Question re L2 float

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2014: Question re L2 float
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 04:49 pm:

I replaced the float in an L 2 carburetor with one I made out of the block material that Lang's sells. I made it the same shape and size of the old one. I positioned it so the float was horizontal in the shut off position. Now I am having trouble starting the car. I suspect it may be the float height. So can someone explain to me the symptoms of a float being too high or too low. I want to adjust the float, but would like to have an idea whether to lower it or raise it.
In my situation, the car, a hand crank car, won't start after many cranking efforts. I wind up closing the needle and opening the throttle to full open position. After about 10 pulls, it fires for a second or two. Then I set the needle where it should be and in a few cranks I can generally start it. If it doesn't start then, I have to repeat all the steps. Does it sound like the float is too high or too low?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Henrichs on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 05:35 pm:

Sounds like it's flooded. With needle closed and throttle full open more air leans the mixture in the cylinders out. Float too high? Maybe new float material floats are different level. Just my 2cents. Anyone else with better idea?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Henrichs on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 05:58 pm:

Sorry for typo. Should be: new float material floats AT A different level.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 06:59 pm:

Thanks Dennis, that was my first impression when I had a hard time starting it. Just thinking out loud for a moment, you'd think the new material would float better than an old dried up cork. That made me think perhaps I should raise the float. But I like your analysis. Any other thoughts or input???


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Whelihan on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 07:23 pm:

That black stuff is called nitrophyll. If you break the molded skin of some of that stuff, it will begin to absorb fuel and become "heavy" unless it is sealed. I use clear fuel-proof airplane dope to accomplish that task. But personally, I prefer to hit a hobby shop and find a nice piece of premium natural cork, carve the float with my Dremel tool, and then seal it with three coats of fuel-proof airplane dope. Works well.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 07:42 pm:

Yes, Kevin, I've heard that this new stuff is not compatible with alcohol in todays fuels. Lang's advertises it is resistant to alcohol and other additives, though. First time I heard it absorbs fuel. I did use one made of the same material years ago and never had a problem so I took a chance with this one. I just now found another float for an L 2 that is tied with fish line in three places and coated with something, perhaps the glue you describe. I may try it first. Thanks for the input.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 08:19 pm:

I believe the new stuff is closed cell so it can't absorb gas.
My question would be, why if you were looking at Lang's didn't you just order the pre made float?
http://www.modeltford.com/item/6201L2BQ.aspx


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Whelihan on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 08:27 pm:

Richard, Nitrophyl with an unbroken skin does absorb fuel at a slower rate than if it is the porous stuff when you break the skin. However, over time if any fuel is left in the bowl, the nitrophyll float will start to absorb fuel and get heavy. Makes setting consistent metering very difficult. Once they are heavy, might as well throw them out. You can't dry them out enough to get the proper weight back again. Even straight gasoline will eventually get absorbed into those floats if left long enough. Anymore, I shut off the fuel lines of any engine that I can and run the fuel out of the bowl/or drain the bowl if I am going to let it sit for more than a few days.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bud Holzschuh - Panama City, FL on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 09:08 pm:

Richard

Just did an L2 and adjusted the float parallel to the carb surface when inverted. Car ran really well, but the L2 seems like a really easy to flood carb, especially when starting. I usually have to close the mixture a little to start.

Needle valve tight?

How does it run when warmed up and the mixture adjusted to optimum ?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould on Monday, February 17, 2014 - 11:12 pm:

Kevin, that's good to know. I doubt if I will use the material again. I like your idea of finding quality cork in hobby shops. I will have to look for the fuel proof airplane dope. I did purchase some Aero model airplane glue sometime back, but it came off in gasoline. I've used epoxy in a 5 ball with good results but its a pretty thick coat of glue and may weigh down the float some.
Didn't Ford and others use shellac? If they did, I suspect it would dissolve in alcohol. I know that I've thinned shellac with denatured alcohol when refinishing furniture.
Bud, the car runs well after it starts. I will try closing the mixture some next time I try to start it. It would be great if that's all I need to do. Thanks for the tip. I did turn a new point on the needle but didn't do a thing with the seat. I hoped that would be enough.
Mark, I did see that Langs offers the float I needed. The material I had is the same stuff Lang's float is made of. I had the old float for a pattern and a block of the material. With a lathe, they are a breeze to make. You got me to wondering, though. Perhaps the makers of these floats take into consideration the difference in weights and buoyancy characteristics and modify the new floats accordingly.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould on Tuesday, February 18, 2014 - 07:23 pm:

Update. I lowered the float and the car wouldn't start at all. I noticed a lot of fine crud in the bottom of the bowl. The carburetor was clean when I installed it, although the car sat for many years. I made a new fuel line with an inline filter and cleaned the carb. I also raised the float in the bowl. After some cranking, the car started. It doesn't seem to run quite as smooth as before. But that could just be me. I'll run it again tomorrow and see how it goes. Here's come photos.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Whelihan on Tuesday, February 18, 2014 - 07:47 pm:

Richard, May not run perfectly yet, but it is still a cool car. Hope to get one like that myself someday to keep my '26 Tudor company. Keep at it, you'll get her purring like a kitten sooner or later.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould on Tuesday, February 18, 2014 - 08:34 pm:

Thank you, Kevin. The car will be for sale at Bakersfield. I restored a Perfecto for the car if anyone wants it, although the original rear end will still be in the car. The outside of the Perfecto looks like it has never been touched but the insides are new and reworked. Both will be for sale individually or as a group as well as a bunch of pre 13 items. Time for me to lighten the load.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Todd on Wednesday, February 19, 2014 - 12:18 pm:

"I made a new fuel line with an inline filter"

I hope that filter is designed for gravity feed and not pressure feed. If not, it may not pass enough fuel to run properly.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Wednesday, February 19, 2014 - 12:32 pm:

I think most folks find that a inline filter works fine with a in cowl gas tank but not a under the seat tank. I have one on my 26 and it works well.
Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Whelihan on Wednesday, February 19, 2014 - 06:51 pm:

Richard, if it was closer I would be making you an offer on it. But, unfortunately a California car would probably throw a catatonic fit if it was exiled here to northern WI. If it sells, please PM and let me know what it sells for if you get time. That would help me price similar cars here in the Midwest.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould on Wednesday, February 19, 2014 - 07:39 pm:

Kevin the car came out of Chicago so it should be used to your cold winters. ;^) I'll send you a private email re pricing.
Ken and Jim. The type I use are the small plastic encapsulated filters you see at most auto parts counters. I have them on both my other cars that have the gas tank under the seat. Only problem I've ever experienced is after sitting all winter without gas in the tank, I sometimes have to remove the filter temporarily to get the gas flowing. I didn't want to do it with this car because I wanted to keep things original and the filter in the sediment bulb was in good shape. I kept the original gas line for the next owner to do with as he chooses.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould on Wednesday, February 19, 2014 - 07:51 pm:

Further update. The car was running too retarded. The adjustable timer rod needed another swivel as the one on there could not be threaded on any more. I find it runs and starts better. Now that it has been driven about 10 or 15 miles, it's smoothing out. It idles very well, not surprising for cast iron pistons. I'll see how well it starts in the morning, now that the timer rod is set right.


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