What is the typical final compression? Do you include any hardware or a Bill Of Materials needed to use the adapter? Pics would be great.

Very interested.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Nevada Bob Middleton on Thursday, September 21, 2017 - 09:14 pm:

I to waiting like Chad like here more details
Jern setup years ago had the info


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Friday, September 22, 2017 - 04:04 pm:

Gentlemen:
I have posted several photos of Scotts Poormans Rajo adapterplate system ...this adapts the 4 cylinder Chevrolet cylinder heads of the late teens thru 1928 to the model T Ford block giving an efficient crossflow overhead valve cylinder head ...while the later 1927 or 1928 dual port head is preferred the earlier single port head can also be used ...this setup uses the 8 valve overhead valve head gasket that several parts suppliers currently sell to seal between the Ford block and the adapter plate and the stock Chev. headgasket to seal the Chev. head to the adapter plate ...the buyer will receive the machined adapter plate and front water outlet ...216 Chev. pushrods were modified and used for the prototype plate ( shortened) ...the standard Chev. rocker arms were used ...as with any performance application there can be many configurations used ...a stock camshaft may be used or a modified profile cam ...the adapter plate can be milled to increase compression or the chambers can be modified to suit the individual needs ...this is a performance modification and it is recommended that a person have experience with this type of application ...{\popjpeg792401,poormans rajo} {\popjpeg792402front adapter }


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Friday, September 22, 2017 - 04:13 pm:

wtf? photos did not load ...poormans rajofront plate


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott J Hansen on Friday, September 22, 2017 - 08:31 pm:

THANK YOU GENE FRENCH, FOR YOUR COMMENTS AND HELP. GENE STARTED THIS DESIGN MANY YEARS AGO , HE IS BUSY BUILDING HIS NEW HOUSE, AND HE KNEW I HAD OPEN TIME ON A MATSUURSA MACHINING CENTER WITH 30 TOOL CHANGER, IT IS A COMPLETEY NEW DESIGNED BY GENE FRENCH AND MY SELF. THE WATER ADAPTER IS MADE OF BILLET ALUMINUM AND THE MAIN ADAPTER. A ORIGINAL FEATURE IS THAT THE WATER ADAPTER ALSO BOLTS DOWN TO THE MAIN ADAPTER PLATE TO STOP WATER LEAKS. GOOD QUESTIONS GENTLEMEN . THE COMPRESION RATIO IS ONLY ONE MEASUREMENT. THE REASON RACERS STARTED USING OVERHEAD VALVE HEADS IS FOR HUGE INCREACES IN AIR AND FUEL FLOW TO WIN RACES. ARE YOU WILLING TO PORT THE HEAD, BIG CARBS, THE ENGINE IS A AIR PUMP , IN 1922 A T MODEL AVERAGED 85 MPH FOR THE INDY 500 WITH AN AVERHEAD VALVE HEAD , AS THE RACING NEEDS LOTS OF WORK TO WIN RACES, IF THE COMPRESION IS TO HIGH YOUR STOCK CRANKSHAFT WILL NEVER LAST FOCUS ON MAX AIR FLOW AND BIG CARBS, AND VERY DETAILED DESIGN , PREPARE TO WIN RACES, THANKS GENTLEMEN...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Friday, September 22, 2017 - 08:32 pm:

Would the adapter for the water outlet be available separately? There are a number of guys out there that have the plate but not that piece. With or without the passage done at the bottom where it sits on the plate.
That is a great looking adapter plate! Very nice work.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees _____Tax Capital, NY on Friday, September 22, 2017 - 11:13 pm:

Scott, Your right, the compression is only part of the equation. I understand there are many variables to that, but at the least we should have a chamber volume of the plate, or an idea of what a standard T piston + adapter with gaskets and Chevy head add up to.

Of course static compression will help in factoring Dynamic compression when combined with cam duration (gross and @ .050"), intake valve closing points, cam lobe centerlines, to help match the flow potential of the users head (assuming dual port) in question (has it been ported, what CFM does it flow on a good and worse port of both intake and exhaust and at what lift?

