I had started another thread about 1926 non starter features awhile back. It was getting very long and I have a few more questions. I have read that in very early 1926, there is a one bushing and 2 bushing brakes.?? I assume that is talking about the brake cams. How do I tell the difference. My brake cams have a flange on them and the backing plates are plain flat plates with the small rivets. I have some later 27 style backing plates with a die stamped area and the rivets are very large heads. The cams on those rear axles have no shoulders. Ill try to post some photos later this evening....
I believe you are referring to the "service" (transmission drum) brake as it was that ford dropped out one of the brake drum bushing due to the close proximity of the driven plate bushing. It was referred to in the Ford Service Bulletins and Ford recommended using a special stepped alignment reamer to ream both bushings at the same time - one should note that the relationship of the brake drum & driven plate should be indexed after reaming if the need arose to disassemble the brake drum from the driven plate.
Steve: Thanks, that makes sense to me now. I read it in Bruce's book, in the engine number section. It says "all production now with one bushing in brake drum" in the line for Aug 7 1925 engine numbers .. Im going to post a few pics of my unusual brake cam. The car I have is a very early 1926 and has all the early features I have ever heard of. But the backing plates and brake cam is a new one for me. I would like to know the dates of change from one style to the next. I promise to not "beat to death" this early 26 subject for many more months ...
(Message edited by adminchris on August 14, 2014)
A link to the previous discussion: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/411944/468300.html?1407890612
Respectfully linking threads,
Hap l9l5 cut off
Hap is that the same as threading links?
Perhaps you could list all the known changes in the 1926/1927 open cars. I think a list of all the know changes/revisions in one spot could help us all in determining if a vehicle is an early or late 1926. I think it will be difficult to determine just when the changes took place, but with the internet perhaps it is possible.
For example I tried to determine when the front floor board clips came out but was not successful at the time I tried!
Another early feature of the rear axle housings - my March 1926 Fordor has the hex-headed style drain plug as opposed to the square-socket type. No clue when that change was made.
Are you sure that brake cam ('26-'27) isn't modified by an owner?
The Parts books don't show as rev to the 2557B brake cam, other this (B) rev for the Improved Car version for the bigger brake shoe.
There were several types of backing plates, changed came about for making the rivet bracket 'clips' that hold the brake shoe at 4 spots around the backing plate stronger. Then changes to add drain hole or drain louver for oil leakage, as the solid plates held rear axle oil leaks and fouled the brake shoes easily.
Have had to make new clips around early backing plates as they break off easy.
Looks to me like someone added a round piece of metal to the cam, big enough to keep the shoe in place against the backing plate. Just a guess.
Early with no drain hole, riveted clips
later with drain opening, pressed steel caps spot welded with integral clips.
Arnie, I have shown or talked about all the early features I know of, in this and the other thread (linked above). Dan I will go out and look closely at the cam. I will scrape it to bare metal. It looked to me to be a casting, but Ill look again . I have found another different item, I have never heard of before. My frame has the three holes for the early style gas tank brackets. My rear cross member and running board brackets are the 26-27 style and still factory riveted to the frame. Was Henrey using up the last of the early style frame rails with the early holes to assemble 26-27 style frames.??? The holes appear to have never been used and one of them is under the front seat riser sub rail, and can not be used anyway. Its a shame this car is as rough as it is. I am finding all kinds of early features that I have never heard of. One more question. When was the one nut style radius rods introduced ?? Mine are the earlier two nut style ... Thanks again for all the input ..
Dan, I have several examples of the brake cam with the large washer - looks factory to me.
Dan I looked at the cam and you are probably right. After scraping and looking very closely they do appear to have been modified. Its a very good job, the flange almost appears to be attached with a large spot weld but probably just a plug weld. So Im marking it off the list. Im going to get some precise measurements of the gas tank bracket holes and spacing in relation to other points of the frame. Ill match them to some earlier frames I have. If factory they should match each other. If for some reason they were added by someone, they should vary a little. Arnie. When we get done hashing out all the differences we can find and eliminate the speculation the best I can. We can condense all we found out into another thread and throw it out there for discussion one more time. By then we may have weeded out the wrong thoughts from the right thoughts. But we may never know the start dates of all the different items..... Just may be able to say "early" or "late"
Steve: You must have been typing while I was. Can you post a pic of your cams with the washer. If you have some and I have some, that may change my idea about the cams. It looks almost too good of a job to be home made. "Aint this fun" (my English teacher hated that word, so I use it when I can)
Can you post a picture and some measurements of the holes in the frame for the gas tank? I think I have a early 26 Roadster with the body on the frame, but will try to see if I have the frame holes if you post more information on where to find the unused holes!
