Model A axle on a T?

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: Model A axle on a T?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andy Krishak on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 08:02 am:

I have searched and searched, so if anyone has a link, please post it. I have a fairly unusual project in the planning stage and am a newbie to early Fords. The end result is to be a fairly stock looking T C cab or panel. But will probably use A 19" wire wheels since this will be driven quite a bit and I am wanting to have front brakes as well. What I am pondering is using an A front axle on a T frame. I would have thought this was a fairly common conversion, but cant find anything about it. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By G.R.Cheshire on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 08:09 am:

this might be a better option
http://www.texastparts.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=TTP&Product_C ode=T2565-SS&Category_Code=New


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andy Krishak on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 09:28 am:

I had seen that and it is an option, but looking for other ideas. Really wanting to try to use early A wires if possible. Will make doing what I have in mind for the rear easier. At least I think so.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By keith g barrier on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 10:10 am:

I would just buy a model A, That way you would have everything you need. A running gear should be fairly easy to find. KGB


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andy Krishak on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 10:18 am:

confessing my "newbiness". How difficult is it to mate 26ish body work to an A? I know that I have the front frame horns to deal with, but that is minor.

Also - just a quick and dirty on me - have been seriously building cars for a about 10 years. Can weld and fabricate pretty well, but I farm out trannies, short blocks, final body and paint.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Kopsky, Lytle TX on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 10:53 am:

The A frame is longer and wider and all the body brackets/mounts are different. You'll have to fabricate your own mounts to accept a Model T body.

Use this link to see the differences.
http://www.wescottsauto.com/SubIndexes/Techindex.html


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 10:54 am:

It sounds like you have a hodge podge of Ford parts from different era's you somehow want to make a vehicle out of. This site is geared towards stock style Model T's and their preservation. That said, you will find a lot of resistance here to do things like set a T body on a A frame, or using A axles under a T. Everyones idea of a Model T is different as are their own idea of improvements.

Now, to me, It sounds like you need a plan of action. It sounds as if you have some parts, but not others to complete the idea in your head. Form a plan first if building something from parts. Putting "better" brakes on a T isn't a new idea. Many have tried various ways to do it, most here do not like how it takes away from the original looks. And at some point, you become tied to the traction of a stock skinny tire. If you can lock up the brakes on a stock T, you won't get any better by making them lock up with a hydraulic brakes. The tire will still skid either way.

Now, with all that out of the way, you sure can do what ever you put you mind too--it is after all your car/truck/etc. But the advice and what is written here is greatly geared to 1927 and earlier model T's. Their are guys who Hot Rod early stuff that can be located on the H.A.M.B. forums that will know how and why certain things will fit and work together from different vehicles. Again, kinda unclear what the ultimate result you want is.

Not trying to be discouraging here, we welcome all Model T people, Most of us just like things on the stock side. BTW, I am not an old crusty guy, I have in the past and currently build various assemblies and do repairs on muscle cars for people. That is what pays for my T parts.

(Message edited by Chad Marchees on January 01, 2015)

(Message edited by Chad Marchees on January 01, 2015)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 11:00 am:

I'd look for a Model A complete chassis, as Keith suggested. I would think it would be easier to adapt the T body to the Model A frame than to try to adapt A front and rear ends to the T frame. Making body mounts is easy. Plus, you'd have a much stronger platform in the end.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jeff cordes on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 11:03 am:

I saw a 27 touring body on a model a chassis at an MTFCI national tour a few years back, it was well done and ran well.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 11:55 am:

Johnny Arrington, now deceased, in our club adapted a V8 60hp and transmission to a 26 T roadster. It had a Model A front axle, and I believe, Model A rear axle, and had 4 wheel Model A brakes. There is a similar car in the Houston, Tx area. The Arrington car is still in the family as far as I know.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 12:22 pm:

Much more info and comments can be made to you on the Ford Barn website. They have hot rod threads there, this website is best for stock Model T's.

Here are photos of a Model T Tudor sedan on T frame, but with Model A engine, front axle, and rear axle. Can be adapted with some skill.


