Should postings on this Forum be limited to MTFCA MEMBERS only?

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: Should postings on this Forum be limited to MTFCA MEMBERS only?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Barbara Klehfoth on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:02 am:

This question has come up over the years. I would like to hear from current Mtfca members. What is your opinion? Should we limit opinions to only persons who belong to the MTFCA?

Please post your opinion.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Daron - Brownsburg IN on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:12 am:

I feel that anyone who properly represents him/herself,by name should be able to post.That way we can welcome new folks and spread the hobby knowledge.Just my opinion,and your mileage may vary.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:22 am:

My view: No, we should not. People (1) discover the forum, (2) lurk, (3) begin to participate, (4) perhaps buy a Model T, and (5) join MTFCA. By requiring MTFCA membership up front, you eliminate steps 1-4 and never get to 5.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gary London, Camarillo, CA on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:25 am:

I agree. I like the idea of having a verification process via a valid email, and if there's a problem for the moderator to be able to remove or ban a user. But I think it will hurt participation and membership.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steven Thum on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:26 am:

Too much knowledge would be lost to this forum. Also too many people that need help would not be able to get that help. Over all we have a good bunch here. I for one would not like to see this forum restricted.

Steven


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Noonan - Norton, MA. on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:43 am:

Why not a tax on us lucky enough to be able to save enough to own such an old vehicle!..When will it end?..I'm about done with this forum.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tony Bowker on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:44 am:

I wonder who has been questioning who should be "allowed" on the forum?
Most folks who write on the forum seem reasonable and since we did the last "rapping of knuckles" even the OT have been reasonable. I like the freedom the site offers, mind you there is a good deal of repetition....


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert G. Hester Jr., Riverview, FL on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:01 am:

One word answer, no.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les VonNordheim on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:05 am:

My answer...no.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Harper - Keene, NH on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:08 am:

No, please don't do that.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George_Cherry Hill NJ on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:11 am:

No.....open forum for all


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:11 am:

John Noonan - I'm with you.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:22 am:

No, unless you want to see it dry up and die.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:22 am:

As a member, I vote NO! NO! and NO!
(vote early and often, right?)
I think Dick Lodge has it right.
David D.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eric Sole - Castelldefels (Spain) on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:28 am:

I joined the MTFCA after lurking and participating in the forum.
I vote no, do not limit the forum to members only.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Frank van Ekeren (Australia) on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:41 am:

WHAT!! that's sacrilege to even think of such a suggestion!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jeff Hood -Long Beach, California on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:47 am:

When I visit a website looking for information, and the first thing I have to do is "register" or "create an account" I usually move on. I agree with Dick Lodge. There are probably a lot of people reading this forum who don't have a Model T yet and are not members. We need to be inclusive, not exclusive. We need to keep our hobby alive and one way to encourage new people to the hobby is by welcoming everyone to the forum.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 03:12 am:

Really have to wonder what the motivation behind this "suggestion" is/was? What is the agenda and who is pushing it?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John E Cox on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 04:40 am:

NO!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan B on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 05:51 am:

No


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Seth - Ohio on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 06:13 am:

I like the Forum open to all. When an issue arises it is handled by the moderator. I also like the ability to post non T comments as the conversation sways back and forth just like a group of people sitting in a room together talking.

Paid member Denny Seth


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chad Marchees _____Tax Capital, NY on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 06:15 am:

NO.

An open forum should be allowed. I assume there are plenty of people on here that are not MTFCA members, that is ok by me.

I too wonder the questioning of this. Most forums are open forums after you sign up for them, which includes a verification upon sign up to keep spammers out---most are v-bulletin style. But a requirement to be a MTFCA member is like having to be rich to join a certain country club.

Henry Ford wanted a car for the people, let's have a forum for the people.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter Claverie on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 06:16 am:

Look at the "other" Forum. You have to create an account, then 'register' every time you go on it. And, we constantly see its members asking why there is so little traffic on it.

Case closed.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenny Edmondson, Indianapolis on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 06:38 am:

How about charging for O/T threads. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William P Schubert....Bay City, Michigan on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 06:39 am:

Seriously? NO!!!!!!!!!!! How about another stupid idea instead? You get a gold star for every T you own, that way we can easily separate the amateurs form the "experts". Oh, I forgot owning more doesn't necessarily make you smarter, just more addicted.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Davis-SE Georgia on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 07:06 am:

No. It should be open to anyone. I'm not against a one time registration, if that is what it takes to prevent SPAM, but otherwise. It should be open to all.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By harvey cash on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 07:18 am:

NO, Please leave it open to all. Harv


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Dufault on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 07:34 am:

No


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Nicholas Lingg - Tarboro, NC on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 07:48 am:

NO


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Charles W. Little South Paris, Maine on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 07:53 am:

NO


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed in California on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 07:58 am:

Take stick, then insert stick gently into beehive. Twirl stick.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Coco on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 08:03 am:

I'll answer from an "outsiders" viewpoint. I'm not a member of MTFCA, nor do I own a T. I have been restoring and collecting antique cars for over 50 years, though, and everything about them is of interest to me.

I really enjoy the T forum, very active and lots of knowledge. I'm fascinated by the early T's, and through lack of knowledge let an open valve T slip through my hands over 30 years ago.

I appreciate being able to not only read, but also occasionally comment, on the forum.

Please keep it open. thanks David Coco Winchester Va.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 08:06 am:

Aucun!
No!
íNo!
Nein!
Anida!
Nyet!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ben Umberger on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 08:13 am:

No, this is a wonderful community for the hobby and people of good will help one another. To encumber the conversation would nearly kill it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Copeland - Trenton, New Jersey on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 08:37 am:

No


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Nicholas Lingg - Tarboro, NC on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 08:37 am:

I didn't know there were so many people looking at this site at one time!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roar Sand on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 08:38 am:

I think Dick lodge nailed it!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Eagle Ida Fls on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 08:41 am:

I have seen too many great institutions tweaked out of existence. I would hate to see this become another one.