Yes, there is alot to it, but some basic numbers to get you (us, me) started would be nice, and compression static ratio of an average combination would be nice to know.

Also, I didn't see, but is the main plate aluminum or steel? I saw it was written that the water outlet plate was aluminum.

I really like the fact this uses stock off the shelf gaskets, I have heard that can not be done. I am also hoping there will be support or postings on how to achieve the final parts outcome/ build.

Please mark me down for one, I will contact you tomorrow with my info.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Lorentz K. Lorentzen, Norway on Saturday, September 23, 2017 - 01:43 am:

Can this plate also be used with the 3 port olds head?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees _____Tax Capital, NY on Saturday, September 23, 2017 - 06:40 am:

Scott, PM sent to you with some of my info.

Thank You.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 11:36 am:

Lorentz:
the Chev. 4 cyl. head and Olds 4 cyl. 3 port head have the same head bolt pattern ...the 3 port reference is for the exhaust port configuration ...probably did not make a significant difference in performance and is a rare head ...the 3 port exhaust head was also used on Buick trucks ... also a rare application ...the Chev. 4 cyl. is still common and available and in addition to the cool factor make for a noticeable improvement in performance ...this application is not for the average owner who wants a simple bolt on mild improvement ...this will require the fabrication of intake and exhaust manifolds and some experiment with carburetor(s) and ignition ( distributor )...all doable with basic mechanical knowledge and fabrication skills ...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees _____Tax Capital, NY on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 12:27 pm:

Still waiting to hear back from Scott from the pm I sent. I have been wanting this for a while now.

Gene, should be no reason the stock coils can't provide the ignition. Stock exhaust manifold and intake can be used, my setup has a model A carb on it so I'll try that first.

Hoping a water pump is not needed, but will run one if need be. I hear conflicting info both ways.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott J Hansen on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 01:19 pm:

I believe the compressing ratio will be around 8 to 1. All materials are 6061-t6 billet aluminum, the plate started at one inch . will finish fly cutting it flat finish deburing this week, currenly there no extra hardware at this time Im next focus is on machining the chevy head pushrod cover also will be billet aluminum. a stock Model T, water outlet bolts right up. Sorry I was out of town for the weekend... Currently the price for the two piece set is $560.00 plus a shipping and insurance should around $35.00 in the lower 48 states. this is first the time i have used this website, I will have Gene French show the website works. I have been busy doing the CAD-CAM CNC programs making all the fixture plates etc. My shop name is Hansen Engineering and for most all the last forty years have designed new prodocks for modern race motorsports... Gene French is the engine expert on vintage autos


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Van Maanen on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 01:23 pm:

Scott pm sent


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott J Hansen on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 01:28 pm:

The main plate Is Priced at $500.00 and the water adapter is priced at $60.00 THIS A MATCHED SET ! , the water adapter will not work right on other peoples plates, Thanks for all the interest!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 05:41 pm:

Chad:
the stock ignition will work fine ...the engine I assembled 14 yrs. ago as a test base had a lightened flywheel with no magnets or field coil ,so a distributor was necessary ...I used the Chev. exhaust manifold and built a simple intake using cast steel elbows that are used for stair railing ...I also used a waterpump since this engine was in a test stand ...always an optimist ...Gene French


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 05:48 pm:

While the information in below postings is directed at 4 cylinder Chevrolet engine there is some info on the flow using the 3 port Olds head.

http://vcca.org/forum/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/156799/gonew/1/What_is_ the_ultimate_chevy_4_r#UNREAD

From what I read, the 3 port Olds head really does not add a whole lot over the 2 port Chevrolet. (Ok it does have the wow factor! :-) )


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike-Iowa on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 06:42 pm:

For anyone going to Hershey and interested in either a Chevy or Olds overhead with the Jern adapter plates, the valve cover, the correct intakes and exhaust manifolds, and related head gaskets. Let me know and I will consider bringing the whole kit and kaboodle to Hershey. Mike


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees _____Tax Capital, NY on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 07:30 pm:

Gene, show Scott how to get PM's, I am interested in one of these.