Interior, note clutch and brake pedals of Model A in the '26 Tudor sedan


Model A front axle with brakes on T frame


Underside of Model A engine install


Underside showing Model A rear axle, drive line has accessory overdrive. Note late '26-'27 frame, and use of that later frame is better, as it is a bit more beefy. But most Model A engines in a T frame due require reinforcements in places.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 12:33 pm:

I met and bought a T rear axle from a guy that had a '26-'27 touring with a modern drivetrain under the car. It looked real stock from the outside. Very nice craftsman ship, but just wasn't my cup of tea. I do a lot of different fabrication work on various cars, so I know anything can be done if you want it.

Seems to me that swapping in the complete front and rear axles would be the way to go---but---if your looking to replace the T engine also, then I think where it was posted above is best and buy a complete A chassis and swap the body on.

Again, it would be nicer to know what your intentions of a final product would be. It helps us to better help you or give you the direction to head to.

Some of us will weep that another T will get chopped to a more "modern" car status.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 01:14 pm:

No "chopping" is necessary to put a Model T body onto a Model A chassis. As long as the body is preserved or restored, not modified, I don't see that any harm has been done. There are lots of loose T bodies hanging around not being used for anything, so putting one on a different chassis doesn't bother me at all.

A couple of years ago, there was a thread on here which showed Boyd Coddington disassembling a nice running '26 T Coupe to make a street rod from it. That one bothered me a lot.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andy Krishak on Thursday, January 01, 2015 - 05:05 pm:

OK - let me shed a little more light - was dipping my toes in the water here to see if a mob with torches and pitchforks was going be coming down the road for me. So far so good.

And I TOTALLY understand and appreciate the feelings of many on this site about preserving original cars. I feel the same way about most cars.

But I have no car or parts at all - am scouting around and have been finding some potential sources. Lots of what I am looking at is going to be a rescue from a scrap dealer. And I may try an alternate site as well, but I am trying to learn as much as I can for you.

Here's the skinny on my project. I am an air cooled VW nut. Have built quite a few cars and each project is very different with me pushing my skills on each one. Always loved early Fords and almost got into T's about 10 years ago. What I am planning to build is a VW powered (rear engine) 26ish C cab or delivery van that will look pretty stock. Building this as a rod is easy, building it to look stock is not. Will be using Henry fenders, hood, etc, but integrating the VW drivetrain into the frame. Right now, getting a handle on front axle, brakes and frame.

As mentioned - I am developing a plan. Thats how I build all of my cars. May take me months (or even years) before I start the actual build. The more I know, the better choices I can make.

So what it sounds like is an A frame and front suspension would be the way to go. Could do split wishbones OR fabricate a crossmember. Then sort out a hydraulic drum brake set up. If I use 19" A wheels, the tire width is pretty similar to an early VW bias ply, so I would have relatively a pretty good contact patch. This will be driven and want to be able to cruise down the highway at 55 if possible.

So - does this make more sense and thanks for all the comments so far - has been VERY helpful.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By kep on Friday, January 02, 2015 - 02:14 pm:

i approve of rescued parts. Do the crossmember for the wishbone. Makes more sense to me at least.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Kopsky, Lytle TX on Friday, January 02, 2015 - 02:46 pm:

People do worse things to Model Ts here. :-)

I suggest you states look into your states title rules for assembled cars. Without a title, it may just become yard art.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Kopsky, Lytle TX on Friday, January 02, 2015 - 02:49 pm:

Well, that didn't come out right. WTH!

"I suggest you look into your states title rules for assembled cars. Without a title, it may just become yard art."


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Frank M. Brady on Friday, January 02, 2015 - 04:26 pm:

Third photo - I wonder the builder got a Model A engine like that...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Aaron Griffey, Hayward Ca. on Friday, January 02, 2015 - 06:37 pm:

3rd picture shows a V8 engine.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gary Schreiber- Santa Isabel Ecuador on Saturday, January 03, 2015 - 09:29 am:

Andy, are you a poster as well on the VolksRod site??


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Eckensviller on Saturday, January 03, 2015 - 11:33 am:

The VW-T got me thinking of a similar project I once wanted to do. It would have had more of a hot rod stance but I wanted a fender less T roadster pickup with a VW totally hidden by the box. Up front I either wanted the original engine bay proudly empty (no hood) or to open up the hood to reveal a barbecue where you would expect the engine to be.