Rich

(Member of MTFCA since 1966)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Michael Pawelek Brookshire, Texas on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 08:51 am:

No


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Strange - Hillsboro, MO on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:02 am:

Please leave it open to all, in my opinion exposing prospective enthusiasts to the hobby by way of the forum is a good way to get new members! :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dean Yoder, Iowa City IA. on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:07 am:

no


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Sam "POPS" Humphries...... Lexington, KY on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:14 am:

NO


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A Bartsch on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:18 am:

I am a member of MTFCA and that membership has opened doors to information and to interesting and helpful people. The forum information is extremely valuable, although I don't post much I try to help others when I can.

I suspect the question is driven in part by financial issues. Making MTFCA membership a requirement to read or participate in the Forum seems to me to be a bad idea. On the other hand, covering the costs of the forum is a serious concern too, we all benefit from the efforts of volunteers to maintain the service the forum provides, the knowledge the people in the Model T community share with each other.

Personally, even though I'm old school preferring print on paper, I would be happy receiving Vintage Ford electronically as a cost saving to MTFCA, but I'm not putting that up as a motion.

And if MTFCA dues need to increase to cover costs, including the Forum, well, it may be time.

Respectfully, jb


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Charlie B actually in Toms River N.J. on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:21 am:

Any more questions?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:24 am:

Proposed 'members only posting' by MTFCA exec management may be for costs to maintain the site, or future cost of migrating to a new format and server.

This older thread (2013) on forum usage has the cost of $500 annually, and forum user numbers as posted by the Webmaster Chris.

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/331880/409589.html?1388120195

Some membership requirement would raise funds to operate the site. But as noted, detrimental to free forum usage and gaining potential new members.

The MTFCI site is open to all, free, with just registration to restrict spam and related filth that happens on the Internet. That is a good thing. But MTFCA doesn't require membership to join its forum. Plus, all the Technical Info, scans of numerous parts books, Ford advertising, the Technical Library is now free to all to search and read. That is a service to help build new interest in the Ford for all.

No, to requiring club membership, or anything but simple registration to read and post on this site.

Dan
MTFCI, MTFCA, HCCA, AACA, Early Ford Registry member


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Charles W. Little South Paris, Maine on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:37 am:

It seems to me that in the "big picture" the forum can be considered to have paid for itself in the past few years. By getting the information on the museum "matching grant" out quickly, it probably was instrumental in drawing in the majority of the money collected. Maybe the the museum should donate to the forum if money is needed.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Derek Kiefer - Mantorville, MN on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:37 am:

This forum is probably the single biggest recruiting tool that the MTFCA has.

I think it would be a big mistake to eliminate that.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Mikeska, Denver CO on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:46 am:

NO!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Eyssen - Abilene TX on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:50 am:

NO!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Donnie Brown North Central Arkansas on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:57 am:

Im a "NO" "NO" NO" and I agree with Dick Lodge way up above in the 3rd post. and I also do not see one single yes or even a maybe in all the posts above. I also can not figure out a good reason to even ask this question ......


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Holland, Utah on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:11 am:

Barbra, I am afraid if you close it to members only; it will become stagnant. It may sound like a good idea at first, but after reading what the others are saying I do not think it would be good for us. I think that if you limited the Classified to paid up members. And only paid up members could post an add, that could be a good protection and also lead people to join. Especially those who just need a push to find a T. I would not stop non-members from lurking the classifieds. Just from posting adds for free.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By paul griesse--Granville,Ohio on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:17 am:

"open forum" the best approach---they can join MTFCA later---Paul


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Byrne - Racine, MN on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:18 am:

NO!!!

Terrible idea for the many reasons that have already been posted. As was stated above, this is the MTFCAs best advertisement and the greatest promotion for getting people involved with Model Ts. By the way, I am a long time member of the MTFCA (#8127).
Don't hurt the Model T's future by screwing up this forum, keep it open to everyone!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Seth from NC on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:20 am:

Hey everyone - if the cost of maintaining the site is an issue, why not accept donations? I'm on a Georgia Tech football forum that is only maintained by donations from its members. If we can keep that site up and running no problem every year, I don't see why it wouldn't work here. Especially if you accept site-specific donations. Let the people who use the site keep it open. No reason for there to be a line in the regular MTFCA budget for the forum.

Once a year the main moderator sets up a post with a link to an easy place to donate, and every day or two he posts updates as to how much is left. He's always got more money than he needs so we get maximum site upgrades every year, usually with some left over to roll into the next year.

I'd throw $5 at keeping this site up and I'm sure there are tons of folks on here who would gladly contribute much more. Of course, there will be some who don't donate any and that's fine too.

From what I can tell you have an extremely clear answer on what folks want - keep the site open to non-members. It should be pretty easy to figure out a way to give folks what they want, even if it means "Hey, you want it open to everyone, we have to have $X in donations."


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:29 am:

Just re-read the MTFCA Business Manager's post again:

I would like to hear from current Mtfca members. What is your opinion? Should we limit opinions to only persons who belong to the MTFCA?

Maybe its not about cost of the forum, seems more like freedom of speech issue? Most forums on the net use monitors, and delete or restrict posting for civil discourse reasons. Seems reasonable.

But why ask in this specific. That members only can have opinions? Opinions on what?

Who is being harmed with opinions? The club?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:29 am:

I vote NO.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Spaziano, Bellflower, CA. on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:31 am:

I vote NO!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Leck - Ohio on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:57 am:

It was written by Ford himself:
"It is strange how, just as soon as an article becomes successful, somebody starts to think that it would be more successful if only it were different."

Non-member, lurker, recent T-owner here. The reason I come to this forum is for the technical resource. If I wasn't allowed to post that'd be fine with me. If I wasn't allowed to see the classifieds, that could be a potential disappointment for a seller that had something I needed to buy, unless there was some ulterior motive for encouraging clubhouse trading vs. open market?

It would be a mistake to block the forum from people looking for technical help, they are potential members as has been noted above. The ten+ years of hashing, rehashing, bicker and banter about nearly anything I could think of has been a real help to me. I've especially enjoyed the Model K diversions and old photos. I like this forum's simplicity and the search fuction works well for me.

