When I set about installing a new bushing, I found that this tube still has the old bushing in it. Age and primer have it stuck so solidly that the old socket and drive shaft down the tube trick didn't budge it. All I managed to do was mangle the rim of the ball.
Still stuck solid. What's next?
When I went through that on my '27 I found the bushing was "welded" in with babbitt.
I heated the tube hot enough to melt the babbitt and THEN drove it out.
If you or a friend has a big enough lathe, it can be turned (bored) out. This is what I had to do with mine. I replaced it with a brass (bronze?) bushing.
Sawzall with a long metal cutting blade. 2 opposing cuts. Have to admit from the pics it looks like one piece. Not surprised it's stuck.
Steve, that ball is worn quite a bit. If you have another torque tube you might want to consider using it. I use a pipe just small enough to fit between the rivets to drive out the bushings. It's sounds like that is pretty much what your doing. Maybe you can split the bushing with a hacksaw blade then drive it out.
Are you trying to drive it out toward the front or the back? The facing looks like it has been driven upon, and they don't go that way.
Just me, trying to be clear about things.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2
Nope, didn't try to do it backwards. Ball down, socket down the tube, old drive shaft banging on the socket. That's why the rim of the ball got scraped and bent. I'd just use another tube, but all my others are the later style, wrong for 1915. This is probably babbitt that's been in there for near a hundred years. I think I'll try the Sawzall. Babbitt should be easy sawing.
Yes, babbit should be easy to saw. And don't forget to use the 50:50 penetrant mixture to ease things a bit. A length of 3/4" pipe usually works for a driver.
Here is your favorite type of out-of-focus photo of one I pushed out a while back. As can be seen, it is flanged and must be pushed out from the backside.
If it's babbitt, why not melt it out?
I agree with Chris. Babbitt is no match for an oxyacetylene torch!
But you can't go wrong with the old hacksaw trick.
I'll go with the saw so I won't ruin the paint.
Are you sure that your socket got past the rivets and was actually pushing on the bushing? I've noticed that some of the earlier tubes are a tighter fit than others. That's why I went to using a piece of 1" square tubing to drive the bushings out. It can always wiggle past the rivets.
Steve, I"m with Eric on this one. I tried to get a very worn DS bushing out of a tube last year. I also used the socket / driveshaft/ drop the ball end on a hard surface method but the first thing to come out was the head of a rivet and I had ruined the ball in the process.
The bushing sits against a step in the tube so be careful with the cutting. Even if you can get around the rivets, the step covers most of the end of the bushing leaving very little to hook onto to drive the bushing out.
I am ready to try my luck with a second DS (also with a very worn bushing.)
This is my proposed method, someone please correct me if this has been tried and proved not to work.
I have bought 2x 28mm bolts;
1) I'll cut slots in one to form a tap,
2) then cut a thread in the bushing,
3) then screw in the 2nd bolt.
4) with the DS clamped in a vice, I'll insert the DS (square end first so that I don't ruin the thread on the other end) and drive the bolt and bushing out. (Horizontal in the vice and drive it out with a hammer and a wood block so as not to ruin the ball as you I did first time.)
I drop a large bolt down the tube and through the bushing and then use a drive shaft as a large slide hammer to knock out the bushing. I've not found a bushing yet that was any match for the weight of the shaft hitting it.
Some of those bushings are in there pretty tight.
As you have discovered, its a poor idea to place the ball of the torque tube on the ground and pound the bushing with a bar from above. Better to hold the torque tube a foot or two off the ground with the bar inserted and slam it down on something hard. Since the bar is longer than the tube, the bar will hit the ground and force the bushing out the top without damage to the tube. I use a driveshaft as a bar and a 3/4" inch socket to clear the rivets. The open end of the socket is set on the tapered end of the driveshaft. Usually works fine. If not, I torch it or cut it.
BTW, the original babbit bushings are not solid babbit! They have a steel shell, and the babbit was poured around that. I pour lots of penetrating oil down the torque tube before doing this, and around the top part too. I've done this twice recently, and used an original Stevens tool for doing it. I guess I was lucky!
Uh-oh again. I wish I had known about the steel shell before I did what I did.
In theory the Sawzall was a great idea, but it didn't reach the bushing.
