Roller replacement assist

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: Roller replacement assist
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dana A. Crosby in Glendale, Az on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 04:26 pm:

OK, I have a 25 with a dizzie. I have a 26 that doesn't. I had to take the timer apart on the 26 because it went south last week on a tour. The new parts are back together on the car...Here's where I get dumb. I can't get the timer "push/pull" rod to go back in. I have turned it every which way and I still can't get it hooked on both ends. That rod has me baffled. I can't find a diagram either. I found lots of different methods of adjusting the timing...no pictures there either. Somebody help me before I curse. I try not to curse in front of the cars because they are so young and impressionable.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 04:29 pm:

Does this help?

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/179374/184086.jpg


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 04:31 pm:

Is it possible to hook the rod on the timer while the timer is loose and possible to wiggle, then put on the clamp that holds the timer afterwards?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Daron - Brownsburg IN on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 04:47 pm:

Roger,yes it is.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dana A. Crosby in Glendale, Az on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 06:35 pm:

I would be happy to hook one end to the cover and then put the cover on. Which end and facing in or out?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dana A. Crosby in Glendale, Az on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 06:37 pm:

Jerry, my push pull rod is totally different as is the mounting position of the timer. I have never seen a setup like yours. Thanks for the picture though.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dana A. Crosby in Glendale, Az on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 06:52 pm:

Ok Jerry, mine must be the oddball. Yours looks much more like the picture (fig 100) in the service manual. Mine is bent into a reverse S curve. Wish I had taken a picture before I took it off.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale Peterson College Place, WA on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 06:57 pm:

The pin at the timer end goes in toward the engine, the big sweeping curve goes around the lower water hose.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tony Bowker on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 07:07 pm:

On mine the pin end of the rod is away from the engine as is shown in Jerry's picture. Yes, it sometimes easier to put the rod on the timer first and then fight the steering column end.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale Peterson College Place, WA on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 07:13 pm:

You right Tony, brain f##t, pin away from the motor.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dana A. Crosby in Glendale, Az on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 08:35 pm:

See if this picture shows why I am confused.

pull rod


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Stephen D Heatherly on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 08:47 pm:

Dana, if your rod is all bent up I would suggest that you get a new rod in order to get a good starting point. If it is bent right it should just slip right in on both ends. Before you cotter pin the ends check that the timer is timed right. Remove the #1 spark plug and lay it on the head with the wire still attached. Rotate the timer so that the tab on top is maybe 1" to the left from straight up. Now turn the engine over slowly until #1 comes up on compression. Look inside the spark plug hole and stop turning the crank as soon as the piston starts to move downward on the power stroke. Turn the switch on to battery. If the coil starts buzzing turn the timer a little to the left until it stops. Now very slowly turn it to the right just until the coil starts to buzz. Make sure that that it is the #1 coil firing by looking at the spark plug then turn the switch off. Bend the curve in the rod over the timer so that it slips right into the timer with the spark lever all the way up. Now with the rod in place turn the crank until #1 comes up on compression again. Look in through the spark plug hole and make sure that the coil does not start to buzz until after the piston has began to move downward again. If all is right install your cotter pins and put the plug back in.
https://www.modeltford.com/item/3534B.aspx
Stephen


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Stephen D Heatherly on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 08:50 pm:

Dana, your timer rod is pretty bent up. I would get a new one. It should look like the one in the link that I posted.

Stephen


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 09:08 pm:

The rod you get from the vendors looks like the one in the picture by Jerry. The curved part goes over the timer and the angle goes under the radiator hose. The way I install them is to loosen the clamp which holds the timer cover and fit the rod through from the engine side with the cotter pin toward the radiator. This type is on my 22 and also on one of the 26's.

I also have one 26 on which the rod goes over the radiator hose and is more straight on the end which goes to the timer. I don't know where that rod came from or if it was standard equipment? But it works better with less slack than the more curved ones. That rod also is placed in from the engine side of the timer and the cotter pin is toward the radiator. I'm not sure whether this type would work on the earlier cars with the fan bolted to the timing gear cover, but it works just fine on the 26 with the fan located on the upper hose connection.


Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dana A. Crosby in Glendale, Az on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 09:42 pm:

Thanks for all your input. I just woke up the folks at Snyder's and ordered both of their rods. Why both, you may ask? Well, my 26 has a 25 engine in it and they list one for each. Again, thanks for all the assistance.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Tuesday, February 03, 2015 - 09:59 pm:

When you're setting timing, an easy way to find TDC is to put your thumb over the #1 plug hole so you can feel the compression as the piston comes up when you pull the crank. That will be just before TDC. It's at the top when the crank pin is horizontal like this:


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Donald Conklin on Wednesday, February 04, 2015 - 08:08 am:

To add to what Steve said. If you have one of the new replacement aluminum pulleys, TDC is when the split in the pulley is straight up, in that position it also lines up with a cast rib in the engine block.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Wednesday, February 04, 2015 - 09:31 am:

And you want the coils to sing and the plugs to ignite a little after TDC with the ignition lever retarded = fully up.
Then you'll be safe when cranking on battery.

If you're crank starting on magneto you may have to advance a few clicks to make it start, kickbacks seems to be less of a problem on magneto.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Tomaso - Milton,WA on Wednesday, February 04, 2015 - 10:06 am:

In your photo posted above Steve - the bolt directly under the timer is the only one on the block to c.c. assembly that goes in from the top pointing down so as to prevent a "short" !

And Dana, the difference in the rods is the length and I believe that is due to the difference in steering column mounting between "pre '26 and '26 - '27 - changes the "angle of the dangle" !


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dana A. Crosby in Glendale, Az on Wednesday, February 04, 2015 - 02:26 pm:

I will update this saga after the new bits arrive and I get them installed. Thanks again for all the input.


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