Thanks,
John


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 11:05 am:

No!
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Coco on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 11:36 am:

"It is strange how, just as soon as an article becomes successful, somebody starts to think that it would be more successful if only it were different."

Wow, is that the truth. Just this morning I was changing blades in a box cutter, an old one with one screw and one moving piece. 30 seconds in and done. I have another, improved, one, that has about 10 pieces and 2 screws and it takes 5 minutes to take apart and put together, IF you hold your tongue right....

Heck, as a non-member I'd pony up a few dollars to keep on the forum too!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Stan Howe Helena, Montana on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 11:37 am:

At the risk of getting embroiled in some controversy: Dan, I would guess that what was meant in the original question was if only members should be allowed to POST here, not if only members should be allowed to post their opinion.

From my viewpoint, I think the cost is very small for the amount of good the forum does, especially in the area of getting new members. It is to a large extent just a BS area for a lot of people, there is virtually no club information posted except when needed so I don't see it as a privacy issue where information should go only to members, etc. There is never any financial info on here to speak of and I think the moderator does a fine job of keeping unwarranted posts off the site.

I don't read it much anymore and don't post much and there is not much that interests me in a lot of the posts so I don't read a lot of the threads. But it seems like there are always new names, new people with questions and interest in T's, some people looking for information on selling something that is not of much interest to them but may be of big interest to T people,etc. Overall it seems that having it open to anyone is a pretty good idea. If there was a rule that was going to be imposed I would say that it be that people have to register and use their name, not just some handle that they can hide behind to make snarky comments but it doesn't seem like there is as much of that as there used to be anyway. John Leck made a good point. How many people are going to register just to see if there is something they might want to read? Money? It costs about $50 a month to host this according to the last report I had. If the club can't afford that we are too close to broke to continue as a club anyway.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 11:43 am:

"Should we limit opinions to only persons who belong to the MTFCA? "

Dan -- I don't think that freedom of speech is being challenged, I think she is asking whether we should limit "posting" to only persons who belong to the club. I guess Barb can clarify.

Since Donnie pointed out that there has not been "one single yes or even a maybe" so far on this thread, I'll post a couple of points for the other side. (Someone has to stir the pot a little. :-) )

Dick may be correct with his list of 5 steps in that order, but if membership were required to post, it just might be that step 3 would be moved to the end, not be removed.

Requiring membership to post might encourage some folks to join the club in order to participate.

A couple of guys mentioned above that they're ready to leave the forum because they don't like the way it's run now. They are free to leave at any time, of course. The forum will continue on just fine without them, as it has when other folks left in a huff.

I for one think this forum is run exceptionally well, and I'm not going anywhere unless Chris kicks me off.

The other forum was mentioned above. I registered for it, got all the snags out of that process, and read it a couple of times. I haven't been back for weeks. Why not? It's not as easy for me to use as this one, and this forum provides me with all the daily Model T internet fix I need. I like this format and am comfortable with it, just as everyone else here is. I understand that it may have to go the way of the Edsel at some time, but in the meantime, here we are.

So in spite of the fact that there are valid points on both sides of the issue, I'll cast my vote with the overwhelming majority and say I'd like to see access remain as it is. It could be that the change to require membership in order to post might discourage participation more than encouraging it. We don't know without trying it, but since it ain't broke, I say let's not fix it.

One thing several folks have suggested over the years and again in this thread is that people who post should use their real name. I agree with that. If someone has something important enough to say to us, we should know who is saying it.

I also think it's helpful to know where posters reside. It's helpful for us who read their posts, and it is also helpful to them if they're asking for assistance. There are lots of Model T folks who are unknown to those of us "in the community," and it would facilitate helping less-experienced Model T'ers if we know where they are. So some sort of location might be a good requirement for posting. It doesn't need to be city and state, it can be an area like NW AR (that's Arkansas, not Arizona) or SE Michigan. At least we have an idea where folks are that way.

I'll say it again, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Stan Howe Helena, Montana on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 11:52 am:

Well said, Mr. Walker!! (As usual)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Wells on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:00 pm:

No.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vince M on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:01 pm:

I vote no.

The comment regarding posting ones first and last name - this has different consequences for everyone. Some have personal interests to protect, some have business interests.

Google your name outside of the forum and your posts will come up. Taken out of context they can pose real problems.

Most on here post where they live, whats in their garage, their political views, kids names, pictures, license plate numbers, where they work...and on and on...not to mention the occasional off color remark.

There are some on here that are on disability that discuss all of their day to day activities like replacing engines etc.. just an example.


Vince M


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chuck Hoffman - Gold Country of Calif. on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:03 pm:

So, is there a problem with the way it works now? If it ain't broke, why mess with it?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chuck Hoffman - Gold Country of Calif. on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:03 pm:

Oh, dang! I'm not a member, so please disregard the previous post.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:11 pm:

I hope the "powers that be" at the MTFCA, have gotten the message. I think the opinion is unanimous, and I think most, if not all members, hope the "powers that be" never even bring the subject up again. If there is anyone connected with the Forum or Club that is so self centered as to want their own Forum and Club, let them go and start one of each so they can have their own little private group.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:15 pm:

Can I vote twice? If so: NO.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kirk Peterson on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:17 pm:

I appreciate when posters identify themselves and their location via the name and/or in their profile.

I have made several friends by recognizing them at other venues.

(Message edited by kirkiep on February 11, 2015)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Don Watson -Florence,Colorado on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:18 pm:

NO!

If it became for "Members Only" this Forum would die and there would be a stampede to use the MTFCI Forum which is Free.

-Don


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:21 pm:

Vince does raise an interesting point. At my age, I doubt I will ever be applying for a job anywhere again and I certainly have no plans to run for office, so someone's finding my online conversations probably can't harm me. I do remember on the CompuServe Masonry Forum that we had a rule about everyone using his real name. There was one forum participant from France whose job and even career could have been at risk if it had become known that he was a Mason. (European Masons don't do rings, lapel pins, car emblems, etc. for that reason.) We allowed him to post under a plausible pseudonym and only the forum staff knew his real name.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Conte on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:23 pm:

No!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:26 pm:

I can't vote because i don't know if my dues are payed up?? Bud.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vince M on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:26 pm:

Imagine if Brian Williams were on this forum.

