This horn is (according to my research) for an early torpedo. It is in barn find shape but could very easily be restored. The short piece of tubing towards the rubber bulb has cracks in it but the main tubing looks to be very solid and original. It has a reed in it too.
$450 plus shipping
Call Daniel 831-278-2742
I don't think it's what you're thinking. The ugly Torpedo horn in 1911 was like so:
I think it's a single twist version of that horn. It's got the same "bell" shape.
There is enough photographic evidence from period pictures that this type horn with the double twist was used along with the more rare but often photographed Saxon horn on the Torpedo. Even the more familiar double twist horn seen on the ford products from 1909 to early 1912 was used on the Torpedo. The exception to this is evidence from photographs of an almost original 1912 Torpedo that indeed had this type single twist horn mounted, reference (Model T Ford, the car that changed the world, pages 120-122.)
I can see it on the 1912. I took "early" to mean 1911. In all the era photos I have collected of '11 Torpedo / Open Runabout, none show this horn. I'm not picking, just trying to identify it. I don't think it's another "version" of the Saxon so to speak, it is just a different horn. The bell on the Saxon is still different with no flare at all in addition to other differences.
The standard production Rubes double twist that you see in era photos of 1911 T/OR cars appears on the earliest with features like one-piece spindles, and then it goes away shortly thereafter when you can tell they are later production cars. It is said the Saxon was used to accommodate the hood opening issue since T/OR used a narrower firewall. When they went from a standard Rubes to the Saxon seems to be a production change and not intermingled. I've never seen a Saxon on a 1912, but '11 and '12 Torpedo's are completely different animals.
I don't mind the debate. I appreciate it that you're taking the time to figure out what this is.
It's fun to learn.
So, the '12 Torpedo with the "big" horn has a longer conduit running outside the car. Given that this horn is the reverse and it looks as though the conduit would have to punch through the firewall, does it run inside the car and up to the inside of the cowl?
The second photo here has been seen before. Fairly new car with no outside conduit. This thread would indicate it's a later 1912 horn, which makes sense because in the evolution of things it's much like what we see come along in '13 and '14:
I would like to see an original photo of a car with that horn on it. I've never seen the documentation or proof, but i do find it interesting in design.
$400 plus shipping
I have a 1911 Torpedo and yes it does have a peculiar looking horn. If you do a Google search for 1911 Torpedo horn you will see several MTFCA links on the topic. If you go to those you will see original pictures and some of cars that have been restored (See Craig Beek's) Senior national winner. I have seen horns like Daniel's but it is actually different from those I have seen in that the open end of the horn tips downward instead of straight ahead as Daniel's does. I got one with my documented 1911 Torpedo and I also got another from the late Jim Reed who was an expert at restoring brass. I believe that Jim did know his stuff. I have also seen Torpedo's , especially 1912's with the more customary double twist Rubes horn. As you know 1911 Torpedos are different from 1912s in terms of hood length and steering column length, to mention two notable differences. This stuff is fun isn't it? Mike
I love these discussions! If I am pretty sure I know something? (Although I have been proven wrong a few times?) I will jump in. If I do not know enough? I just read and try to learn.
Im confused, is there an original picture that shows this exact horn mounted on a torpedo?
I'm open to reasonable offers. Also I'm enjoying reading this discussion
I agree with your observation and question: is there an original picture that shows "this exact" horn mounted on a Torpedo. I honestly have never seen a picture of a 1911 Torpedo with that particular version of the Saxon horn. I have seen pictures and actually have another version that has a less pronounced, if not absent, flare at the screened end. The screened end also points slightly downward when mounted on the firewall. I know that when I was searching for another one it took a very long time to find one and it was pretty pricey. I was told they are not just lying around in abundance. I personally like the more conventional horns better for looks but what i described above is what car #48,799 came with.
Torpedo gets thrown around as though they are all the same, but 1911's and 1912's are completely different cars. 1912's don't have near as many unique parts as a 1911.
I have era photos of 1912's that show the typical horn and conduit on the outside. I also have photos of 1912's that show no conduit, but the area where the horn would be is obstructed.
On P. 112 or McCalley's book shows three catalog illustrations of the '12 Torpedo, one with this horn:
1. Earliest: two-piece dash and a lower fore door with a double-twist horn, conduit, and bulb outside the body.
2. Early 1912: one-piece dash, higher door, and double twist horn.
3. July 1912: single-twist black and brass horn with bulb inside the body (that seems to be what is for sale here).
I have never seen anything showing the horn for sale on a 1911 Torpedo / Open Runabout.
Early '11 Torpedo with typical double-twist Rubes or NonPareil horn.
Later '11 Torpedo with Saxon "Torpedo horn".
Mid '12 "high door" with typical double-twist horn.
Later '12 "high door" presumably equipped with horn listed for sale here.
(Message edited by Wmh on October 26, 2017)
Look at the different side lamps on the later '12 and the inside of the head lamps on the mid '12.
Mystery solved. There it is as stated above.
Again it's in Bruce's book page 121: