Poormans RAJO adapter plate and front water outlet adapter

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Model T Ford Forum: Classifieds: Poormans RAJO adapter plate and front water outlet adapter
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Saturday, July 21, 2018 - 05:38 pm:

I have agreed to market these plates and offer my insight to prospective buyers regarding the needed materials and installation process … this aluminum adapter plate bolts to the model T block and allows the addition of the 1928 4 cylinder Chevrolet 2 exhaust , 2 intake port cylinder head … AKA POORMAN"S RAJO … this is NOT a simple bolt on installation and does require some fabrication of linkages , exhaust system and possibly intake / carburetor … as well as choices of ignition and cooling modifications … this is not a project for the weekend or for someone that doesn't want to modify any stock items … and can produce excess stresses on the basic engine and drivetrain components … the WOW factor is great though and fits with a period correct speedster or track racer ...price is $575 plus $25 postage in lower 48 states ...actual postage outside this area or INTERNATIONAL … Gene French ph. 970-581-2808 pay-pal perferedrajo1poormans rajo


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry K. Lee on Saturday, July 21, 2018 - 06:28 pm:

Gene,

Neal Jern is smiling wide at you.

All the Best,

Hank in Tin-A-See


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Sunday, July 22, 2018 - 09:37 am:

Hank:
thank you … this is based on a plate that I had manufactured 16 years ago … my neighbor Scott took this design and modified the water channels to eliminate the drilled thru passages at the rear … the " cresent " shaped channels intersect the T water passage on 1 side of the plate and the 2 holes on the Chev. head on the other side ...you still need to drill 4 9/16 holes in the T block to match the Chev. head water passages … I had never seen a Jern plate , so this is not a copy … there are similarities due to the fact that the T block is the same and the Chev. head is the same ...this plate is patterened for the 1928 2 port Chev. head … the 3 port exhaust Olds/Buick ( also Chev.) head can be used with some modification to the water passages … also the earlier single exhaust port Chev. head will work … I used a water pump on my design … always an optimist


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry K. Lee on Sunday, July 22, 2018 - 09:50 am:

Gene,

Neal was such a great guy such as yourself, gave more to others and wanted nothing in return but a smile on peoples faces. I have some of Neal's original kits, we modified here and there. As with any engineering, product improvement to meet the needs as they arise. Yes, your channels are an excellent improvement for sure. Keep up your FANTASTIC Work!

All the Best,

Hank in Tin-A-See


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Wednesday, July 25, 2018 - 12:29 pm:

Gentlemen :
have had several inquiry's regarding COMPRESSION RATIO … the chamber size in plate is 150 cubic centimeters ...the piston projection above cyl. block is 44.23 cubic centimeters … assuming the 2 gaskets will be 4 mm thick total then the resulting chamber size with piston at top dead center is just over 128 cubic centimeters … with stock bore and stock piston projection that would result in a static compression ratio of 5.64:1 … this could be increased by milling the plate , milling the block , or decreased by using thicker gaskets … I prefer the thinnest gaskets practicle ...always an optimist gene French 970-581-2808


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Cole ---- Earth on Wednesday, July 25, 2018 - 01:05 pm:

I have a complete 28 chevy engine,overhauled and was ready for reinstall except for carb and starter.The car was sold and sadly street rodded.I got the engine on a trade.I also have a old stuck 28 engine a fellow T fellow gave me that was from his family's car many years ago.
So I have those basic components.If I were doing something like a overhead conversion ,I would probably refurbish the head from the non runnable engine.

Would it be possible to post a summary of what other parts would be needed if these 2 parts were bought? Also any machining that would need to be farmed out? Just wanting to know if this is a obtainable goal for me or if it is something I need to get back out of my mind.:-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Wednesday, July 25, 2018 - 06:58 pm:

Mack Cole:
I will describe the operations I did when I fit my adapter plate and 28 Chev. head …
I made 1 piece pushrods from 235" 6 cyl. Chev. solid tappet pushrods ( truck )...I shortened as needed and machined a radius on the bottom end … my plate was .781 " thick (20mm) ...the plates that are listed are 1" so the pushrod would be longer … I cut about 1 1/4 " from the 235" pushrods … I used the cupped end with the original 28 Chev. rockers and adjuster screws … these pushrods are .281" diameter and fit thru the existing T valve guides … this pushrod has sufficient strength for the original Chev. valve springs and probably springs with a higher pressure rating …
for the lifters in the T block I took standard solid T lifters and machined a concave radius in the end using a 5/16 carbide ballend endmill … I made this radius about 1/4" depth to help retain the pushrod in the event of valve float …
I used the stock Chev. valve cover with felt oiling pad inplace to lube the rockers/valve stems...
a bolt kit is being assembled to be offered for sale … this will include the needed grade 8 socket head screws for assembly … this will be priced when we get all hardware in hand …
the 8 valve overhead head gasket sold by several T vendors can be used on the block side of the adapter plate … you will punch 4 holes in this gasket to correspond with the Chev. head water passages … you will also drill 4 9/16 to 5/8 holes in T block to correspond with these holes … the plate is used to determine location …
I will be away from home for about 2 weeks in august so it will be difficult to respond to questions on the MTFCA site … I will be able to be contacted by phone … any sales will probably have to be shipped after Aug. 18 or within the next 2 days … hope this answers your questions … I will write up a description of my procedure when I return home ...always an optimist...gene French 970-581-2808


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Walt Berdan, Bellevue, WA on Wednesday, July 25, 2018 - 07:01 pm:

Mack,

Not a trivial undertaking, even if you had drawings for the adapter plate. More of a challenge with no drawings and I've never seen mention of drawings available. Nothing lines up quite right between the Chevy (or Olds) head and the T block. In addition to the plate handling alignment of the block to head for the cylinders, it also has to allow for/accomodate passages for water flow. Probably a fun and challenging project for a retired machinist with a full shop and lots of time but not something feasible if you had to pay someone to do as a one off.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Walt Berdan, Bellevue, WA on Wednesday, July 25, 2018 - 07:07 pm:

I suspect Gene is going to need to sell a fair number of his sets to make any money at it. As you can see in his recent description, it is not a simple bolt on and go. A good friend though had one of the early kits from Neal Jern and it made for a really strong engine. Cooling and gaskets were issues, the additional water holes Gene mentions may have helped that significantly.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Crosby Webster, NY on Wednesday, July 25, 2018 - 07:24 pm:

Gene, will this assembly fit a 26/27 without modifying the firewall?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry K. Lee on Wednesday, July 25, 2018 - 08:20 pm:

Gene,
Please send me your email so I can post you some photo's that might assist others. Just trying to help. hankpattylee@bellsouth.net
The web site does not like my photo's and the re-sizing is a pain to me.

All the Best,

Hank


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees _____Tax Capital, NY on Wednesday, July 25, 2018 - 09:12 pm:

Bill Crosby, Yes, but just barely. In fact, the rear rocker may rub on the firewall depending on where exactly the body is sitting in relation to the engine. The rear of the valve cover needs to be cut out also. All this based on what I witnessed on a conversion done by someone else. It was extremely close fitment.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Crosby Webster, NY on Wednesday, July 25, 2018 - 10:29 pm:

Chad, Thank you


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Thursday, July 26, 2018 - 10:48 am:

