Velie Carriage and model T Ford

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: Velie Carriage and model T Ford
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matt Lindberg on Thursday, June 18, 2015 - 04:16 pm:

Has anyone ever heard of a connection between the Body on a Velie Carriage and the Body of a Model T? You must admit there are some definite similarities.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Georgetown TX on Thursday, June 18, 2015 - 04:36 pm:

Looks to me like someone cut down a Model T body and mounted it to a carriage. I would find a period photo more believable than a photo of a "restoration".


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Thursday, June 18, 2015 - 05:25 pm:

That is not a fantasy piece or the marriage of an automobile body and a horse buggy.

Are you sure that is a Velie, and not a Staver?

Staver made a horse drawn buggy with a body to emulate an automobile roadster. They also had electric side lamps, not the large carriage lamps shown in Matt's photo.

There is a very nice, original/unrestored Staver in the collection of the Heritage Village at the Dakota County Fairgrounds in Farmington, MN. I also looked at another Staver at an auction in Cologne, MN a few years ago.

The Staver roadster buggy has been discussed before. Note: the yellow Staver buggy shown in this thread probably never started out its life with an electric motor as I don't believe that Staver ever produced an electric car. Also, the set up is too crude.

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/257047/302194.html?1343852372

Staver buggy that was sold at auction in Minnesota:

1


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Thursday, June 18, 2015 - 05:29 pm:

PS: I think the unrestored example above should satisfy Royce.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Thursday, June 18, 2015 - 05:38 pm:

The Velie that Matt posted is currently up for auction in Glencoe, MN.

https://www.proxibid.com/asp/LotDetail.asp?ahid=527&aid=95141&lid=25282399#tople ft

Note that the language regarding the Model T Ford is pure baloney.

Glencoe is west of the Twin Cities. Apparently, that particular body style was popular in my neck of the woods.

Erik in Minneapolis


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Townsend ; ^ ) Gresham, Orygun on Thursday, June 18, 2015 - 06:52 pm:

http://p10.hostingprod.com/@veliepartsboard.com/buggy/buggys.html

: ^ )


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matt Lindberg on Friday, June 19, 2015 - 09:33 am:

Thanks Erik, I had never heard of a connection between Velie and Ford, That is why I questioned the description of this item. I have Heard the John Deere Connection before and that is true. Still a beautiful little buggy that I might pick up if it goes cheap enough. I also was at the sale in cologne and bid on the Staver there, but I didn't bid too high because I was saving my money for steam engines.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Friday, June 19, 2015 - 09:46 am:

Willard Velie was the grandson of John Deere.

He founded the Velie Carriage Company in 1902, which was rather late in the game, but he saw there was still a demand for horse drawn vehicles.

He also started the Velie Motor Vehicle Company in 1908. Velie automobiles were produced through 1928.

These were two different companies.

It makes no sense that Willard Velie would have a connection with Ford when he had his own automobile company.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George John Drobnock on Friday, June 19, 2015 - 10:22 am:

We seem to forget that the production of the automobile was in an era when the horse drawn carriage was still in production. A review of bodies from the birth of the automobile till about 1930 followed the design of horse drawn carriages. Beginning in the 30's aerodynamics was coming into vogue. And the boxy carriage was on its way out. To say that Ford and Velie were together maybe a stretch. Maybe Ford out sourced a limited number of bodies maybe not. Early on in the development of his cars, in house or out, Ford relied on experienced carriage and coach builders to supply and construct the bodies for the 1903 on, Model A, B, C, etc car bodies. These body builder came from the carriage industry.

For a view of card body design see - http://automobilebrandsofthepast.blogspot.com/2014/04/from-carriages-to-first-au tomobiles.html


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Smith on Friday, June 19, 2015 - 10:45 am:

That second picture looks like a top for a '13 runabout!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Thomas Mullin on Friday, June 19, 2015 - 11:14 am:

When did Ford actually start producing their own bodies instead of buying them from Wilson, Beaudette (Pontiac), Fisher Brothers and other carriage makers?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Johnson on Friday, June 19, 2015 - 11:19 am:

It's not complicated.

Commercial production of automobiles in the U.S. commenced in 1895 with the Duryea Motor Wagon Company.

The Velie and Staver buggies in question date from 1914-15 when automobile production and consumption was in full swing.

Horse drawn vehicles were on their way out.

This is a case where automobile body design influenced carriage design. These particular Velie and Staver buggy bodies emulate automobile roadster bodies. It's an effort to stay modern.


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