1927 Top Pivot for Irons- can I drill and nut it?

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: 1927 Top Pivot for Irons- can I drill and nut it?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Chochole, Oswego, IL on Monday, April 20, 2015 - 10:03 pm:

My 1927 Roadster doesn't have any posts for the top- the guy before me cut or took them off and sealed over the holes.

I am asking for measurements to begin re-locating the two holes on each side of the Roadster body. I'll have to drill into the sheet metal.

For the two pivot brackets- can I drill and nut directly to the body metal or is there a support bracket underneath the skin?

Thanks,
Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Daron - Brownsburg IN on Monday, April 20, 2015 - 10:37 pm:

They were only about 4 inches long.Flanged on one end with the bolt threads and they went through the body skin and mounted into the upright.If you don't have any upholstry,those holes should still be there.Perhaps a parts book will show them?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Chochole, Oswego, IL on Tuesday, April 21, 2015 - 09:24 am:

To complicate the issue, the guy welded sheet metal inside the body panels and covered up any mounting flanges. So it is kinda guesswork now.

Thanks,
Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Tomaso - Milton,WA on Tuesday, April 21, 2015 - 09:44 am:

Is your T painted & upholstered ? If upholstered, you might consider "undoing" the upholstery in the rear side areas to locate the brackets.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Tuesday, April 21, 2015 - 10:08 am:

Here is a picture showing that area. Use the zoom feature of your PC to get a closer look.

The threaded boss for the irons is on a body bracket that is riveted to the body sides. The rearmost threaded boss is from the top prop rod that holds the top saddle when the top is folded down.






Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Tuesday, April 21, 2015 - 10:35 am:

Here is a little more detail on the inside:





The end of the pin is threaded into the fitting on the inside of the body. Just attaching to the body sheet metal would likely not be strong enough with out some kind of larger stiffener/gusset on the body.

Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Thode Chehalis Washington on Tuesday, April 21, 2015 - 10:45 am:

Here is another photo of the main post hole without the wood. There is a nut that holds the post in.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eric Sole - Castelldefels (Spain) on Tuesday, April 21, 2015 - 02:17 pm:

Jim Thode beat me to posting pics.

Here are pictures taken of my '27 Runabout: outside view and four different angles of inside moving down from an overhead view.










Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Chochole, Oswego, IL on Tuesday, April 21, 2015 - 06:31 pm:

Here's what I am up against...
1
2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James M. Riedy, Sandusky, Ohio on Tuesday, April 21, 2015 - 07:02 pm:

Jim, Are you planning to put stock style interior back in? If so, I would try to cut a hole with maybe a 1 1/2" hole saw into the interior panel about 2"down from top edge and 2 1/2" back from door jamb to see if the original hardware is still intact. Then you could locate your outside hole using the original threaded inside hole then cover with new interior. I got those dimensions off of my 26 roadster. Hope this helps and is a little more clear than mud. Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James M. Riedy, Sandusky, Ohio on Tuesday, April 21, 2015 - 08:04 pm:

Out side pics. Jim

measure


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Chochole, Oswego, IL on Wednesday, April 22, 2015 - 08:46 am:

Thanks James- I may have to do that.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Wednesday, April 22, 2015 - 11:16 am:

Would someone with a 27 roadster make him a cardboard template with the hole in it so he could use it to locate the hole for the top iron?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Wednesday, April 22, 2015 - 03:18 pm:

James,

I'll bet that the area where the holes was is not now just clean smooth sheet metal. When you "drill" the new hole I'll bet you run into filler, and all kinds of junk.

The suggestions to gain some access to the inside are probably the best ones.

When you are ready to make the new holes, I suggest that if room allows, you use a Greenlee punch to make a nice clean hole. Drilling a hole that large in sheet metal could be a mess.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#panel-punches/=wv6se2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By M G Hillhouse on Wednesday, April 22, 2015 - 08:38 pm:

The correct inside brackets come up on eBay and would be the best route. Then you can get the exact location and support for the top iron. MG


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Chochole, Oswego, IL on Wednesday, April 22, 2015 - 09:09 pm:

Thanks guys, I suspect the insides are cleaned out as well- most of the evidence suggests he made it smooth to weld in sheet metal.

MG, you said the inside brackets for the top iron appear on eBay from time to time? Hmm, I'll have to watch for them.

Thanks- Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Chochole, Oswego, IL on Sunday, May 17, 2015 - 05:33 pm:

Okay, I drilled into the wall and here is what I have- a hole in the skin of the car, nothing more. Looks like he welded sheet-metal over the existing skin and covered over the hole- are two thicknesses of skin (one thick, one thinner) enough to support a Runabout top iron?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Sunday, May 17, 2015 - 06:25 pm:

Look at the pictures posted by Eric Sole. They show a bracket with a threaded hole for the top irons. Look very well into the hole you drilled, in fact try to thread the top iron support into the hole. If you are lucky, you will find a threaded hole in there. I personally don't think the sheet metal skin on the car is strong enough to hold it. You might need to remove the inner panel and install the bracket to your car if one is not there.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gary Tillstrom 30 miles N of Memphis TN on Sunday, May 17, 2015 - 06:38 pm:

You have bigger problems. Someone has modified that rear panel and you no longer have the provisions for the tack rail to attach your upholstery and top to. At this point the pivots are a minor issue.

You need some detailed photos of a good body without the upholstery. I know some may pooh pooh at this suggestion, I would be shopping for a better body and sell that one to a street rod guy. That looks good enough that it should bring decent money.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James Chochole, Oswego, IL on Sunday, May 17, 2015 - 06:55 pm:

Gary yes, that is true but I don't have to exactly do it for stock I may make some modifications and give it my best shot to make it as presentable as a Model T. The body is very strong, no rust and is in good shape. As a fun car, not a show car, it has lots of great potential.


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