Vince m


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:34 pm:

After re-reading the question please subtract my vote. I am not a paid member nor do I see a time when I will have the funds to be one. I only hope that while I have enjoyed the benefits of this forum I have also in kind repaid those benefits by being of help to others.
Thank you;
MarkG


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Wetherbee - Downeast Maine on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:38 pm:

I'll vote NO as well - I would hate to see our hobby not have the exposure to everyone that it has on this one forum.

I'm sure this is relating to the fact that all this type of club are losing members at an alarming rate, but it is from the generation gap that has developed where youth do not have the guidance from the older (and getting older every year) membership.

I'll add that the next generation is already more plugged into this style of computer forum, as to any magazine.

Killing this open forum would certainly hurt the future of the hobby.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Davis-SE Georgia on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:42 pm:

I think most of us use our real names, but it doesn't bother me when some don't. I mean really! How do you KNOW this is my real name? I might have just TOLD you this was my real name. What's to keep you from it?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:53 pm:

The first section of the MTFCA bylaws pretty much answers the original question:

ARTICLE I
PURPOSE AND CLASSIFICATION
Section 1
The general purpose of this club, incorporated as a nonprofit corporation, shall be to preserve and maintain Model T Fords of ancient age and historical value and to serve as an accurate and technical source of information concerning Model T Fords for the benefit of its members as well as the general public.

The MTFCA does an outstanding job meeting the stated purpose.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Justin H. - Western PA on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:54 pm:

I vote no. This forum made me become a member of the MTFCA, without it I probably wouldn't have joined.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jay - In Northern California on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:54 pm:

"I would like to hear from current Mtfca members. What is your opinion? Should we limit opinions to only persons who belong to the MTFCA?"


"limit opinions" Sounds like a few staunch Progressive whiner's went to the principals office to try and shut down opinions they disagree with.









As to the using your full name Vince totally hit the nail on the head with his remarks about posting your full name.



"The comment regarding posting ones first and last name - this has different consequences for everyone. Some have personal interests to protect, some have business interests.

Google your name outside of the forum and your posts will come up. Taken out of context they can pose real problems.

Most on here post where they live, whats in their garage, their political views, kids names, pictures, license plate numbers, where they work...and on and on...not to mention the occasional off color remark.

There are some on here that are on disability that discuss all of their day to day activities like replacing engines etc.. just an example."


If you all want to be part of the internet "MATRIX" and post your full name that's fine with me but I choose not to. I think people who tune in here know who I am after 7247 posts!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Dimock, Newfields NH, USA on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 12:58 pm:

I am not allowed to vote,
But if I could it would be NO!

I believe that a registration process is important and people should use their real name with a location - even if it just the State.
This would allow for some control of scammers and people that are abusive.

In regards to Dick Lodge's pseudonym comment - there is nothing saying that a person has to use their real name.
If someone has a reason or prefers to remain incognito that is his prerogative, but they will be missing out on an opportunity to meet and talk with some great folks.

FYI - When the Museum was moving and asking for money I sent them a check but missed the opportunity during the matching funds drive because of travel.
It would not have happened if I were not frequenting the forum.



A yearly fund raising drive for the forum like the museum request of the past might get a few of us tightwads to loosen their wallet but I would not make it a requirement.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Dimock, Newfields NH, USA on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:03 pm:

Jay - 7247 - woops 7248 posts probably means you have a lot to say! :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Semprez-Templeton, CA on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:21 pm:

To me, this club is about the forum, not the other way around! History has shown that If you restrict a forum's access, that forum will wither and die, and a new one will pop up and take it's place.

It would be wise for the MTFCA directors, when this questions arises, to consider a scenario where the forum goes private and traffic dwindles to a few old boys talking about stunningly important topics like "did you dust your Model T today?". In my opinion, few interested prospects would find any reason to join the club if it's forum heads down that path. MTFCA's coffee mugs, Tee shirts, and museum simply isn't the draw some folks must think they are. My recommendation; Think "Apple" not "Sears".

NO CLOSED FORUM!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rob Heyen on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 01:44 pm:

No...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Cole ---- Earth on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 02:05 pm:

I was a paying member till a couple years ago.That changed because of my personal economy. I dont bring in that much each month any more.Disability.

If my personal economy improves I may consider rejoining.


Here is a previous members opinion.
If someone comes on here that is causing a problem,send them a email and let them know the first time.And after that kick them off for a while.Don't mess up a good thing over a couple.
As for a whiner going to the principles office,that seems like the most plausible reason this even came up.

I must say I agree with Stan. If the club is hurting that bad that 500 bucks is putting them in a bind, something is wrong higher up the chain than forum cost.


Shucks for all I know I could be the 1 that someone complained about. Well, If I am,and that person is reading this, is a personal email or pm that difficult to send?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By kep on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 02:08 pm:

The french and russian people might find that inconvenient.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By G.R.Cheshire on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 02:12 pm:

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Walt Berdan, Bellevue, WA on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 02:32 pm:

First - no, don't limit access to read or post unless you want to kill the forum.

Second - Is there some perceived value in limiting access that all of us are missing? I'm totally missing what the benefit a closed forum would provide.

And yes, I'm a member, have been for almost 30 years and if I had to choose between the two I'd take the forum over the magazine.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By mike conrad on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 02:33 pm:

As a non member I know I no right to ask. But I will anyway. Barbra what is the real issue?? What on your mind?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Arthur Dewey Asher Washington IL on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 02:44 pm:

No


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Walter Higgins on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 02:46 pm:

Barbara wins the prize for starting the only opinion thread in which everyone agrees.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 02:51 pm:

A simple NO. That way my answer will be 'on topic'. People who insist on 'if this or that' or use 'but' to read something into the question to make the thread start drifting I guess have a habit of doing it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fritz Hady Mt. Top,Pa. on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 02:52 pm:

Absolutely NO!!!!!!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gene Carrothers Huntington Beach on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 03:07 pm:

Jay I did not know who you where but now that you posted a picture I realize I do know you... LOL

I agree with Kirk P and many others here that everyone should be required to post their location with a name so the reader can easily learn if this is someone close to them or when in another country be able to understand the posters needs.