Gentlemen:
I will re-state that this application may require modification of stock components … my only experience with this is in a test stand and a speedster that has a homebuilt steel body with a flat firewall … a person should expect to encounter some difficulties in a modification of this type … I recommend that if you are not willing and able to fabricate components and do some test fitting and adjustments , that this is not a project you should begin …
I do not say that in a "smart alleck" manner … this is a modification that has been done for many years … possibly since the first time a garage mechanic noticed the similarities in general size and positioning of valve components … I have seen 2 examples that pre-dated WW2 , possibly earlier … of the old examples I have seen most were done in a crude manner , only 1 was well done and was Blanchard ground at some point …
this modification is doable and is very cool , BUT is NOT a strap on and go package … you will need your exhaust manifold and your choice of intake ( I used both intake and exhaust from the original Chev. motor )the exhaust required fabrication of exhaust pipe and muffler brackets and would possibly interfere with stock T floor boards, I used a Holley 1 barrel side bowl carburetor from a 1960's Ford 6 cyl. motor … this required an adapter flange to bolt to the Chev. manifold and throttle linkage … your choice of ignition … you can use the original magneto system ...BUT , most will want to reduce the flywheel weight … I used an Atwater-kent LA distributor … I also used a water pump … the list of possible modifications goes on and on … the easiest fit would be a speedster … if you wanted to fit into a 1909 without modifying any original components I would say " don't even try " … this is a very long answer to any , is it easy and will it fit , or will I have to get dirty questions … the answer is NO , MAYBE and YES … always an optimist...gene French 970-581-2808


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry K. Lee on Thursday, July 26, 2018 - 01:15 pm:

Gene,

Please feel free to post the pictures of my engines I sent you. This will give others the end results of the product.

Please note to all concerned. This system will increase you torque and horsepower by about double. So those who think just put it on an old engine and away I go, NOT. You will dump money, time, and energy but the reward is unbelievable. I have been doing this plus others for over 25 years, so please heed the advice from Mr. French. I have reach out to Gene to assist what I know in order to keep the speedster's, etc. going and to inspire others. Not a bragger just sharing the experience so others do not increase their scrap metal pile like I have and stay in your shop until 2:00 am.

The only thing I request in return is respect, meaning, no tire kicking time wasters, or my wife won't let me spend that kind of money. Well, simple put, I got out of the bottle 3 1/2 years ago from those type of people that use other human beings for there advantage, DO NOT CALL ME. I LOVE people, I am to be UTILIZED, NOT used. Knowledge is be shared.

I can lay 45 feet of black rubber out of my Dad's 1914. Just be prepared to spend money on pure fun. As I am not building anymore custom high performance T engine for others, I do have a lot of extra good stuff both vintage and reproduction, and self in house made.

I have given Mr. French first opportunity if he wishes to pursue the endeavor's I started, and shared, but please do not bug him about it as we know he gives more to us in this community than we give him.

Everybody, Have a Great Day!

All the Best,

Hank in Tin-A-See


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Thursday, July 26, 2018 - 07:49 pm:

Henry ( Hank in Tin-A-See )

I will post several of the pictures you sent ...thank you , and great work … these are a very good example of care and detailing in a speedster … they look like they would be a blast to drive and anyone would be proud to own and show …
applications such as these are the type of build that should be considered for this type conversion … a person expects to fabricate custom parts and build to suit their particular style or needs ...I encourage you to build for safety and drive like it was stolen !
3port olds3 port olds13 port olds23 port olds314 speedster15 speedster1leespeedsterleespeedster1


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry K. Lee on Thursday, July 26, 2018 - 08:08 pm:

Gene,

You took the words out of my Father's mouth. Thank You!

All the Best,

Hank in Tin-A-See


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Saturday, July 28, 2018 - 06:10 pm:

Gentlemen:
I will be away for 2 ( or more) weeks to help a friend in Maine ...I will not be able to ship any plates until I return ...I will be able to answer questions by email or phone and will try to get several new photos posted for those interested ... always an optimist...Gene French


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Tuesday, September 04, 2018 - 11:38 am:

Gentlemen:
back from Maine … will be able to ship plates and answer questions ...always an optimist...gene French 970-581-2808


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Tuesday, September 04, 2018 - 08:26 pm:

bump


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kurt Jensen on Thursday, September 06, 2018 - 09:24 pm:

I am looking for a THUNDERBOLT valve cover if you are making them. Kurt 508 five eight seven 2728


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By gene french on Thursday, September 06, 2018 - 11:39 pm:

Kurt:
these are not a copy of the Thunderbolt plate …the plate has a different chamber design and water passage setup … currently there is no plan to produce a custom valve cover ...always an optimist...gene French 970-581-2808


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