The fact that you can uses off the shelf head gaskets vs Jern's special headgasket is one of the big decision factors in my interest in this. I was going to spend the hours myself to figure it out, but no need to if you did.

Gene, do you have photo's of the pushrod arrangement on this set up? Are they one piece or two? Do you use the old block valve guide and ream for just a light clearance? Or do you hog them right out? Did you bend the rocker arms to line up with the T valve guides?

I have my theorys and speculations on all this, but still in the gathering stage. Everyone shows adapting the head, no one seems to be handing out valvetrain information.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike-Iowa on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 08:04 pm:

Chad, you can get the correct gasket that Mr. Jern used from Olson's gaskets, I just had one made by them within the past month. Olson's knows the subtle difference between the gasket needed for the Chevy versus the Olds heads. Mike


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 09:51 pm:

Chad:
I have shown Scott how to PM ...the 8 valve overhead gaskets that Snyder's and others sell can be modified by simply using Scotts adapter plate as a pattern to position the 2 holes that will be drilled at the center of the T block to allow flow from the T block into the existing Chev. water passages ( 9/16" diameter holes) ...Scott milled arc segments at the rear of the adapter to allow water flow between the T block and Chev. head ...the 8 valve overhead gasket already has this passage that corresponds with the T block ...with my unit I machined a spherical counterbore into the old T solid tappets to form a socket for the 1 piece pushrods ...the pushrods were made by modifying 216" Chev. pushrods ( shorten) the existing stock Chev> rocker arms have adjusting screw and locknuts for valve adjustment ...I did bend the 2 center rocker arms slightly to correct alignment with the pushrods ...the Chev. 216" pushrods are 1/4" diameter and do not require oversizing the old 5/16" Ford valve guides ...I did use a waterpump on my test unit ...did not try thermosyphon cooling ...I did use a Atwater-Kent distributor since I wanted centrifugal advance ignition ...hope this answers some of the questions ...always an optimist...Gene French


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By mark lewis on Monday, September 25, 2017 - 11:18 pm:

Btt


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Lorentz K. Lorentzen, Norway on Tuesday, September 26, 2017 - 01:09 pm:

I have obtained an engine that I believe is Oldsmobile. It has the 3 port head on it. If the condition is good I would like to try it out with an adaptor plate. If bolt pattern and water passages and gaskets are the same I would be interested in an adaptor plate. Just need to save up some money...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Lorentz K. Lorentzen, Norway on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 - 06:13 am:

Do you plan to offer a bolt and nut package also? With everything needed for installation of the adaptor plate and head.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Barrett in Auburn Ca. on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 - 12:59 pm:

Neal Jern made me a special plate for the Olds head. Minor differences in the water ports and the front outlet is different. There is a complete 3 port Olds engine available in the Santa Rosa, Ca. area. I got the impression it is priced to go.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Saturday, September 30, 2017 - 12:09 pm:

BTT


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott J Hansen on Tuesday, October 03, 2017 - 02:45 pm:

Hi gentlemen I have sold four of the first batch of 12 plates I will pay the shipping to make things easier for my customers, I will order all the hardware needed today


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Lorentz K. Lorentzen, Norway on Wednesday, October 04, 2017 - 07:41 am:

Hello Scott!

Will you ship to Europe?
Can you tell me the price of a kit with all hardware? Will gaskets also be included?

Lorentz


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William Weiss on Wednesday, October 04, 2017 - 05:53 pm:

Found my donor engine hope to order adapter kit soon


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Greg Zimmermann on Tuesday, October 17, 2017 - 07:51 pm:

I am interested in an adaptor plate kit. I sent you a PM a week or so ago and have not heard if they are still available. If they are please let me know.
Thanks
Greg


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees _____Tax Capital, NY on Tuesday, October 17, 2017 - 08:15 pm:

Greg, please be patient. Maybe Gene can prompt Scott to look at his PM's. I get the feeling Scott is not very computer savvy, and this site isn't the most user friendly for some if you don't know what to do.

I don't want to post his number without his permission, but I did just talk to him two nights ago.

Mine should be at departing his post office today. I will post some pics when mine arrives.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Friday, October 27, 2017 - 12:37 pm:

BTT


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