Voting NO and wondering if anyone has voted yes?

I do think that everyone who receives value or enjoyment from using this forum would also feel a duty to join the club and support its activities like this. I understand there may be a very few that do not have the funds.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Craig Anderson, central Wisconsin on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 03:41 pm:

A wide open forum would lead only to a WILD open forum complete with every off topic subject imaginable and unimaginable and a spammer's dream come true.
It would make the wild west look like a picnic in comparison.
Registered users can be tracked by the webmaster and banned if necessary.
In short.......it would be DISASTER.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 03:47 pm:

I agree with Mike Conrad and asked the same thing earlier in this thread - with no definitive answer: what is the motivation behind this? The question has been posed and I think the complete picture needs to be revealed to give the question the correct context.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Garrison North of Iowa on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 03:55 pm:

Yes, I mean, no, well maybe. No, absolutely no. Never! Unless someone has a valid reason for it then, yes. But for now, no! I think. God I hate being put on the spot. Okay my vote is definitely; I don't think so, for now. Oh crap, I don't know. What do the rest of you guys think? Boy, I'm getting a headache from all this turmoil in my head. Can I wait and vote later?

For now I'm not a member of any club. I was a member of the local Model T club, and at one time I belonged to a local classic classic car club, The MTFCI and MTFCA.

I love my classic cars. Especially my Model T's. I really enjoy a great many of my Model T friends. I've also enjoyed some of the tours my local club has put on. I have never enjoyed being a "member" of any group. And the more formal the group is, the less I like it. I can truly say the only time I've enjoyed being affiliated with any group of people was in the bush in Viet Nam. Out there the team dynamics were important and a guys good performance was critical. But belonging to a group of people that spend more time worrying about whether I wear my name tag or not is a very low priority for me. If you want to know who I am, ask me! Then I'll decide if I want you to know. The same goes for where I live.

I agree that being with people with a common interest is a benefit. If I need information about something I want to do with my T, it's nice to have people available to turn to. Being turned away from something because I don't want to be a member doesn't seem right to me.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 03:57 pm:

Craig,

Nobody is suggesting a wide open forum. The question is, should registered users also have to be MTFCA members, versus not having to be members.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Craig Anderson, central Wisconsin on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 04:00 pm:

AH........that would leave me out.
I prefer to donate now and then rather than being forced to belong to an organization.
If AACA required "membership" I think they could as well take down the website........and the same for this one....... :-(


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis R on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 04:21 pm:

I'm a recent new member of the MTFCA. I was debating which club to join, MTFCA or MTFCI? The MTFCA won due to its forum. IMHO- As a whole the forum is usually very well self regulated for its content.(and is dang amusing at times when it isn't) Please don't change it! Restricting it to members only will give the MTFCA an "Exclusive Country Club" feel which doesn't lend itself to adding new members.

I have to wonder, is this whole thing is related to the big political hoo-ha thread a while back?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William L Vanderburg on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 04:38 pm:

While I don't agree that the forum should be limited to just dues paying members, because it would defeat the purpose of garnering new members, I do feel that each and every person who registers for the forum should be required to register with their actual name and not some fictitious moniker they choose to hide behind so they can throw barbs out to those they despise, or spew their vitriol at their hearts whim.

This is the 21st century, and we are all grown up adults and should be acting like it and not like petty children, who get mad every time some other kid pisses in the sand box. When that kid does, the webmaster and club president should put that person in time out, either by banning them if they are not a member or dressing them down in private email if they are.

If they are unwilling to learn, then they have the choice to leave.

I am a member of several other forums that require signed posts, the posts are moderated, and if you step out of line you are GONE. It works....but it won't work here.

But acting like adults will work here.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By justin cox on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 04:43 pm:

Being able to look at the wealth of info and the friendly guys on this forum helped make me feel better about buying my '26 since I knew if I needed help I would not be totally on my own.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill dugger on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 04:45 pm:

IMHO for what it is worth leave it open, however if it gets to one sided Chris can delete the thread. There are so many things that pop up that they are amusing and confusing and downright funny. Some of the questions asked are as dumb as can be but how else do you learn.
I say again

KEEP IT OPEN


and lets see what happens


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George Harrison,Eatonville,Wa on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 04:47 pm:

I am kind of late to the game. I am a current member and I agree with the majority. No No NO.I became interested in Model Ts found this forum,bought a car and then became a member.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Charles Linsenbarth on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 05:21 pm:

I'm a member of two forums that require membership, there both boring as all get out, because, some times people vote with their wallet and not a drive to seek knowledge of a subject.
Both of those web sites at one time had over 3000 members, now they both have less then 150 and the most posts any given day maybe 20.
But just think, unless for some reason you happened to see in person one of the T's I've had the pleasure to be a part of you guy's wouldn't have had the pleasure to look at and add your free opinion on those T's. And everyone here likes brakes starters aluminum wheels off-colors and 12 volt electrics. I may even have a T of my own some day.
Also, if someone posted here that this forum needed money, I'd send some in right away.
Charley


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jay - In Northern California on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 05:29 pm:

William, Fictitious moniker?? How do we know your real name is William L. Vandenburg??? Maybe we should all have to post our social security number and birth certificate info. Etc. Etc. Etc. to be able post here???

I am Jay - In Northern California to all the local car club guys and swap meet people in my area and have been for years. I wear a name badge saying so at all the old car functions I attend. I stand behind EVER word I say here on the Forum



Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Dufault on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 05:44 pm:

Interesting how "thread drift" works, isn't it?

Barbara's question was:

"Should we limit opinions to only persons who belong to the MTFCA? "

Many have stated their opinion; however, the thread has morphed into

Must posters use their real name?

