14 degree grade

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: 14 degree grade
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By neil obrien on Monday, August 24, 2015 - 09:23 pm:

has anybody ever climbed a 14 degree grade hill with a model T and how did you do it. My son bought a house in Colorado Springs and I can't get up the last 40 ft. without the boys pushing the car. I'm trying this in low ford/low ructsell.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Henry Petrino in Modesto, CA on Monday, August 24, 2015 - 09:27 pm:

I think I'd try backing up the grade. Ford reverse/Ruckstell low.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Barrett in Auburn Ca. on Monday, August 24, 2015 - 09:31 pm:

A model T in good shape with a Ruckstell will climb a steeper grade than that. Mine has been up a 20%. It is likely you are running out of gravity flow fuel. Make sure the tank is full and you may have to consider an electric pump for long hills.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Monday, August 24, 2015 - 09:36 pm:

What about oil to the front of the engine? Bud in Wheeler,Mi.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Bennett - Australia on Monday, August 24, 2015 - 09:47 pm:

Neil, a trick I learned from one of our T club members works well for low fuel/steep grade problems. The moment he felt the car miss, he swung around across the track so the car was on the level again and the carb got a refill. In 40 feet you may have to do this twice. It worked a treat when our club visited a car collection housed at the end of a very steep driveway.

Hope this helps.

Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Carnegie Spokane, WA on Tuesday, August 25, 2015 - 12:16 am:

My T will pull a 14 per cent grade in high.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qX45_9PGRzw


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Barrett in Auburn Ca. on Tuesday, August 25, 2015 - 02:35 am:

Bud, I believe the internal oil line supplying oil to the front of the engine is no longer functional at about 19% grade. Better sprint up that hill and get leveled out.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Tuesday, August 25, 2015 - 03:43 am:

The T's that I have seen that were not able to climb a steep grade usually had the carb adjusted a little too lean and perhaps have the spark a little too advanced


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Richmon on Tuesday, August 25, 2015 - 06:54 am:

Hey Tom, Great video! One easy question for you, to get those top end speeds what are you running for a rear end ratio and is the crankshaft a stock T? My 24 Touring would probably pull up those hills, but with all stock gearing. I just can't get that kind of top end without the engine RPM maxing out. I can only run maybe 43 MPH.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Carnegie Spokane, WA on Tuesday, August 25, 2015 - 08:16 am:

Bob, stock crank - stock 3.63 gearing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By neil obrien on Tuesday, August 25, 2015 - 08:28 pm:

Thanks for all the feedback.. Will try again tomorrow .


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Norton on Saturday, September 05, 2015 - 03:35 am:

If grade is still too steep after trying this and that, refer to URL below re manual air pressure to the tank by using parts from an outboard motor fuel line kit.
http://www.mtfca.com/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=118802&post=275907#POST275907


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Burger in Spokane on Saturday, September 05, 2015 - 04:28 am:

Just get a TT to pull you to the top. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rick Goelz-Knoxville,TN on Saturday, September 05, 2015 - 10:42 am:

I did the hill at Newport,In in my 24 Fordor in high gear, not fast but no problem and from a standing start at the bottom, it was chugging at the top but we made it fine with no starving.

Rick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Freighter Jim on Saturday, September 05, 2015 - 10:50 am:

Neil,

Park at the bottom.

What if your brakes go out or something else happens on the trip down ?



Freighter Jim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Pat Kelly Montana on Saturday, September 05, 2015 - 03:51 pm:

My TT has a air pump built into the gas cap. It still works. PK


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Layden Butler on Saturday, September 05, 2015 - 03:56 pm:

14 degree or 14 percent? Big difference!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By WilliamThomas Forsythe on Saturday, September 05, 2015 - 04:33 pm:

Good day Neil:-Over the past decade I have rebuilt 6 Ruckstell rear ends, with total satisfaction on the part of each owner. It is my understanding, that when the Ruckstell was first marketed in 1917, they ran with the standard 11/40 crown & pinion ratio.Most roads were very hilly at that time, such that a final ratio, lower than just the Ford 1st gear,was very beneficial.We have one member in our local club who struggled for years, low pedalling in his very hilly area including his own driveway. As he got older,he finally purchased a Ruckstell in which I installed a standard set of gears 11/40.All the others I`ve rebuilt, we have gone with either the 12/39 or 13/39-ratio, each of which gives us a desired overdrive-(that allows a higher road speed without over-revving the engine) rather than an underdrive, that we get with the standard 11/40 ratio.After completing this job,it was a true pleasure to cruise his country roads,taking all the hills and his driveway with the Ford transmission in high, and the Ruckstell in low range- the left foot now free & relaxed.Do you know what ratio is currently in your Ruckstell.I still remember this fellow called me three times in the two weeks after completing the job, to thank me profusely, for the wonderful improvement that permits he to enjoy his lovely`15 touring to this day.)
Regards, Tom Forsythe


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould, Folsom, CA on Saturday, September 05, 2015 - 04:45 pm:

Have to agree. Ruckstell with stock gears in an open car is perfect for overall driving.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Donald Conklin on Saturday, September 05, 2015 - 05:20 pm:

Does your car have the original axle ratio?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Norton on Tuesday, October 06, 2015 - 05:46 am:

Pat Kelly, I wonder if you could describe the air pump system?
A photo would also be great! Air pressure is such an elegant solution. Thanks.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Pat Kelly Montana on Tuesday, October 06, 2015 - 10:09 am:

David, I'll get a couple today. PK


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Tuesday, October 06, 2015 - 11:47 am:

I'm not sure what % grade the road to Dante's View is, but I climbed it in a 26 Roadster in Low Ruckstell Low Ford. I also came down in the same gear. I wouldn't try it in an older T with gas tank under the seat. Maybe in reverse? This is a short climb, maybe 1/4 mile that steep. It also wouldn't be good on the front of the engine to do that very often or for a long pull because of oil restriction.

