Is this a 1921 Huckster?

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2014: Is this a 1921 Huckster?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Phelan on Tuesday, June 24, 2014 - 10:46 pm:

Hello, I am new owner of what I think is a 1921 Huckster. I would appreciate any guidance or suggestions on getting started with my new project.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry Petrino in Modesto, CA on Tuesday, June 24, 2014 - 11:09 pm:

Let's start with the basics. Lift the left side of the hood and look for the engine serial number that should be just above the water inlet on the side of the engine. If it is a '21 year model with its original engine the number should be somewhere between a little over 4,000,000 and a little over 5,000,000.

Post the number here and one of us will pinpoint the engine date.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Phelan on Tuesday, June 24, 2014 - 11:36 pm:

Thanks, Henry. It's 5615322 so that's Dec 21 correct?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Tuesday, June 24, 2014 - 11:47 pm:

As Henry says, if it's the original engine the serial number will help you date it. Because many T's don't have their original engines, you also have to consider other features that may be clues. Then there's the car that has such a mixture if parts from different years that you just have to pick a year that fits most of it. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry Petrino in Modesto, CA on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 12:00 am:

The table in Bruce McCalley's book dates that engine number to December 7, 1921. So, since year models at that time ran August to August, your engine is a year model 1922.

If you can post a few photos of the engine, chassis, etc. maybe we can find a few clues to help you determine if the rest of the car matches as a 1922 or not.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry Petrino in Modesto, CA on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 12:04 am:

P.S. The table also says that production was "closed December 20 to January 9, 1922". Unless the table is in error, your Dec. 21 date isn't possible.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John P Noonan on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 12:06 am:

Steve, as you know my car was advertised and titled as a 1922, yet it is clearly not. Today i had to get my first inspection sticker and i had to tell a little fib in the process....The joys of owning a T.:-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Phelan on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 12:10 am:

Thanks, Henry. I typed "Dec 21" but meant December of 1921. I'll take and post some of the suggested photos in the morning. Really appreciate all of the help.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gary Schreiber- Santa Isabel Ecuador on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 09:25 am:

Cool looking speedster/huckster.
OT: made many a trip to the Great Lost Bear in Portland. Really enjoyed the wild Maine blueberry, oatmeal Imperial Stout. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 09:41 am:

Kevin -- Welcome to Model T's. You're gonna' like this! :-)

There is an MTFCA affiliate club in your neck of the woods, the Down East Model T Club. Contact info is:

Warren Kincaid
223 Broadway
Rockland, ME 04841

That's a nifty-looking little truck. You can call it a Huckster or an Express Delivery and be correct. The red part of the body is probably fairly new, and maybe homemade. That's a period-correct way to have a delivery vehicle, as most Model T deliveries were made from a bare chassis with a wooden body attached. The irons on the seat are a nice touch.

You may find that your vehicle is a mixture of different year parts, since most parts will interchange from year to year. For instance, the windshield looks like a brass one from a very early T. The hood, headlights, radiator, and wheels all look like they could be the correct ones for a '22.

Whatever year it is, it'll be a lot of fun to drive. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Phelan on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 11:24 am:

Thanks, Mike. I reached out to Warren via email but that message bounced so need to find an alternate message. Thanks for the thoughts on what you see.

Here are some additional pics







OT: Gary - Thanks and I'm a big fan of Great Lost Bear and their stouts. Lots of great beer being brewed in Maine.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 02:24 pm:

I'm glad you posted the pic of the hercules body tag. Lookie here what I found:

herc

This is a page from their catalog, circa 1921 or 22.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Garrett on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 02:52 pm:

I like your truck...got one similar myself (pic attached) - title says it's a '23. What do the windshield braces tie to on the frame?
Thanks for the infoModel t #1 (Small).jpg


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Garrett on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 02:53 pm:

I like your truck...got one similar myself (pic attached) - title says it's a '23. What do the windshield braces tie to on the frame?
Thanks for the info


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 05:23 pm:

That's not a Hercules body tag. It's the windshield hinge.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Nathan Bright on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 06:16 pm:

Please correct me if I am wrong, But I believe a Huckster has a top and closely resembles a shorter depot Hack/station-wagon.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker in Sumter SC on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 09:29 pm:

Kevin,

You will have a ball with that truck. A little bit better photos will help or having someone take a look at it will save a lot of posting.

As you look at the radiator you will notice the filler neck does not stick up much beyond the top of the radiator shell. That is not a normal configuration. When the chassis came from Ford the radiator neck was always visible starting with the first Model T and going to the last Model T. See the illustration below:



That could be the result of several different things -- an after market radiator; a radiator shell for a 1924-27 used on a 1917-1923 radiator; and probably several other things. A quick way to tell if you have a 1917-1923 size firewall -- it is 24 3/8 inches across or a 1924-25 (and 1926-27 ton truck) which is 28 inches across is to use the measurements below. You can also use the creases in a metal firewall to tell you what year range it is from. Thank you to Phil Mino for posting those great photos with the dimensions.