Guess that depends. It seems that some have a reason to use an alias - or choose to use an alias. The only problem with that, is the bond of friendship that could develop between a poster and reader has another hurdle to jump. Yes, it can be overcome, but unless the hurdle is absolutely necessary, why put it there?

As for obscene, intimidating, objectionable posts, a name is not needed to have the objectionable poster banned.

Folks far smarter than I can look at the source of an e-mail and find the origination point. Every computer has a distinct "ID"...let a person try to post in a nefarious way and with a little detective work, the location of the computer can be ascertained (by the site moderator)....probably even the name of the owner of the computer, physical address, phone number(s), and household occupants.

There is a wealth of information "out there" - whatever you send over the computer can not only be read world-wide, but clever folks can trace it back to you....and for that reason, some folks choose to remain hidden - as best as they can.

Truly, answer Barbara's question, if you want...a poster who doesn't want to use his/her name is his/her business. Honestly, I would rather read something from a "named person" than from a pseudonym...but that's just my rather.

Yes, I agree with what has been said above -especially Dick's post WAY above (#3) - let the world post here - named is better for all concerned - but please try to use the same language you would use when discussing your T to a group of schoolchildren - or your best friend's children. Only with an "open" Forum will the hobby be able to keep young blood interested.

Dave Dufault - #303 for as long as the Lord lets me live.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 05:53 pm:

If you want to stir up a Hornet's nest, just post something that is controversial to all.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tim moore, "Island City" MI on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 05:58 pm:

No even though I have been a member of both clubs for about 30 years now. That being said I hope admin. does take note of several comments about using a name (and location is helpful) and not some CB radio handle. Jay---the way you sign does not bother me in the least, you use a name. Others I find impolite and weird.

By the way Jay, your contributions over the years have been outstanding and I really enjoy them.

Tim Moore


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Barbara Klehfoth on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 06:11 pm:

I hear you loud and clear! The posting was only my personal curiosity. Thanks to you all for your input!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Seth - Ohio on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 06:24 pm:

And as Walter would say: "And that's the way is was"


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Freighter Jim on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 06:31 pm:

You should be required to have a valid MTFCA member number in order to post a classified ad ....

Membership dues fund the forum along with donations.



Freighter Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Cole ---- Earth on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 07:08 pm:

A classified ad is bringing the poster income,rather it be at profit or loss.
It may be fair to let a Want ad be from unregistered. That would allow the non members a chance to find a car or part.

A quick clic of the profiles give our location I think.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jay - In Northern California on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 07:26 pm:

So how does limiting the classifieds to members only help grow the hobby? A non-member or average citizen who finds this site on the internet could have parts and such to offer that a member has been searching for for a long time.

IMHO - Limiting the classifieds to members would be a disservice to those members that use this site.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Cole ---- Earth on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 07:38 pm:

Well I agree with you Jay but I think what Jim is saying is if you earn money partly due to the use of the classifieds,something should kick back to the club.
I think the Smokstak forum is setup that they would appreciate 1% of the sale from a ad?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker in Sumter SC on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:03 pm:

Barbara,

No.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alan Woolf on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:14 pm:

Barbara, I am a MTFCA member and I vote No.

Thanks, Alan Woolf


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gilbert V. I. Fitzhugh on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 09:39 pm:

It appears the requirement to be a member to use the forum is a non-starter. Great! I heartily agree!

As to ads, the HCCA website has a very active and popular classified section (unlike its forum, which probably gets more posts from me than from everyone else put together). A member can post a text-only ad for free; everyone else pays a small fee. Ads with pictures (VERY popular!) are cheap to members, and less cheap (but still a bargain) to non-members. Everybody gets to see what's for sale, members get a break for being members, and the website brings in some money. I think this is win-win all around.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:33 pm:

Not true. Anyone can post a free text only ad on the HCCA website.

They charge for the upgraded ads with discounts given to members.

All ads are reviewed before they are posted.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 10:40 pm:

Has anyone thought about a sustaining membership? Say for $15 or $20 a year you can be a member, vote in the elections, go to national meets but not receive the bi-monthly magazine. The people putting the club magazine do a wonderful job but there is just too little in it that interest me except the tech stuff.
Anyway, just a thought.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gilbert V. I. Fitzhugh on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 11:11 pm:

Erik - Thank you. I was wrong. And, since I used to be the national director in charge of the website, I ought to have known better!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Burger in Spokane on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 11:11 pm:

I'm not so sure, guys ... we have a lot of riffraff up to no good around these
parts. Has the club ever given thought to forming a secret police and building
hard labor camps to "re-educate" those who refuse to conform ?

Things just can't be left to go on like they have ....


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jay - In Northern California on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 11:37 pm:

Why it's the Model T Ford made the trouble,
made the people wanna go, wanna get, wanna get,
wanna get up and go seven, eight, nine, ten, twelve,
fourteen, twenty-two, twenty-three miles to the county seat.

Well, ya got trouble, my friend.
Right here, I say trouble right here in River City! :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Wednesday, February 11, 2015 - 11:57 pm:

A better question would have been: How many members would like to receive VF in pdf instantly, instead of snail mail?

The American Aviation Historical Society sends a password with every e-subscription, so members can read the mag on the members only section of their site.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Gumbinger, Kenosha, WI on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 12:07 am:

I vote NO!