Dante's view is one of the viewpoints in Death Valley.

By the way, our club is planning another tour to Death Valley next April for anyone who wishes to join us.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Dimock, Newfields NH, USA on Tuesday, October 06, 2015 - 12:40 pm:

The average grade of he MT Washington summit road is 11.6% with the steepest section being 18%

This is a post from August of this year By Ernest Clerihew on Sunday, August 02, 2015 - 11:06 pm:

I drove my 1914 Model T cut-off pickup (I have since found a proper rear section and it is now the touring car it originally was) up Mt Washington, New Hampshire on Aug.8, 2003.
The car had the original (but patched up) round tube radiator and I had just rebuilt the engine with newly babbited rods and mains, aluminum pistons, new valves and adjustable tappets. I have always used a New Day timer. Also, Kevlar bands. Everything else was stock.
Because we were an antique, they did not charge us a toll for the Mt Washington Toll Road. At the base of Mt. Washington that day it was 75 degrees and cloudy - pretty much ideal weather. I had to do my own research about what coolant to use since there is no information available about boiling points of antifreeze mixtures in a non-pressurized system. So I cooked a 50/50 antifreeze mixture on the stove: boiling point 228. Then I cooked 100% antifreeze: boiling point 290. I went up Mt Washington with straight antifreeze in the car.
The Mt Washington Toll Road was combination of gravel and pavement at that time and steep all the way. I had my foot mashed down on the low pedal for 8 miles, making 5 or 6 stops whenever steam starting coming out of the radiator cap vent hole. At these stops, there were water hoses which we used to pour water over the radiator til things cooled down. Each stop took about 10 or 15 minutes and we started climbing again. The entire trip up took almost 2 hours. In a real car, you can do it in about 25 minutes I think.
When we were up on top I could finally affix the bumper sticker: THIS CAR CLIMBED MT. WASHINGTON. Fantastic views and about 20 degrees lower temperature. One woman up there didn't believe we'd driven the car there, so I told her "Well, we sure didn't carry it up here!"
Going down was just like going up in that I had the low pedal hard to the floor for 8 miles. I used the brakes very little and of course it was faster going down hill and the car didn't need any cooling at the side of the road.
It was an exciting and better-than-expected trip. To top it off, nothing broke!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Dimock, Newfields NH, USA on Tuesday, October 06, 2015 - 01:24 pm:

this was cut from the previous post by the gremlins in my computer

If Ernest's T can climb 8 miles up an 11.6 grade with a section at 18% I think 40ft at 14% is a piece of cake - unless there is something wrong :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Dimock, Newfields NH, USA on Tuesday, October 06, 2015 - 01:30 pm:

OK 14 degree grade = 25%
10 degree grade = 18%

90 degree grade means your standing on your nose or tail :-).


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Bishop, San Diego on Tuesday, October 06, 2015 - 03:08 pm:

All I have to say is, a 1914 touring won't take a 22 degree grade** no matter how good the Ruckstell, how full the gas tank (with electric fuel pump), or how good the engine, without resulting in stalling of the engine and damage to the rear axle, drive shaft, and rear wheels when it starts to roll backwards, you realize your brakes don't work well going backwards (well enough?), and you only manage to stop the car by making a 90 degree turn backwards across the grade (on 2 wheels) and stopping it forcefully against the opposite curb! Your wife might also, in her panic, rip the windshield frame off the mounts trying to find something to hang onto!).
Don't ask me how I know!

**Laurel St for you San Diegans!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Pat Kelly Montana on Tuesday, October 06, 2015 - 03:22 pm:

Air pump gas cap pics. PK








Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Tuesday, October 06, 2015 - 03:48 pm:

My coupe was originally in San Francisco and restored there in the '70s. With a Ruckstell and a Rocky Mountain Six Speed it is the right car for living in the Sierra mountains. It also had this setup on the dash. Without it, the carburetor starves out at the top of my driveway going up. I had to try it a few times just to find out. Otherwise, I pump it up, and away I go.



PK, That cap/pump is neat! But mine is more convenient to use.
I enjoy accessories almost as much as the model T itself.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Norton on Wednesday, October 07, 2015 - 01:46 am:

PK, thanks for the photos. I guess there is hole in the seat to get access to the pump handle?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Pat Kelly Montana on Wednesday, October 07, 2015 - 10:24 am:

Not in this set up. You have to pull the passenger side seat like gassing up. You need to pump it up at the bottom of a hill. Wayne's set up is much better. PK


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Parker on Wednesday, October 07, 2015 - 03:29 pm:



Ken in Texas


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