Trying to find out if the 1914 T had a starter, could one be adapted to the 14 engine or did you have to install a later model engine to get a starter
A later transmission cover can be installed for use with a starter.
Starters were not available on Model Ts until 1919. You will have to pull the power plant and change the flywheel as well as the trans cover. This means removing the transmission from the engine. Many have done it but I would save the procedure for when other major repairs are done.
Richard -- You might check to see whether your flywheel has been changed to one with a ring gear. Rebuilders sometimes do that in order to facilitate the addition of a starter later. Otherwise, you'll need to do as Ken said.
I've never done it, but in addition to the transmission cover and the flywheel don't you also need to change out the magneto ring?
Yes you need the notched one from 1919 up.
I've read where people have said that on this forum but I don't think it is actually true for most of the brass era cars. I know that a starter shaft easily clears the coil ring on my 1912 which is a stamped sheet metal round coil. Perhaps it is true for some model years - I would love to see a picture of what is supposed to not work.
Here's the original (rewound by Wally Szumuski for $185) coil ring in my 1912 which clears a starter easily. All the earlier coil rings are similar:
The main reason I ask is I am looking at buying a 1914 and it has a starter on it and the owner said he thought the engine was original but did not know for sure. At a quick glance is there any way to tell if it is a 1914 or later model.
Yeah, quickly glance at the encyclopedia attached to this forum and it'll give you an idea of what changes were made in the Model T as the years progressed.
Sure. Look up the serial number. http://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/sernos.htm
That will give you the month of manufacture. I have the more detailed version of the encyclopedia and can look up the day if you want. If you post lots of detailed pictures, you'll soon find out what parts are 1914 and which ones aren't.
I put a starter on a '15 recently.
The hardest and most time consuming was shiming the mag coils.
I installed an Optima battery under the front seat at the driver's end of the fuel tank..
I changed the hog's head, the flywheel and the coil ring.
Richard -- The engine number (above the water inlet on driver's side of the engine) might be original to that engine, or it might not be. If you have a '14 engine, it will be shown in the cast date, which is to the rear of the water inlet, on the driver's side of the engine near the firewall. That number is mm dd yy. If your engine is a '14, the last two digits in the cast date will be 14 or 13. There may be fewer digits, since they didn't use 01 for 1, etc. Look for that number and report back to us for more info.
I would like to thank everyone for all of the help it is amazing the help you can get from this group. What a great bunch of guys and gals. I imagine that a bunch of T's would have been in the junk pile if it were not for all of you. My big problem with deciding on buying the T is it it is in MI and I live in Sacramento Ca.
If the price is right, it's worth the long haul. I brought a T on a U-Haul car trailer from Phoenix to Kansas. Fuel and trailer rental came to well under a grand, mostly feeding the gas hog Suburban. If you don't have a vehicle that will pull a trailer, hired transport may be more expensive. Not having gone that route myself, I can't say.
With a zillion T owners in Mi,I'm sure one would be close enough for a look?? Bud.
If you don't know much about '14 Fords and the seller doesn't know much about '14 Fords, you might want to have someone who knows '14 Fords look at the car for you.
Or you might want to at least look up a few members close to home who have '14 Fords and ask if you can look at their cars just to give yourself an education.
I agree you want somebody who knows his stuff to check it out. Before I knew what little I know now, I attended an auction where a 1914 touring was for sale. I got into a bidding war, and luckily I lost out to a party who was willing to spend more than I was. Later, studying the pictures, I discovered that the car was really a 1915 and not worth what both of us were bidding. With both of you not knowing much about the car, it's a recipe for financial carnage. As Bud says, Michigan is crawling with Model T owners. Use this site and the MTFCI site to find the nearest clubs and see if you can find somebody to go with you and look it over. I'd never buy a car without seeing it in person.
Mr. Eddinger is in California -
Richard, for a person new to the hobby (or one thinking about buying a different year T) this forum can be like drinking from a firehose! Lots of Good solid knowledge from well intentioned experts.
I didn't do my research when I bought my T and paid the price. The one bit of advice I would recommend is to study the encyclopedia written by Bruce McCalley. This is the bible about Model T ford cars, their history and details of each year's features.
Once you have gained the knowledge about the particular year and model that interests you, then start your search.
You will be surprised how many model T's you will find in your own back yard! The Bay area, the central valley, SoCal and the Sierra foothills have many members who will help you find, or already know of a car that might be purchased, but is technically not for sale. Be patient... the perfect car for you is out there and likely "just down the street".
Richard as indicated by Ken starters were not available on Model T's until 1919, Royce posted a picture of his 12 along with starter and ring gear. Any year car with a double stack coil does not need a notch for a starter. Let me reiterate double stack coils do not need a starter notch. The frame diameter of a double stack mag ring is smaller then a single stack coil thus a notch is not needed. I recommend anyone with a early car that is using a double stack to install a starter ring. The starter ring teeth will sling more oil and aid in the lubrication process. Cutting a notch or modifying a early field ring only weakens the stamped steel or casting. I have received many these early coils for rebuild and because of that change I usual scrap them or use them for hobbyist's that are rebuilding HCCT.