Not to worry – a T is a lot of fun and Ford made the parts so they could be used on many different year Ts. Henry Ford himself continued to drive and update his own T. Again welcome to the forum.

Safety warnings, cautions, and notes: If you are still young and bullet proof you may not need these but if you have a family they can help keep you and them out of harms way. Don’t panic people have been driving Model Ts safely for years. But there are a few known issues that you can learn first hand or you can read about them and learn from what others have experienced.

If your garage has a gas hot water heater or some other source of ignition for gasoline fumes – be very very careful. The float in a Model T Carb will sometimes stick (or trash will keep the valve open) and the carb will leak gasoline. Not too bad if there are no sparks. However, several homes, garages and cars have been lost when a gas hot water heater was near by and the car leaked gas. They make an accessory inline gasoline shut off as well as making a shut off that mounts on the carb or you can find a suitable one at the local hardware store. I like the looks of the ones from Lang’s but any that work will keep the gas off the floor. Also be sure the shut off on the tank works as well – as most of the ones near the carb would not be of much use if you have a carb fire.

Your truck/huckster/open express/fliver etc. has a car rear axle. Those have a babbit thrust washer starting during 1915 production. And a babbit thrust washer could have been a replacement in an earlier axle. That babbitt washer can cause the car to loose its brakes –please see the posting at: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/257047/295678.html?1339633408 for details on why you want to check and make sure to replace that with a bronze thrust washer etc. earlier rather than after they fail and the transmission brake no longer works.

Back up slowly – if the front axle is set up correctly with 5 1/2 degrees positive castor then when you are backing up it has 5 1/2 degrees negative caster when going in that direction. The front wheels will want to go full left or full right by themselves. Backup slowly and hold the wheel so you can stop it if that should happen.

From the photos you posted I cannot tell if your car has the correct for its year below the axle wishbone or if that was replaced with an earlier above the axle wishbone. Either style with the correct spring perches will fit. But Ford replaced the above the axle wishbone set up with the under the axle wishbone style spring perches to help prevent the front axle from titling backwards and causing the steering to go negative castor and the car to go hard left or right. [Note many folks say that is ridiculous – others have had it happen to them and have taken precautions. Please see: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/179374/227348.html?1312341538 which includes the story of why Henry Ford decided to move the wishbone below the front axle.
For photos of examples also please see:
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/80257/82549.html
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/154101.html?1281199176
or http://www.ebay.com/itm/Model-T-Ford-front-dual-radius-rod-support-clamp-11-18-/380513227980?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item58985b14cc for one option of adding the dual wishbone.

Other safety items (again do not panic – just be sure none of them are looking for a chance to bite you). http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/154102.html

And one of the best things you can do is to find a local chapter and join it. You will meet new friends and save hours of discovering that many Model T Ford parts easily fit more than one way but only function properly when installed correctly. The chapters are listed at: http://www.mtfca.com/clubpages/chapters.htm and http://www.modelt.org/index.php?option=com_aclassf&Itemid=17

Again welcome to the forum!

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Phelan on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 09:58 pm:

I was told the forums were great but this has exceeded my expectations as I can't thank all of you enough for the warm welcome and help.

@ Hap - Really appreciate all of the info and will take some better pics once I've further investigated.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Wednesday, June 25, 2014 - 10:23 pm:

Kevin,
OH NO!!! RED??? Oh that won't do--and the radiator neck doesn't stick up far enough--Lookit here, Son, I says, Lookit here! To save you embarrassment, I will, at no cost, take it off you hands so you won't suffer. . . . Oh wait, you're way over in Maine, oh well--guess that 'splains the red, been haulin' lobsters with that thing, eh?
Looks like lotsa fun Kevin, just enjoy it--safely though! Remember, red cars attract speeding tickets, and we all know red cars and Model Ts are Babe Magnets, but a Red Model T--ya got trouble comin' :-)
David D out in Californy.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Thursday, June 26, 2014 - 02:07 pm:

OK guys, don't let my totally tongue-in-cheek posting be the end of this thread!
And the "Lookit here" part is done with a Foghorn Leghorn voice, just in case the reference is too esoteric.
:-)
David D.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry Petrino in Modesto, CA on Thursday, June 26, 2014 - 02:19 pm:

David,

Foghorn Leghorn was one of my favorites! But even better was his nemesis, Henry Hawk. HH simply did not understand why he in never quite got a chicken dinner.

However, he did well illustrate the value of perseverance, a value important if you're gonna drive a T. :-)


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