Studied the old movie , " The History of the Model T "
I still can not understand that my Coupelet 1918 Made 22 September 1917 .
Maybe I'm Right? !
When I then freezes and study site film frequency looks like this as my car. My car's roof looks different
Are there several early films ?
Viilket years this is filmed ?
1917 , or ... ?
The lower photo is a 1917 coupelet. There were probably three types of couplet in 1917 model year.
That last picture Royce posted looks like it might be an original car, judging by the condition of the headliner and seat. Where is that car, Royce? It is typical of what we now consider to be a 1918-style Coupelet, the production of which probably began in calendar 1917. I don't know whether they were made in model year 1917 or not. If it's an original car, the engine number might tell us that.
And then there's the all-too-common business about cars back then being titled for the calendar year in which they were sold, not necessarily the same model year. So even if that's a 1918 model year car sold late in 1917, it probably is titled as a 1917. More info about that car might shed some light on all that.
All the 1917 Coupelets are quite rare, with only about five of the rounded-fixed-top ones (Royce's first and third pics) known to exist.
It is in a museum inNebraska Mike.
Would the different styles of roof lines on the Coupes be due to different body manufactures?
Did only one manufacture build Coupes for Ford?
Dennis -- All the Coupelet bodies (1915-18 model years) were built by the Fisher Body Co. in Detroit.
Its in the Warp collection in Nebraska
I enjoy the education the forum provides. I know some of my questions may seem stupid to all of you who have early car knowledge but I just want to learn more.
Thanks Royce for the car from Nebraska , wants more pictures of it, first thing I see with the body !
It was new for me, in that case even a Coupelet model .
I have tried what I mean by these images.
Have now compared my with this car.
This car from the Museum of Nebraska is in the lower body more like " rounded top that was before these ( my ) " flated Top "
Does anyone have more pictures of this
from the museum , I would be happy to add this to my knowledge of these Coupeleter .
I think Mike is correct. Dwight Madsen used to own one like that. It was a 1918.
Dwight Madsen had a 1918 coupelet - there are photos of the body in "Vintage Ford" and the book "From Here to Obscurity" Later, it was owned by Bill Praus. I saw the car many times over the years.
It was sold and left Minneapolis approximately 20 years ago, sometime after Bill passed away. I believe it went to Colorado.
If you want to see a few more photos of the 1917 Warp coupelet, click on these links. In 2000, I got permission to go behind the ropes and took approx. two dozen photos of the car. I have posted a limited number of photos of the car on the forum over the years and subsequently they have been borrowed and recycled in other posts.
After seeing photos of your car, my impression is that it was a victim of an amateur restoration and the roofline configuration is not factory issue. Again, this is only an opinion.
Erik, you will see the differences as I demonstrate, the bottom has two pieces on the door and the rear, the same as the 1917th
And what I see is not a converted car without an original.
My car has the two body panels intact, do not see any change in the sheet metal body.
Center Door has the same rear taks design if I understand it right.
Mine is made by Fisher, was in 1917 Rounded top made from Fisher also?
Erik, you have pictures of it from Nebraska museum that you can send, I would be happy.
I note that the crashed Coupelet 1917, has no door handles?
Same as from Nebraska
The passenger door handle on the Warp museum car is just missing.
Note that the photo that you posted is cropped so it appears the car has a flat roof. The car actually has the rounded roof.
Erik -- Good observation on the cropped picture making the rounded roof look to be a flat one. I totally missed that.
There's more photos of an original, unrestored body here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Extremely-Rare-Unique-1918-Model-T-Ford-Coupelet-Body-Su rvivor-Coupe-Brass-Era-/121431273907?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash =item1c45de31b3&vxp=mtr
Bruce said in his book that he believed the rounded-to-flat top change was made about the middle of 1917, but it now appears that it was later.
I just re-read those older threads with the links posted by Erik Johnson yesterday. The thread in the first link, from 2009, has information pertinent to our discussion about when the change was made from the "rounded top" to the "flat top" body style. Rather than having the flat top body made in the 1917 model year, apparently the rounded top style carried over into the beginning of the 1918 model year late in 1917.
