Little Help With Ruckstell Assembly

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2014: Little Help With Ruckstell Assembly
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Wednesday, July 30, 2014 - 11:09 am:

I finally repaired my gearbox and installed the steering column and all seems well with the help of you guy's on the forum and the videos....

Now it's time to get back to the Ruckstell....I took some pictures to better explain my problem....The off set in the axle and bearing looks to me to be wrong.....I can pick the housing up but the axle goes with it and if I rotate the housing the offset goes with it also.....Is there anything I am obviously doing wrong or is something possibly bent such as the housing....I know -I probably should take it to a professional" but I like to try myself if I can get a little advice....Notice I changed to the new bearing setup....Can't see that would make a difference on my problem....Thanks Chet


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Wednesday, July 30, 2014 - 11:11 am:


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Wednesday, July 30, 2014 - 11:29 am:

Maybe a bent axle tube, they are quite common. Mine was bent and with a little selective heating I was able to straighten it right up.



Here are some threads on straightening an axle tube. Some methods more sophisticated then others.

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/80257/116815.html?1260663871

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/179374/216795.html?1307743846

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/331880/386916.html?1378582431

Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Thursday, July 31, 2014 - 10:06 am:

Thanks Jim, I have looked at all the different sights and still trying to decide exactly what approach I am going to try....If I find it is bent I hope to straiten it with out heat because I had it all powder coated before I did any checking....It all looked good when I stood them up but I think I will bolt them together and do the laser trick and check that way first and go from there...I'll let you know what I find...Thanks Chet


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Thursday, July 31, 2014 - 10:23 am:

Chester

If I understand right. Its your RIGHT housing that is bent. If it is the RIGHT housing, stand back, and throw it in the scrap pile and get another one. There must be piles of them in Tennessee. I must have 30 or better housings.
If you were here and its the LEFT side I would press out the long part of the housing and slip in a new one, its easy if you have the correct tools

One of the tools

tool


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Thursday, July 31, 2014 - 11:43 am:

It looks like your "offset" is front to back rather than up and down. Have you installed the driveshaft and radius rods yet? It could be that the radius rods will square the drive shaft tube with the axle housing. If that doesn't do the trick, you will need to bend the axle tube. Probably sometime in the past your rear wheel hit something hard such as backing into a curb and bent the tube. You should get the axle centered in the tube because if you drive it like it is now, it will cause flexing and eventually metal fatigue of the axle causing it to break.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Seth from NC on Thursday, July 31, 2014 - 11:56 am:

What does the axle on the other side look like? Also, can you take a picture from above the assembly? Maybe we can see the bend if there is one.

Jim in your picture what's up with the newer housing having a 2-3" shorter tube? Is that early housing for a wide track?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Glen Chaffin on Thursday, July 31, 2014 - 12:10 pm:

Chester, We straighten rear axle housings without heat all the time. All you need is a big press and a block of steel to place on the axle where you are pressing on it so you don't cave in the housing. We have a fixture on which to mount the housing and check it for runout in our lathe.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Thursday, July 31, 2014 - 04:37 pm:

Sorry guy's, I just returned from taking the grandson to Hockey practice...I'm headed back to the garage to put the two half's together and take some picture's....And no Norm I haven't installed the drive shaft or radial arms yet........They may help pull it into place also....seems like a lot of variables involved....I'll keep you informed and some picture. Glen, I may end up having to send it to you....Thanks for all the input.....please don't stop.......Chet


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Thursday, July 31, 2014 - 10:18 pm:

Chester:

You still have not said if its your right housing or the left housing that may be bent. Again if its the right housing don't spent a lot of time and money on it get another. If you were closer I would give you one there are hundreds and hundreds of the right side around here. If it is the left side then its worth fixing. I would like to show you some ruxtell tools that I use to work on changing backing plates or the entire stem. You can do the same.

Collar:
collar

Slug
slug

50 Ton Press
press


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Thursday, July 31, 2014 - 11:49 pm:

Dave I'm sorry, every time I start trying to do something productive in the garage it seems someone comes in and wants to talk about everything but what I need to talk about... All I got to do is assemble the two half's together and but I was getting tired so I ran a string across the top for tonight (not the right way)but just to see if I could detect if something was obviously or noticeable wrong....I will take it all apart again tomorrow and start over with just the two housings and take my time and lock the garage door....It's a little difficult doing it all by your self but I see some of you quite older than me picking up the entire rear ends by your self so I just keep on a tinkering.....Thanks for all the help and comments....Chet


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Friday, August 01, 2014 - 01:28 am:

Seth,
I had not noticed the shorter axle half, maybe a wide track and normal track. The image was from an old thread that I linked above.

Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 02:10 pm:

We'll I took it all apart again this morning and found even more problems....The Radial arms I bought separate from the Ruckstell don't seem to be the right ones....As you can see in the pictures they are to long to even let the drive shaft to connect to the housing....Looks like I'm just spending money and wasting time.......My enjoyment is getting a little frustrating right now so I think I will lock up the garage and go play some music this afternoon.....I'll think about the T more tomorrow (no tonight while laying in bed) and play with it later.....Thanks for all of your guidance and help....Chet



Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 02:17 pm:


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 02:22 pm:


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 02:33 pm:

I wonder if those radius rods would be for a wide track T? There were some early Model T's in the south which were made wider to fit within the wagon ruts which were wider in the south. More likely they were for the earlier rear axle with the small drums. The correct rods should be fairly easy to find.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 03:08 pm:

Norm, I think I paid somewhere around $140 plus shipping for these radius rods and they were suppose to be for a 26 model...Not checking (again my fault) I had them sent out and powder coated.... I did notice mine didn't have two nuts....mine has a stop like washer on the end....Without measuring, these must be even longer than mine.....hasn't much went right so far....I looked for several months trying to find radial arms because I would like to keep the one in mine all set up and ready to go incase I need it again in an emergancy...It is all new......Just would like to have a Ruckstell.....Chet


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 03:19 pm:

I didn't notice when I looked at the picture. That is the problem. The 26-27 only had one nut. The flange built into the rod goes right against the hole and the one nut goes on the outside. I think you will have no problem if you take off that extra nut.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Stephen D Heatherly on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 03:36 pm:

Chester, your radius rods are for a pre 1926 Ford. The 1909-25 T's had smaller brake backing plates than the 26/27 ones so, the earlier radius rods are longer. I would make an ad in the classifieds. Surely somebody on the forum has a pair of rods for you.

Stephen


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Tomaso - Milton,WA on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 03:54 pm:

Early '26 radius rods used the same two nuts (1 being a castle) & lock washer as the early model small drum - the collar/stop was added at a later date.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Schedler, Sacramento on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 05:42 pm:

Here's why I have nothing to say on this thread:


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Tomaso - Milton,WA on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 11:05 pm:

Good one, Hal - I've done the same - CRAP !


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gerald Hansen on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 11:09 pm:

I just finished up a 26 Ruckstell rear, the right tube was bent, had to shim the late style radius rods by the shoulder to keep measurement correct or they would pull the housing in. I do have another 26 rear axle with two nut radius rods which I would prefer except didn't want to have any more lose parts around.

I saw a suggestion of using one of many right halves which I have, thought until I clean one up won't know if it also is bent so I went with the clean one inside and out.

My lathe doesn't have sufficient swing nor length for the 26 housing, have 20 ton press had to do more improvising to set it up than I cared to for an item with so little use. So heat was left and/or a lathe to determine the bend. The closest I know of is 90 miles each way and the owner was going on International national tour so that was also out.

Went to heat pulled all the MTFCA sites I could find for info, what I found was somewhat vague and I may have missed a site or two. Went on line and found two good sites. I used V blocks to find high on the housing heated it horizontally. I knew my Ruckstell half was plum also knew my right extended axle shaft was plumb. Have 13 foot ceilings using a small winch, makes for a no bumping smooth assembly, locked the right half in place with four bolts, the axle shaft was still off center. Knowing the interior was super clean I tweaked the tubing twice by using heat not fearing junk on bearing. When satisfied drop in a sleeve (I use safety hubs) and installed an original Ford bearing all was lined up. If casting out of line I have no way to check I could think of as long as the bearing line up I'm happy.

I believe if the P159 and other parts are within specs, ie the axle shaft has very little to slight movement it would be possible to heat a tubing straight in car by supporting the center housing light support under the backing plate and removing the shackle. I have another car with shifting problems, if not the shifter and I feel the Ruckstell parts are fairly correct will figure out a way to indicate the shaft, if not bent I will do the in car heating

The two sites were IMO the best source of info, the second more compatible for tubing (from UK) I used indicators on first heating instantly knew I was correct and would do the repair

http://www.repairengineering.com/shaft-straightening.html#link3


http://www.boconline.co.uk/internet.lg.lg.gbr/en/images/Fundamentals-of-Flame-St raightening410_113398.pdf


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 11:15 pm:

Hal, did my thread about needing a little help with my Ruckstell offend you? I didn't really get your "Here's why I have nothing to say on this thread". I see yours looks good, shop is all clean, and I am glad you have got it all together.... I was just having some problems and asked for some guidance and feel like I was getting quite a lot and very thankful for all that was willing to help.....If this thread is that bad I'll just stay off of it and search for what I can find out...Sorry if I bored you....Chet


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chester W. Lowery TN on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 11:23 pm:

Hal, my apology, I posted before reading Steve's post and went back and saw what you did...I would have thought I would be the only one at this point that would do that....just pissed at myself....Sorry


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Noel D. Chicoine, MD, Pierre, SD on Saturday, August 02, 2014 - 11:55 pm:

Hal, thanks for the picture. I'm putting a ruckstell together and seeing yours prevented the same mistake for me!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Schedler, Sacramento on Sunday, August 03, 2014 - 12:20 am:

Chester, u'er my friend!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Schedler, Sacramento on Sunday, August 03, 2014 - 12:21 am:

Thanks Doc


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