Yeah, I'm a little weird at times.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Saturday, January 03, 2015 - 04:55 pm:

Fordbarn is NOT hot rod! There is a link to their sister forum Jalopy Journal and H.A.M.B. on the forum drop down page.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andy Krishak on Saturday, January 03, 2015 - 05:13 pm:

LOL - yeah Tim....a little messed up. And yeah Gary, am on Volksrods ("40 Ford" VWoodie and current build are on there) and still looking around at other sites. The problem is that if I was building a hot rod or rat rod, there are LOTS of options and I could just get everything from someplace like Speedway. BUT by trying to maintain a stock look has me searching more on restoration type sites, such as this. What I am really happy about is the wealth of info, such as body plans and such that are on here.

Also a comment was made about registering and titling the car once complete - had a lenghth discussion with owner of an "enhanced" inspection station, which is one of my first steps in the process and he was very helpful. Like to know the rules first.

Monday will be talking to a guy I had visited a couple weeks ago that has some parts. He has about 20 or so Fords with a mix of a couple Ts, A's, plus 30's, 40's, 60's and 70's cars. Most are stock or close to it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Sunday, January 04, 2015 - 07:41 am:

Then you will have another problem, if you wish to join a club.

The last time I checked:

1. The Model A club does not allow Model Ts on their tours.

2. The MTFCA does not allow Model A's as on their tours.

Unless the rules have changed.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron on Wednesday, January 07, 2015 - 01:23 pm:

I grew up in a Model A Club that did not care what you drove on a run or a tour. While the bulk of participants were driving As, there were Ts, '32 Fords, a Packard or two and a guy who had been restoring a Model A for the better part of 25 years (and this was over 40 years ago mind you), who routinely drove a '36 Dodge. The lone requirement the club (which was nationally affiliated) had was the vehicle had to be stock - no hot rods. Other than that, all were welcome, all had fun. The exclusion trend is a real turnoff to joining any formal club.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron on Wednesday, January 07, 2015 - 01:36 pm:

On a separate, yet related note, I had someone on this Forum PM me about a year ago and tell me that I should only list my Ts on my profile ("even if they are just doodlebugs") and not my Model As. He helpfully suggested that I list them on a Model A site if I joined one. My two A-based doodlebugs and my 1930 Town Sedan remain on my profile.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Wednesday, January 07, 2015 - 10:38 pm:

Lots of participants on this forum list non-Model T's in their profiles. I don't see anything wrong with that. Gearheads are gearheads, and we like all kinds of cars. (Although some here are not very tolerant of hot rods.) :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Wednesday, January 07, 2015 - 10:42 pm:

And, BTW, you're a long way from where I am, but our Arkansas Tin Lizzies club welcomes any kind of antique cars on our tours, which number 3 or 4 every year. You and anyone else are welcome to join us. We ride on some of the best Model T roads anywhere. :-)

www.ArkansasTinLizzies.com


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andy Krishak on Friday, January 16, 2015 - 06:59 am:

Not too worried about a club. I am used to it. My "40 Ford" VW Woodie is a bastard and if I ever go to an AACA show, I park off the show field. Not a big deal - I have thick skin LOL. Anyway - rounding up some leads on parts and parts cars. Had a possible great deal on an A, but it was too nice of a car and I wouldnt buy it to strip and part out what I didnt need. But at the moment back to work on the current project (non-Ford related) and getting ready for new shop I am buying in a month and a half.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Holland, Utah on Saturday, January 17, 2015 - 12:59 am:

Andy. This is a couple of years back, but I saw a kit type car that looked like a 1925 roadster pickup and was meant to be put on a VW chassis components. Last year there was one on our local crailist site called KSL.com it looked great. The engine blower hides under the back bed of the pickup. If I were going to build one of these I would look around and see if there are any aftermarket VW chassis builders for your Idea.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Saturday, January 17, 2015 - 12:55 pm:

On our tours, we quite often invite the Model A Club to participate. Also the Horseless Carriage club. It all depends on which club you join. Our only request is that the "modern" cars follow the Model T's.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tony Bowker on Saturday, January 17, 2015 - 07:57 pm:

Norm, does this mean my 1901 CDO can be in front of the Model Ts?


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