Keith, Life Member #231


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Iversen on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 12:20 am:

Like Mack, fixed retirement demanded choices on my part. Lovely T pictures in the magazine but, when increasing experience begin to trump gain from the technical aspects of what the club publication offers, it seemed time to fall back to a very few mag subscriptions, such as Smithsonian, that can actually stimulate and old dog away from the natural progression toward backward conservatism. That reaps guilt for the gain I've enjoyed, through the classifieds, but I noticed someone earlier made a sound case as to why that should remain wide open as well. I have no interest in any forum that is not all-inclusive.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 12:27 am:

Meredith Willson stated the case perfectly. Little towns like Silverdale and Geuda Springs had stores, restaurants, banks and hotels and were regular railroad stops. Now the tracks are gone and so are the businesses, and the folks who live in the few houses that are left drive to the big towns to shop. It was a huge change in about thirty years.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By bob middleton on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 12:44 am:

Well not a current member of mtfca but have in the past was part of tge national banquet that was in my area at the time wrote an artical for the vintage ford had not owned a T for few years well that changed last year by me buying one and then aquiring another one now took both and selling off what i dont need i dont have a trailer and just want one for fun occasional outing when i have a free minute or something tinker with if i have a second miss that
I didnt mind the signup process and glad you guy allow those with a car and truck or interest be a little part here
Post i read i try add my 2 cents when or if i can feel thats being part of the group
Oh i was asked at signup if i was a member or not
The last club thing i was a non member was at richond ind 2009


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Dwyer in Troy, New York on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 07:50 am:

Closing the forum to non-MTFCA members is like saying that:

1) You must have a Model T to join the MTFCA.

2) You must be a member of the MTFCA to buy a Model T.

Now, what's wrong with that logic?

KEEP THE FORUM OPEN TO ALL !!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Skip Anderson, in MN. on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 11:45 am:

No!!!
If I belonged to every car club out there and was restricted to its exclusive members and forums I'd miss out on valuable info. At my age I have learned quite a bit about many different autos not just T' and A's. Where else can I share this experience with the younger owners that are just starting out in the hobby? They are the future, and if the hobby is to survive, keep it open to all.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William L Vanderburg on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 02:48 pm:

Well, Jay in Northern California, Vandenburg is NOT my name, because you spelled it wrong LOL

But seriously, why in the name of God would I make that up? I'm not ashamed of my name...I want people to know who I am...

I think if you really read what I said, you get the point.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jay - In Northern California on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 03:28 pm:

William, My co-worker of many years last name was VandeNburg Hence my brain screwing up your last name. Sorry about that!

I don't do "social media" for the same reason my last name here is "In Northern California". I Really have no need for the world to be able to shine the Google Flashlight up my Butt anymore then need be.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill dugger on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 06:37 pm:

To Barbara and Jay in Corporate: As I said no keep it open but I have one thought that I would like to bring up. If you post here on the Forum or the classifieds, make it that if they post they must show their name and where they are. This i my only concern.
That my HO and thoughts.
Lets hear from some of the others and if this was mentioned earlier I am sorry I missed it as I did not read each and everyone of the posts, but just came to the bottom of the listing.
Thanks and KEEEP ONNNNT'IIIIING
bill d
Redding Cal


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Davis-SE Georgia on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 08:00 pm:

I think you guys are making WAY too big a deal out of full names and locations. You could make up ANY name and ANY location and NO ONE will be able to tell. Who's going to police this? How will you verify if one is telling the truth?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Joseph Geisler on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 09:33 pm:

Barbra,
No... We NEED the hobby to grow! How do you get membership? By people getting involved and FINALLY getting a running T!!! They ALL need this forum!
For answers
Photos
Parts to sell or buy
If we need to have our clubs to have a few banquets or fund raising deals to keep it going then so be it.
To limit it to just members would aid in a slow death of the hobby. We need to push the club magazine more on the forum to new members. That way they become a member!
They first have to have an INTEREST
A car helps
Many who I have gotten into the T's just rode with me in one of my cars which was the SAME way I got into restoring the T's. Although, I did get into the hot rodding of a few of my T's in the mid 60's. They (2) {23 to 25s} were just parts. Welded to EMT conduit to form the T roadster bodies with the door opening like the real thing. But they WERE real T sheetmetal. One was an early Dodge hemi and the other was an Oldsmobile powered, both were automatics. One a poop deck and the other was a REAL T bed shortened by me. We did not have any fiberglass stuff then. AND I MUST ADD when LeRoy Tex Smith built the first glass ones I did buy one of his bodies (Get this) I put it on a REAL 23 Chassis with a real metal door, firewall, seat riser, etc and restored it. It WON a first junior MTFCA trophy. One of the MTFCA members (Don Lewis) protested at the banquet spoiling my evening!!!! I was allowed to keep the trophy but to never show the car again. That hurt but showed what I could do in my hobby then! I was understanding and HURT. I sold that car a few months later and built 2 more with steel. The reason for the hot rodding... 77 Sunset Strip and Cooky Burns did that to me!!! I saw Norm in 1963 in his T in LA on a visit there with my uncle, who was a lawyer, there. One of Dad's 7 brothers. I fell in love with his car. So we all build what we see and desire.
Joe in Mo.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Burger in Spokane on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 09:44 pm:

Does the club sanction torture and executions of non-compliant members ?

Strict discipline should bring membership WAY up. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 10:14 pm:

The correct answer with regard to health of this hobby and purported common interest of promoting/preserving the Model T is so self-evident, that one really has to wonder why the question was asked in the first place. Sorry, but "personal curiosity" seems to be an insufficient response; something else prompted the inquiry and it appears that reason will not be disclosed here.

Regardless of the reason, the exclusionary tone of the question in such a mixed venue of members and non-members was a real turnoff to anyone who may have been considering joining the MTFCA.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jay - In Northern California on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 10:32 pm:

Ron Wrote:
"one really has to wonder why the question was asked in the first place. Sorry, but "personal curiosity" seems to be an insufficient response; something else prompted the inquiry and it appears that reason will not be disclosed here."

Ron, Your comment above is spot on to my very same thoughts as to the "WHY" of this threads birth.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ronald L Babb on Thursday, February 12, 2015 - 11:36 pm:

Another member though still very new, my T isn't even home yet, votes no. That's crazy not to have it open.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William L Vanderburg on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 12:35 am:

Yeah, Vandenburg, Vanderburg, VanDerburg, Van Derburgh, etc. it's all basically the same group of people.

However, my grandfather was adopted... it wasn't his birth name LOL


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 12:38 am:

Using the technique of Lyndon Baines Johnson, I cast 87 votes NO


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Freighter Jim on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 08:26 am:

To clarify ...

