Rear wheel and seal installation problem.

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2014: Rear wheel and seal installation problem.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Ferguson on Sunday, March 30, 2014 - 03:09 pm:

Hi all, I inherited a '23 roadster and am trying very hard to make it road worthy. Installing new bands etc. I rebuilt the rear wheels and got new seals and keys etc. When I put the wheel on the axle and begin to tighten the nut, the wheel will stop turning freely and upon further inspection, the new end cap is basically crushed. Any ideas?
Thanks, Roger from Sparks Nevada


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Stephen D Heatherly on Sunday, March 30, 2014 - 03:13 pm:

The hub or axle shaft taper or both are worn out. Have you rebuilt the rear axle?

Stephen


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Sunday, March 30, 2014 - 06:29 pm:

Did you install inner seals? If so which ones? Which outer seals are you using? If you had the sleeves out you may not have them in all the way. Or, you do not have the caps on all the way. Most caps need to be driven on, they are a tight fit. If you are using the original outer style, did you remember to install the washer first, then the felt and lastly the cap? I would just pound out the cap and use it.
Should be from the inside out; seal, metal washer, reinstall the sleeves, install the bearings, they should sit flush or slightly in from the end or the sleeve, slide the washer, then felt the pound on the cap till it will not go on any more. If you are using the modern seal on the outside there still should be the washer to protect the seal from the bearing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Sunday, March 30, 2014 - 06:40 pm:

If you use the neoprene inner seal, some of them will not allow you to push the sleeve all the way into the housing. If you measure the amount of sleeve which protrudes out of the housing (usually about 1/16 inch)you can then pull out the sleeve and grind off the inner edge by the same amount so that it will be flush with the end of the housing when it is installed. Then install the outer bearing and seal as noted by Mark. Try on the hub without the key and tighten up. It should turn freely without binding the cap. If it still scrapes, try installing a tapered shim, which can be cut from a can or purchased from the catalog. If you get it to fit without the key, then install with the key and tighten to 100 ft lbs torque. put in cotter pin and drive around a while. Then pull cotter pin and check torque. It should stay at 100 ft lbs.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Smith on Sunday, March 30, 2014 - 09:51 pm:

I have noted the outer felt seal sometimes is way too thick. I think 3/8 to 7/16 would allow you to get that end cap on ok.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By william louis rosenthal on Monday, March 31, 2014 - 07:56 pm:

Where do the vendors selling the modern outer seals state that a washer is to be used with these new seals and what is the description of this washer? The description I've seen says "replaces cap felt and washer" says nothing about saving the washers for reuse, or requiring new washers? Regards, Scott


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gary Gregory on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 11:31 am:

Good question William. I just installed the seal only...no washer...hope i dont have to pull everything back out !


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By william louis rosenthal on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 11:55 am:

The geometry inside the cap is such that I will question whether a washer in there would result in damages. I've looked at 4 different supplier descriptions, where all 4 mention the washers being replaced, and where none mention reinstalling a washer of any description. Got to also question whether installing a washer would push the cap further outward, where you could not then get the wheel to seat. The gap between my wheel hubs and the modern seal is about the thickness of a sheet of paper.
Regards,
Scott


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 12:01 pm:

The modern inner ones from Lang's has the washer built in.
http://www.modeltford.com/item/2511AS.aspx
As does the outer;
http://www.modeltford.com/item/2510N.aspx
So you are correct.
But if the inner seal does not have the metal face it would need a washer to protect the neoprene from getting chewed up.
For the rear "(replaces 2511S inner oil seals and will not damage axle like the reproductions of the original style leather, spring and washer combination.)" the description for the outer just states it replaces the outer cap set.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gene Carrothers Huntington Beach on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 12:35 pm:

There are two Amazing seal made to prevent oil/grease for getting on the rear wheel brakes.

Bill Bohlen Antique Motor Sports at 562-691-1081 in La Habra, Ca and Glen Chaffin 951-735-4791 in Corona, Ca

Both of these guys advertise in the VF. Both seals will prevent oil leaks. The original felt washers are used only to filter the grease as it slowly wicks out on your brake linings. YMMV


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