So, how are the six T-100 Model T Fords doing?

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2014: So, how are the six T-100 Model T Fords doing?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Coiro on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 05:46 pm:

In light of today's announcement that Ford will be producing 150,000 new Model T Doctor's Coupes this year in honor of Henry's 150th birthday, I was just wondering how the six 1914 T-100's built in 2001 were doing.

Anybody got any details?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Wells on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 05:53 pm:

Last September I saw them driving around and I looked them over in their garage, they still looked like new.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Joe Van Evera on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 06:10 pm:

We were at Greenfield Village several years ago and were riding around in one of their T's. I got around to asking about the "new" T's and our driver remarked, "you're driving in one of the new ones right now!" When I asked how it compared to the other original T's that the Village had, the driver said, "Awwww, the new ones sound and drive just as junky as the old ones......" I don't know if the gentleman was a true car lover, or just doing a part-time job, but I sure got a chuckle out of his answer. By the way, wouldn't driving people around in Greenfield Village in a Model T for pay be considered THE dream job?!?!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Everett on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 06:39 pm:

Bob, is that really going to happen, or am I merely a biting fish?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erich Bruckner, Vancouver, WA on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 07:31 pm:

T-100 #5


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erich Bruckner, Vancouver, WA on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 07:32 pm:

Bill, it is true. I read it in the paper just under the article about New York getting ready to reintroduce wolves into central park.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alan Wandesforde on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 07:40 pm:

Erich, How do you keep the tires so clean and white?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Chochole on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 07:41 pm:

We were at Greenfield Village last summer and got to jawing with the driver on the new '14 and he said they drive like a dream and go all day without overheating or having any issues.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Marty Bufalini on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 08:21 pm:

Joe, I had the opportunity to drive one of the T-100's just days after it was finished. Having driven restored Ts, I had something to compare it to. It was surreal. It was so tight, and rattle-free and smooth. It was unbelievable. Guy Zaninovich, who, I think, had the lead on the project and sometimes reads this forum, will hopefully see this and comment. But driving that T-100 was something I'll never forget and almost always make comparisons when I drive my 1914 -- not bad comparisons, just comparisons.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan B on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 08:39 pm:

I bought one of the transmissions and a set of fenders off of one of the T100s at Chickasaw this year. $400 for everything on a blue tarp on the last day.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Coiro on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 08:40 pm:

Ah, Dan... I should have known better than to ask on April 1st.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Michael Rogers on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 08:42 pm:

Bill, hook, line and, sinker.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 09:29 pm:

It was a real treat talking to Guy at the press release day for the California tour.The pattern car was bought by ?? Who was also involved in the T-100. I can see his face but the name?? Bud.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By brass car guy on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 09:38 pm:

One of the interesting differences was that the new triple gears in the transmissions were made helical instead of straight cut. This made the transmisson sound completely different, in low gear or reverse. So the "new Fords" do not sound like the tried and true "T's"

just sayin,

brasscarguy


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erich Bruckner, Vancouver, WA on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 09:55 pm:

Alan, that isn't mine. It is one of the T-100s


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George_Cherry Hill NJ on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 10:00 pm:

Maybe its time for one of the guys at Greenfield to do a report for VF magazine. Would be very interesting read, I'm sure.

Bud...The pattern/typical original car was bought from Ford by Bill Leland who retired from Ford at the end of the project and I believe relocated to the southeast and uses his '14 a lot.

B.C.G...the reason an update would be nice is that it has been long enough that failures can fall by the wayside without naming names as individual vendors are long forgotten (maybe :-) ). I've heard that the new stamped crankcases failed...I have also heard that the silent triple gear-sets have failed in all and now run standard. On the triples it was Ford Transmission Engineering Department who did that so 'pffft' no harm, no foul...they didn't get a 2nd or a 3rd chance to get it right! :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 10:14 pm:

George,Yup i kept thinking Bill,but that was all i could remember! That was great fun and Lizzie and us really fell into it that day!! Bud in Wheeler.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Tuesday, April 01, 2014 - 11:55 pm:

April Fool's.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan McEachern on Wednesday, April 02, 2014 - 12:30 am:

My understanding was the T100 transmission gears
were redesigned to be 20 degree pressure angle, stub tooth spur gears and the design did not hold up very well to the constant driving in low gear that the GV cars spend a lot of time doing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Wednesday, April 02, 2014 - 04:22 am:

Bob, How is it that Steve Jelf read or heard the same thing that you did, but the rest of us missed it?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Coiro on Wednesday, April 02, 2014 - 07:04 am:

Terry, I was just giving Steve a little unsolicited help with his April Fools Day joke. Ford Motor Company isn't really going to produce 150,000 Doctor's Coupes (which is a shame because it would have been interesting to see how they would have made the car comply with today's safety and emissions standards. Imagine a Model T with side air-bags, energy-absorbing steering column, catalitic-converter and a check-engine light on the dash).

But April Fools Day is over and I find myself hoist with my own petard because I really wanted to know what was going on with the T-100 Model T Fords—and I can't be sure any of the answers I got weren't just playful jibes.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/hoist+by+own+petard

So anyway... Really, now. What's going on with the T-100 cars?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Miller, Mostly in Dearborn on Wednesday, April 02, 2014 - 07:40 am:

Dan McEachern has the tooth profile on the triple gears referenced correctly. They were not helical, they were straight cut and the teeth resembled timing belt sprockets. I can attest they ran very quietly as I rode in the cars the day they were donated to the Museum.

