1929 Model T engine

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2014: 1929 Model T engine
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Justin Heim on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 09:01 am:

I have an engine in my TT that dates to March 1929. Other than being the late style of engine were there any additional upgrades or advantages to the later replacement engines?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Townsend ; ^ ) Gresham, Orygun on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 10:14 am:

Justin-
There is no particular advantage to a post Model T era engine except that it is "newer."

The last Model T replacement engine was made in 1941.

: ^ )


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Justin Heim on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 10:26 am:

Thanks Keith. I have read about different alloys in the block, crank, etc. but it seems that these may just be speculation.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 04:47 pm:

Justin, I wonder if your motor has the common cast iron pistons or the late 27 pistons, commonly referred to as " tin can " pistons. They had a much larger diameter wrist pin (more like a Model A), and required a different rod to accept the larger wrist pin. Also, their rod caps had cast-in oil dippers. The caps were interchangeable with the earlier rods. All the replacement aluminum pistons that the vendors sell, only fit the earlier standard rod with the smaller wrist pin, although I once inquired with Egge and they said they had a piston that would work for the late rod. Does anyone know if all T replacement motors made after the end of 1927 production had the late rods and pistons?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Miller, Sequim WA on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 05:06 pm:

Enie Kansler said that after lots of testing that some of the last Model Ts received a new steel piston. This new piston was almost half the weight of the cast ones with a new Rod that was carried over to the model A,s.

I just read this from his reminisces Posted at The Henry Ford.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Page on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 05:25 pm:

Two very good links to past discussions regarding the later Rods & Pistons.

Regards, John, Page, Australia

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/50893/74837.html?
1228752482

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/29/12003.html


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Justin Heim on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 06:17 pm:

My engine is still assembled but I think that I'll have to pull the pan cover now and check for the dippers and look at the rods. I looked in a plug hole and could see that the piston top has a beveled edge and is not a smooth dome like the pistons in the discussions above. I'll pull the pan tonight.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Georgetown TX on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 08:14 pm:

The crankshaft in later Model T engines - those made at the Rouge and after T car production - had improved crankshafts. The earlier crankshafts were made from Vanadium steel which was fine for some things but not so good for crankshafts.

Ford's chief metallurgist John Wandersee (employed at Ford from 1902 - WWII era) tells a lot about the move away from vanadium steel in Ford products in his very interesting interview here:

http://cdm15889.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/compoundobject/collection/p15889coll2/id/ 17079/rec/219


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 08:15 pm:

Justin, the difference in the diameter of the wrist pin should be noticeable, if you have an iron piston and pin to compare. Just looking at the rod caps won't tell you as the rod caps with the cast in dippers will interchange to the earlier rods and many have been changed out with them (although the late rods are not common).


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Justin Heim on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 09:54 pm:

Well, it looks like the rods and pistons are the old style. I guess it is possible they were changed out at some point. Nevertheless, this is the first time I've seen inside of my T engine (or any for that matter) and it at least doesn't look like junk.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Wednesday, July 16, 2014 - 11:24 pm:

Justin, the amount of shine off your pistons makes them look like they're are modern aluminum replacements. I've never seen a cast iron or steel piston reflect the way yours do.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Scott Owens on Thursday, July 17, 2014 - 12:02 am:

Terry, I dont see the ridge in the bottom of the piston for the oil ring. And the rod shim looks home made so I think you are on to something. Scott


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Eckensviller on Thursday, July 17, 2014 - 12:51 pm:

Noob question here: is there a way to date a replacement engine with reasonable accuracy? Until just now I figured I'd never know any more than my T doesn't have its original mill but I'm all for dating this thing as well as I can.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Thursday, July 17, 2014 - 12:59 pm:

Tim, I'm not sure if all blocks had a casting date cast in raised numbers on the block, but apparently Justin's did.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Justin Heim on Thursday, July 17, 2014 - 02:59 pm:

I dated the engine based on the number stamped on the boss above the water neck. I used the serial number list from the encyclopedia on this site. I am not familiar with the block casting numbers. Is there a more accurate way to date them?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Thursday, July 17, 2014 - 09:39 pm:

The block casting date stopped around 21 or 22 being added to the block from what has been reported here. Generally if it has the 2 piece valve door it might have a casting date if it's the 1 piece probably not. Besides the serial motor number you have (for later blocks, not going into the early open valve blocks) the 22ish to mid/late 25 with one piece door and then the new style block (late 25 to 26) with the trans. ears mounting holes to date by.
THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS TO EVERY RULE!


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