Information posted by Ake in that older thread indicates that the change was made around September 10th of 1917, which was after the beginning of Ford's 1918 model year (1 August, 1917). So if this is correct, there were only two 1917 Coupelet body styles, the convertible and the rounded fixed top, and two 1918 Coupelet body styles, the rounded and flat fixed tops. All three occurred in calendar year 1917, but not in the 1917 model year.
By the way, I'm not trying to argue with anyone, I'm just trying to bring together the different bits of information into one discussion. I too had believed that the three body styles were built in the 1917 model year, but apparently that was not the case. The more we can share information about what happened in the Model T realm 100 years ago, the more we all can learn.
ok! buy all of my old books from 1920 and before. a coupelet body has a folding top!!!& a coupe has a hard top. this is s.a.e. standards of 1920. so the only coupelet pix is the one at Dallas center as I see it, but I have been wrong before. as usual password won't work it wont save more than 2 hrs. charley
OPS ! Erik , I thought the picture was of a " flated top" Excuse me !
Ford noted the September 10, 1917 , states that the fuel tank was moved back in the "turtle deck" , so therefore , I understand that when Ford was able to lower the car's roof.
It was then a new and stylish look .
Now it was not the place for Pillars in between the seat and the rear window , but now placed under the seat.
I took a number of photos of the Harold Warp coupelet in 1999. The car has the original interior in reasonably good condition. My dad had taken a photo of this car in 1986 and I found the photo after he died in 1997. The photo that Royce posted looks like it could be the pic that he took. Am I right about that Royce? I know I emailed it to Don Watson and maybe someone else. It took a little detective work to find that the car was at Warp's. When I called the museum they told me they had no 1917 T but they did have a '26 coupe. They identified it by the engine #. Turns out it has a '26 engine in it. I still have the photos that I took of the car then. I'll see if I can dig them out of the closet and post them if anyone cares to see them.
Don sent me that photo last year some time when we were discussing the 1918 coupes.
Here are some more photos of that body style:
As displayed, the Warp car is mis-identified as a 1922 coupe on the signage and it also has a 1922 Nebraska license plate mounted up front. In the 1987 edition, of "A History of Man’s Progress,” by Harold Warp, a book published by Pioneer Village that covers the museum’s collection and includes an inventory of the cars, the couplet is listed twice under the same serial number referenced above and mis-identified in one entry as a 1916 coupelet and as 1922 coupe in another entry.
The replacement motor corresponds to March 1927 with serial number 14797626 and has a vaporizer set-up. Everything inside the engine compartment including the wood firewall has a coat of aluminum paint. Other additional updates were made due to the later motor having a starter and generator, etc. such as cutting a hole in the floor of the trunk and adding a battery carrier to the frame, the addition of a switch/ammeter panel, a combination choke/mixture rod and later coil box sans switch.
The car also has accessory demountable at-the-hub wheels, an accessory gas gauge and an exhaust cutout pedal (I don't have any photos of the exhaust cutout - just the pedal).
There is a serial number “28850” top front edge of the seat riser. The serial number on passenger side floor sill is “T1884”. When I examined the car, I was not able to locate a date on the body. (Note that the car has a lot of Nebraska prairie dust on it. If a person could push it outside and wash it, more details could be seen on a clean car in good light.)
Years ago, my dad wrote the museum to inform them the car was a 1917 Ford and he also inquired about the history of the car. He received a personal reply from Harold Warp who did not have much information to supply on the car. Based on this correspondence, it appears that the repaint and replacement of the motor occurred prior to the museum's acquisition of the car.
The last photo that Royce posted is the Ford factory photo.
My dad has a high quality glossy print struck from the original negative in his files. This was back when you purchase high quality prints from the Benson Center struck from the original negatives, instead of the digital prints that are available today.
Ake - if you do not have that photo in your files, I suggest that you obtain one. That would be a good reference for your restoration.
Erik -- Thank you for adding all that additional information.
And here's a bit of trivia for everyone -- note that in those early pics of Coupelets, they have the cowl lamps turned inward, not outward as they are on the open cars. Most folks who restore Coupelets mistakenly reverse the lamp brackets and turn them outward, which is incorrect.