Next I tried a puller. 5/8-11 threaded rod with a nut behind the bushing. It pulled the nut into the babbitt until it wouldn't go anymore, then bent the rim of the ball some more.
So I sacrificed the paint and applied some heat.
Yes, the bushing was indeed original babbitt.
So now I have to get the steel bushing shell out and figure out a way to unbend that squashed ball rim.
Steve, heat the steel shell red hot and let it cool. It will most likely fall out, or at least come out much more easily. By heating red hot, it breaks down the rust and shrinks the shell at the same time. Try it, you'll like it. I'm beginning to wonder if anyone is paying attention to me, I've posted this advice several times lately<g>. Dave
Time for another break to cool off. This is really getting annoying. Time is running out on me and I need to get this car together so I can use it. I've pretty well ruined the only correct tube I have, so I decided to go with a later one for now. I'll replace it when I'm not facing a deadline. So I picked the greasiest one I could find, hoping that might help the bushing slip out.
My improvised puller squashed the ball on the other tube, so for this one I cut a piece of pipe for a spacer to go inside the ball. That part worked. It didn't squash the ball. It just pulled the nut through the bushing.
So the next try was with a drive shaft and a socket against the bushing.
It did a great job of splitting the socket, but the bushing didn't move a hair. Next: Dave's idea of heat inside.
Yikes, Steve, your machines have really been causing you fits lately! Hopefully they'll settle down and start behaving soon.
Ugh...you have had a battle on that bushing
Have removed many Babbitt ones, only one steel case on a '15 torque tube. Always use lots of penetrating oil on dry parts prior to disassembly helps.
On the '15 used an old steering shaft, with a 1 1/8" bushing driver mounted to the tapered end, even the bushing handle retainer cap fit the threads of the steering shaft to secure the driver.
Placed the steering shaft with bushing drive up the torque tube, with the bell end up in the air.
Then like a slide hammer, dropped the torque tube down, with the steering shaft inside, and the bushing driver snug in the drive shaft housing bushing, struck the assembly up and down on a hardwood block.
The flange end of the steering shaft hitting the block. Just kept lifting and smacking, till the bushing started to move. More smacks of the weight of the torque tube lifted in the air about a foot above the block, with the steering shaft driver in place, it hammered out the tired old Babbitt bushing.
Other times, the torque tube is fixed in the bench vise, and the shaft was hit with a hammer to drive out the bushing.
Best to not hammer on the bell housing, or let it rest on hard surface as you now know. Learned not to hammer on round things when once I was removing suborn quadrant rivets to take out a steering case, but left the case lying on the workbench, un-supported. Sure made an oval out of an otherwise nice round gear case, the planet gears never could go around again.
It's out! Here's the story: First I tried just heat, melting out the babbitt and turning the sleeve red. I left it cooling while I went to pick up some stuff I bought at Saturday's auction. When I got back I banged away at the sleeve and got nothing but exercise. So I attacked it with the cutting torch. That turned the thing red and cut some of the sleeve closest to the front of the tube, but it couldn't reach most of the sleeve. Still no movement. So I put on the #4 tip and applied more heat. While it cooled I went to town and got some blasting stand. When I got home I was about to try again when I noticed something on my work table. It's something Ford made for another purpose, and looked like it might be just right for a bushing driver. After applying a bath of 50/50 to the bushing, I shoved my new tool into the tube, put a drive shaft in after it, and banged away on the concrete.
That did it. This is the tool that did the job.
Mission accomplished, bushing sleeve out. In the morning I'll blast the tube, put in the new bronze bushing, and paint.
Excellent, well done! Way to show those machines who's boss. Good luck with the rest of the build!
I did the same with a socket once, if you turn it over the drive shaft beats on the flat drive end and doesn't get jammed into the socket and ruin it.
Steve, did you get the ball straightened out? Dave
Nope, not taking the time to fool with it. I'll put the car together with this stepped tube so I can use it. I'll fix the ball later, if I can, or I'll get another correct tube and try not to wreck it.
I haven't been reading the forum much so didn't read this thread. Here is how I do it. Took a bunch of them out this way. I thread a 1 1/8 coarse thread tap into the bushing from the front. Clamp the tube in the vise horizontally. Use an old steering shaft in from the back, give it a mighty heave and it will pop the bushing out the front. No damage to the ball, no heat, etc. Works 99.9 % of the time or more.