J&m drums

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: J&m drums
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By bob middleton on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 01:58 am:

Was reading about them and are they worth the extra price
Only looking at the low drum and possibly the brake drum ? Since its down to rebiuld


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 03:53 am:

I think J&M makes the whole assembly including the shafts with gears, thus the higher price. There is another producer of just the drums, I think - if you already have good gears on your cracked drums.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Bender Tulsa Oklahoma on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 06:00 am:

If you have good gears on the drums another option as Roger states is to replace the drum only. Dave's Restoration sells and offers a service of changing out your drums if you wish.

These drums are fully machine from cast iron billet and made very well. Having install a dozen or so, what I really like it they are almost always in balance or require very little work to bring them into balance, unlike some of the other options out there. Link to his web site http://www.davesrestorationandmachine.com/


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Musegh Kalon on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 10:21 am:

Used many of their drums and they are perfect and all cnc machined to the original prints.
If you want a nice part then these are for you.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 10:34 am:

Another option, which I think some of you guys were referencing above, is Dave Nolting from Ashley Ohio. He be reached at 614-438-3268. He makes real nice transmission drums, fully machined from solid so the balance should be near perfect, and at a reasonable price. He will install your gears for you, or you can do it yourself. Either way, I don't believe he offers gears.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 10:55 am:

Oops, I see Mike Bender beat me to it...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By J and M Machine Co Inc on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 02:20 pm:

Quote: Was reading about them and are they worth the extra price
Quote:

Yes: If you value doing it correctly.Lot's of restoration parts do it 90% and think it's close enough well ours are 100%.

Our drums are made from ductile cast iron and are sold as a unit with new gear.

Now; You aren't just paying more for two pieces riveted together there's a reason for this.

One: They are made exactly to the Ford Prints which means just that, correct as Ford designed.

Two: The drums and gears are assembled, then Drums are final machined so there's no concentricity problems then are ground per Ford Spec.

Three: The brake drum lugs are broached per Ford Spec so the clips don't fall off.
No one else does this.

The drums we make cost more because you get more. It's not just a saying it's a fact.

http://www.jandm-machine.com/fordModelTtransmissionDrums.html





Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 06:12 pm:

Am satisfied customer of J&M.



Got my new drums in 2004.

Have logged thousands of miles in the '27 touring. Initially ran wood band linings. After running the low wood band down to 1/2 thickness, changed over to Kevlar.

Here is the look after running wood bands for 6 years on new J&M drums.



2010 time to change out wood as the low band lining was worn too much.

Now with Kevlar, will run a decade or more with ease and no worries of cracked or busted drums!




Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Howell on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 06:39 pm:

All of this is very interesting.

I know that Dave's drums are very easy to balance, they are almost balanced as you receive them.

Does anyone have experience balancing J&M Drums?

Has anyone seen this video?

http://modelt-tips.com/Engine/16.html


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 07:23 pm:

I can't believe Bill Howell actually made a post on the Forum after all these years. Welcome aboard, Bill! :-)

Great videos, by the way. For those who don't know, Bill is the webmaster for our Arkansas Tin Lizzies club, and he filmed all the videos in the "modelt-tips.com" series with Mike Bender. The two of them worked for several months compiling those videos for the benefit of all of us T'ers. Lots and lots of good info in those, on all aspects of working on Model T engines and transmissions. Thanks, Guys!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Howell on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 07:40 pm:

Thank You, Mike


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Mikeska, Denver CO on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 07:57 pm:

Bill,

Nice to see you on the forum!

Paul


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Moorehead on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 08:41 pm:

I can't say enough about Mike's videos and how much he has showed me on assembly, balancing and just overall good suggestions. Maybe you all ought to do a reality show. Got to be better than most of what is on TV now.
Thanks Mike and Bill.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Howell on Monday, March 30, 2015 - 10:33 pm:

Thank you, Tom


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By J and M Machine Co Inc on Tuesday, March 31, 2015 - 12:56 pm:

It seems that there's some misinformation about our drums as a poster just sent me an email asking if ours are balanced>?

Our drums are cast iron as Ford did.
They will have the same unbalance as Ford's though can be balanced.
That's the difference between cast and billet is the balance.

I will post pictures shortly of the balancing of the drums showing indiscriminate unbalance and what it takes to balance the drums.

Dan Treace: thanks for posting the satisfied comments.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By J and M Machine Co Inc on Tuesday, March 31, 2015 - 04:41 pm:



Since a poster mentioned how hard it was to balance our drums, I wanted to post a demonstration. The low speed and reverse drums have the oblong holes that metal be can taken from to lighten the drum without drilling.

The brake drum was a bit harder due to it's design however with the drums mounted on a mandrel and spun "dynamically" approximately one hour and I had better than satisfactory results.

If you'll notice the "Gram-in" is the total unbalance of the drum . This drum was off 25.68 grams, Almost one ounce and after at seven hundredths of a gram.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By J and M Machine Co Inc on Tuesday, March 31, 2015 - 04:46 pm:

Now for the brake drum.I drilled six 5/16" blind holes to correct the unbalance of the cast drum.
This started out a 44 grams and finished up at seven hundredths of a gram.
In cost of labor for a local machine shop to do this work I figure from 75 to 100 dollars for all three.



Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Bennett - Australia on Tuesday, March 31, 2015 - 05:30 pm:

I am a little confused with the statement, "made to Ford prints". To me this means made exactly as Ford made them. My confusion arrives when I see the additional lugs added to the inside of the brake drums to take the clutch plates. This certainly is an improvement over the standard Ford drum with its tendency to crack around the thread holes and wear excessively. But is it "made to the ford print"? Or are US drums, as opposed to our Canadian sourced ones, all made this way?

I have used both Dave's and J&M drums and have no complaints with either.

Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kohnke Rebabbitting on Tuesday, March 31, 2015 - 10:44 pm:

We have used J&M drums since they started making them.

What's not to like, A brand new drum, a brand new Gear, a brand new bearing surface, Ground after being made, every thing centered, and it isn't any harder to balance then any originals we do, also. It's not any kind of an issue.

What you are saving in money is about 213.00 to 239.00 per drum. But with J&M's drums, you are getting a new gear, and shaft bearing, for that money.


Well Bill I watched your video, like you pointed out, and what you said about balance on the billet drums. You said that some are all most in balance. From what I have seen over the years, riveting a center in a drum, does not guarantee that the drum will be concentric with the bushing, or the drum will be in center with the gear, as it was finished machined, before hand. When you rivet pieces together they can move, or distort, especially if the old rivet holes are enlarged, from previous riveting, drilling, or punching in the old holes.

So what we are talking about is the time it takes to balance the the drums in the video, with the cut out at least an hour, and J&M said the same thing.

With one big difference, J&M's are in real balance, and those in the video, are not. I sure wouldn't Static balance drums and tell my customer, your transmission has been balanced.

Static balance is old Technology!

My opinion.

Herm.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kohnke Rebabbitting on Tuesday, March 31, 2015 - 10:51 pm:

Allan, in 1925, late, Ford used replaceable lugs on the brake drums, I have about 5, two out of the 1950's Ford dealerships, are N.O.S.

Herm.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Bennett - Australia on Wednesday, April 01, 2015 - 03:37 am:

Herm, do the late 25 drums have the extra boss to take the replaceable shoes, or do they just have the shoes on the threaded boss.

Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By roy palmer on Wednesday, April 01, 2015 - 06:59 am:

I''m a very happy user of J and M drums, five years now and running....


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kohnke Rebabbitting on Wednesday, April 01, 2015 - 11:23 am:

They are just like the 26-27 drums, Replaceable lugs, part no. 3312.

Herm.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Bennett - Australia on Wednesday, April 01, 2015 - 08:02 pm:

Thanks Herm, I have never seen a narrow drum with the additional lugs with the shoes on them. I will keep an eye out from now on.

Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Wednesday, April 01, 2015 - 11:01 pm:

Alan -- They are not plentiful. Probably less so "down under." I have seen only a couple but can say that they do exist. :-)


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