26-7 Fordors had the gas tank mounted to the frame.
Dan, I believe Donnie is correct, early 26's had a washer welded to the cam. I also checked my 26-7 frames and all of them are punched for under the seat gas tanks.
So were do we stand on the washer welded to the rear brake cam on early vehicles?
I do not recall what mine has, but next time I have the rear drums off I will see if I have a washer welded to the cam.
Arnie, I have seen many housings with the washers on the cam. They are always on what I consider "early" housings, with hex plugs and early style backing plates, which incidentally are made of thinner material.
I went to the Springfield Mo. swap meet today. Did a lot of "early 26" "non starter talking" today. I met several people who have had or seen the washers welded to the cam. It seems the concensus is that the washer was used on early 26 style rear ends with the early small rivet backing plates. How long.? is still unclear. I also am going to have to change my opinion on the Ford O bracket, I mentioned in the other post. I had only seen one ford-O bracket on a 26 27 frame in person. It was mounted to the top of the frame corners where the corner reinforcement brackets are, using what I thought was rivet holes. I am wrong. There are no holes on top of my frame at that point. The bracket I have is a Ford-O bracket for the earlier 1925 frames. It mounts where the spare tire carrier would have been on the 25 and earlier frame. It will not moubnt there on a 26 frame because the shape of the rear cross member is wrong. I could not see the holes on top of my frame and was feeling for them and I thought I found them but after a closer inspection there are only rivets, no holes. Well today, a miracle happened. I found a different Ford-O bracket, that I have never seen. It mounts to the driver side U-bolt for the rear spring. Exactly where it needs to be to make the light be in the position of the few pics I have seen of Improved Fords with a Ford-O. I will post a pic of the 26-27 style Ford-O bracket tomorrow. I bought it ... What are the chances of finding the part I was unsure of, never seen before, and probably very few made, and cheap enough to buy. Tom, as to the Fordor gas tank. I have never looked at a Fordor that close. What style of tank and bracket do they use.? Is it the regular oval tank.?? If so and it mounts under the driver seat, that could explain the holes. I just have never seen them or paid attention to them, if they are supposed to be there for the Fordor. Arnie Ill try to get some pics tomorrow and measurements. But they appear to me to be in the same location as the earlier style frames.
i believe early windshield posts have a different shape where they mount to the cowl also. i have an early 26 touring i drive regularly thats not much better looking than what you just brought home, just the drive train rebuilt
26-7 Fordors used a regular oval tank under the seat.
Clayton, I have a photo posted, in the other thread (link above), of the early 26 style windshield post. Im going to fix it mechanically and drive it, Its mostly a show case for the non starter and loss leader. But I do think her name should be, "Tetanus T". Tom, thanks. Since the Fordors used the regular oval tank, that probably explains the gas tank bracket holes. Its just one of those things I had never noticed, even though I have had many 26-27 style frames thru the years.
Washers on the cams are factory. Got a couple of those myself.
I went and looked at a couple 26-27 frames and also crawled under my restored 27. All of them have the frame mount gas tank holes. So I guess its for the Fordors and we can forget about them being something different. Learn something new all the time.
Im finally getting around to posting the Ford-O pictures. Im trying some new posting tips from Chris. Maybe they will not be upside down
26-27 complete assembly
special 26-27 bracket
Ford-O tail light
mounts to rear spring U-Bolt
1925 style of mounting bracket
both styles of mounts (1925 and 1926-27)
Here is one I forgot
Ford-O stamped into the license bracket
Chris, how did I do .?? Just for the record, I did not even know I had a "return button" Thanks for the tips ...