On the General Discussion Forum:

Although it would be nice if those posting supported the MTFCA by joining - that decision should be left to the individual.

On the Classified Forum:

Folks posting should be required to have a valid MTFCA number to post.

Most forums that I belong to that have an option to pay for a premium or upgraded membership - I financially support.

Some forums I sponsor on or I place classified advertising in their magazine or print media.

If you buy or sell - you are benefitting from the Classified Forum here on the MTFCA and you should financially support it ... :-)


Freighter Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 11:02 am:

???????

Offering free classifieds to non-members directly benefits members.

An overwhelming majority of antique car parts and related items that I have purchased over the years are from folks who are not involved in the hobby, don't have antique cars and are not members of any antique car clubs. They simply have acquired or inherited some items and want to sell them.

Likewise, I purchased my Model T from someone who was not in the hobby and not a member of a club. Of all the antique cars my father purchased in his 67 years in the hobby, only one was bought from another antique car enthusiast and car club member.

Why stifle similar opportunities by restricting classifieds to members only?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 11:23 am:

Nothing is cut and dried. Many years ago, I was the editor of the Model T Club of Greater St. Louis newsletter ("The Occasional") and I placed For Sale ads from non-members of the club who contacted me. My feeling was exactly as Erik describes, i.e. I saw it as a benefit to our members who might want to buy something. The benefit to the non-member seller was merely a side effect.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jay - In Northern California on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 11:24 am:

Right on Erik! Yours are exactly my thoughts on the matter to.

If your an average Joe wanting to list something is DIFFERENT then if your a business wanting to advertize on a classified column.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Dimock, Newfields NH, USA on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 11:31 am:

Erik has a good point -- Many of the real finds are cars or parts that are sitting in an old barn or were inherited and are just sitting.
I know of at least three vehicles that belonged to someone's dad that are just collection dust.

Most of the time those big stashes of vehicles and parts belong to a loner that would never join a club, so when they finally pass their kids just send them to the junker unless they stumble on a site like this.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By george house . . .caldwell county, TX on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 11:34 am:

I hope Forum usage isn't limited only to MTFCA members. Much valuable fellowship will be lost. Heck, I'd rather let Obama run the www.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Vitko on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 02:53 pm:

I joined originally for a reduction on insurance costs for a T bought in orange county in California found in club classifieds. That was in 99.

After that many parts have been sold or bought and much good information was found from the many VERY sharp folks who post.

If it takes another 5.00 or 10.00 for increasing costs and keep our moderator who works for nothing and does an outstanding job I have no issue.

Many times I have run across someone who has parts or Ts with there only interest is selling them when obviously some one on the forum needs them.

I tend to agree with George-----don't screw it up! Much rather give it to the club then internet tax that looks like its coming!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 05:32 pm:

I think the forum should be free and open to all!! I also think members should run the club! Bud.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tex Holtby on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 07:54 pm:

Keep the forum and Classifieds open to everyone. I feel that my MTFCA dues cover the Vintage Ford magazine & postage and not forum use. As far as the Classifieds go - I'm happy to buy from or sell parts to members or non members (I guess I'm just a equal opportunity model t'er........). Tex, Honeoye Falls, NY.....


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron on Friday, February 13, 2015 - 11:29 pm:

Agree with Erik. There are countless occasions when someone joins the Forum just to sell something - an inheritance or something found in the barn of a recently acquired property. Requiring membership in the MTFCA for such posters would drive them to such sites as E-bay/T-bay where the parts/vehicles may end up in the possession of individuals not necessarily of the same mind and spirit as those on the Forum.

Would pose the following question to those who feel "If you buy or sell - you are benefitting from the Classified Forum here on the MTFCA and you should financially support it." Are you willing to provide a percentage of EACH delivery you garner from posting here to the MTFCA? Because if you are not, you should think twice about suggesting the same of every Joe Sixpack, like me, who is either looking to put a set of rim bolts in the hands of someone else OR is the other enthusiast who posts because he needs it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Dimock, Newfields NH, USA on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 01:29 am:

Ya OK. I think anyone that is not a member of the club should be banned from this forum forever. After all who needs freeloaders and knowledgeable people that are willing to share their knowledge of model T's with other enthusiasts? Either you should be willing to pay up or be banned! I don't care how much you know all I care about is how much money you give to me!

Now I have said it and will stick by my wards until my wife finds out what I said and I have to type a retraction


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Victor Bloxsome on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 03:39 am:

This is a T forum for us upside down people Downunder who drive on the correct side of the road and drink 5% ale -not at the same time ; it would be economically unviable to have to join the MTFCA and receive its excellent magazine months late when we can be part of the goings-on instantaneously via the net . I have enjoyed an almost cosy companionship for years the way things are now. Even sneaking in a few OTs have been great fun for me , both mine and others . How else could we have gleaned so much non-USA interesting info ? Keep it up , but keep it down the line .
My own two-bob,s worth ; Victor.(a bob is-was- a shilling )


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Frank van Ekeren (Australia) on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 04:16 am:

Now, be honest, you would miss me, wouldn't you? well maybe a few won't. Look how dull it's getting with out Royce for the last couple of months.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Torsten Lampe - Altwittenbek, Germany on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 06:36 am:

what you want to achieve? A relationship to T, for Mtfca or both? I think a relationship for mtfca comes automatically from the T. With the historic vehicle you would like to exchange ideas with like-minded. Who has a social vein is then also a member


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan B on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 07:54 am:

I think if we just let this thread die instead of making the same point over and over again, the point would be made.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry Davis Houston TX. on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 08:22 am:

If it ain't broke don't fix it......and it ain't broke. Jerry


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Dimock, Newfields NH, USA on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 09:17 am:

Retraction has now been typed! :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By only well loved people have names on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 11:59 am:

Why do people worry about names? Most car forums people have names like "Slick Drifter" or "79musclecar"


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jay - In Northern California on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 12:06 pm:


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob McDaniel(Indiana Trucks)Star City In on Saturday, February 14, 2015 - 08:39 pm:

My vote is NO, don't fix a thing. We like unrestored originals here.


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