As time goes on, these cars become more Model T and less T-100. I know that Dave Huson donated a van load of parts to the T- garage and these parts continue to be put to good use on the T-100 and other cars within the garage. The garage keeps many spare assemblies on hand to keep the cars in daily service.

These are my personal observations and I do not presume to speak on behalf of the Henry Ford or the Ford Motor Company.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem on Wednesday, April 02, 2014 - 11:06 am:

Also, my understanding that those redesigned triple gears, while extremely quiet, did not last long and have since been replaced. Also my understanding that replacing them necessitated a change of flywheels, as the "new" style gears operated at different center distances.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George_Cherry Hill NJ on Wednesday, April 02, 2014 - 04:05 pm:

Boy, I'll bet Ford Transmission Engineering was caught by surprise since that's the case. Doesn't matter now if they have been converted back to standard...but just changing the profile to 20 degree stub, all else the same the load limit for wear should have gone up by 25%! Bending strength would have increased by 40% or so, even though I've never heard of a tooth shearing in a standard arrangement.

They must have changed the backlash apportionment, tried for a bit tighter, and just like with pins and bush bores...go a thou' tighter in that area on the 'sloppies' and you eat it for lunch.

I'd be curious to hear the whole story of the gears even via private mail. If the speeds at GV are such they are staying in low all the time, then maybe they should look at a different rear arrangement?

As someone else said...I think I could handle being a T driver at GF. Something exotic 'bout a job like that :-)

The National Park Service at Orange NJ has Edison's 'summer' T, a '22, which Bob Jablonski and I were working on and willing to keep tweaked for them, and they had the Rangers driving it on the grounds and locally...then one of them bounced off of something and I understand it's up on blocks and static display in the Carriage House now :-(


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Jablonski on Wednesday, April 02, 2014 - 04:36 pm:

George;

No longer relegated to static display,
EDISON'S 1922 Touring has been fixed, maintenance check done in late February, and Jerry has once more been assigned as driver...... the car was once again in the annual West Orange St. Patrick's Day parade.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George Scholz on Wednesday, April 02, 2014 - 10:48 pm:

Back in '03, I attended the Ford 100 year birthday party, and had a ride in one of the 6 new T's. I quizzed the driver of his "time of experience" in driving a '14 T. He replied with saying that he had about a week behind the wheel, and never saw a T until about 2 weeks prior. (He was doing an ok job.) At that time, I asked if we could change places and have me drive, but he said that the rule is, the Ford Company drivers only. (I started driving my 14 T, in '49, at the old age of 10.)(That didn't cut any ice with him.) One of the 6 was standing idle at the passenger load/unload area, with a steady flow of oil dripping out of the front seal area. It was an excellent party, and a good time was had by all. George


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Coiro on Thursday, April 03, 2014 - 12:04 am:

Odd.

You'd think there'd be so many of us wired-at-birth, antique-car devotees who would put our hearts and souls into the job that Ford would be up to its corporate ears in engaging historians, yet the company hires guides with such an I-could-take-it-or-leave-it attitude that they'll admit their lack of enthusiasm to the very people they're supposed to keep intrigued with the surroundings.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William L Vanderburg on Thursday, April 03, 2014 - 12:13 am:

That's the thing with some museums. Guides are not necessarily required to be enthusiastic about the subject....You just need to be able to repeat what you're told.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Coiro on Thursday, April 03, 2014 - 01:54 am:

I'm afraid you're quite right, William. But enthusiasm should be a minimum requirement. The folks who do the hiring should be made to understand: You don't sell the steak—you sell the sizzle!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Coiro on Thursday, April 03, 2014 - 08:08 am:

Somebody sent me a PM and gently pointed out that at the Model T garage at the Henry Ford Museum, there are a number of genuinely passionate people who have given generously of their expertise for decades. I should have seasoned my critique of casual part-timers with that qualification.

I stand humbly corrected.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Joe Van Evera on Thursday, April 03, 2014 - 10:43 am:

Again, while we were at Greenfield Village several years ago (the same visit as my previous post) we were walking around and came across a stalled T. It was the same car and driver we had been riding with an hour or two before. The driver was standing by the car and I asked if he were having troubles? "Yes," he replied, "it just quit on me." I asked if he found anything wrong with the car? He said, "I didn't even look, they're sending the tow truck." I was "dying" to look under the hood, as most Model T guys would be, and even with the "limited knowledge," that I have, one can very often find the "problem" and make a simple fix. In defense of the driver, maybe he had rules which prohibited him from opening the hood, I don't know. As Bob pointed out above, there are lots of passionate volunteers who work at GV. (I can't wait for my next visit!)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem on Thursday, April 03, 2014 - 10:49 am:

Bob,

I might also point out that Ford, (as in Ford Motor Co.), and it's "corporate ears" has nothing at all to do with "The Henry Ford" , a.k.a. "Greenfield Village", a.k.a. "Edison Institute".

And yes, the individuals who support & maintain the T's at THF are so deep into it that they make it there job, and not just their hobby. (I know the best way to ruin my hobbies would be to make them my job.) There is also a dedicated volunteer staff who are also very dedicated Model T folks. I am lucky to count them as my friends.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roar Sand on Thursday, April 03, 2014 - 11:41 pm:

I have been to Greenfield Village many times during the 47 years I lived in the Metropolitan Detroit Area, and by my ears the r.p.m., when the Ts there drive by, is low enough that they spend a lot of time in direct gear. Of course, there is also a lot of stop and go, but it is not a great testimonial to the "improved" tooth profile.


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