Apparently, the previous thread was getting too long. Here is installment #7. Link to previous thread below.
This weekend I hooked the sickle bar up on the '27 T/IHC mower conversion. First time I've had it on - refurbished the blade over the winter and just finished the T up a month or so ago.
I had about 2 acres of brush ranging in height from 4-8 feet tall and diameters up to 1/4 an inch. Vegetation ran the gamut from goldenrod and young black birch to heavy bramble.
In about 3.5 hours, the T cleared about 80% of it. Need to wait until frost kills the greenery off in the remaining 20% so I can mark any large obstructions (was too dense in these areas to risk taking the blade in there).
Temps were in the low 90s and I had her lugged down low to cut, but she never went over halfway up the Boyce (thanks to Gery Bergbower for making one HELL of a radiator).
Here is a before picture:
Back at the stable:
Very Cool! You need a swath board on your sickle, it makes a big difference.
Gary - I have one. It's in great condition, beautiful oak with original graphics - and for all of those reasons, I'm afraid of tearing it up. Will buy a steel one and save the original for shows.
Ron, yours is the only thread that requires multiple chapters to keep the thread length down, that says a lot about the charm of these machines, keep the pics coming!
Mark - thank you! Will do on the pics!
Thank you, I enjoy these threads and photos along with the tales and discussions. But those of us with limited internet options? They do get slow (and annoying) to load. I have a DSL connection, but we are far enough out that we are in a "marginal" DSL zone, and AT&T no longer takes pride in maintaining their phone lines. I can only imagine how David Dewey suffers having only dial-up available.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2
Wayne - that's why I started number 7. 6 was getting too long. If 7 gets to that point, will start thread 8. Should be enjoyable to read, not annoying to load. 😊
I was wondering as I posted my last post if it was getting a little long.
Anyhow. Tonight I have figured out how I am mounting the wheels to the power unit. A trip to the steel shop should get me what I need to work on it later this week.
Still trying to figure out some cheap tires for the 19" wheels to use.
Chad - check out some motor cycle tires. A lot cheaper than A tires and offer some interesting tread patterns. My mower conversion has cutdown T wheels with custom rims on the front. I looked up the codes on what remained of the front tires she came with and found they were made by Firestone in the 40s for military motorcycles. Found a near-exact match made by Dunlop (who makes a lot of vintage motorcycle tires). The pair cost less than what a single T or A tire would run.
What are you going to do for the front?
Ron and/or Chad: How do you get the power to the mover? Adapter on the rear of the engine or front of driveshaft? Do you have an photos? thanks.
Kurt - are you talking about my mower or Chad's power unit?
Kurt - are you talking about my mower or Chad's power unit?
Ooops - double post.
I believe Kurt is asking about your mower Ron. I know by looking at Zac's it takes a little ingenuity being they were originally horse drawn mowers.
I will check out the motorcycle tires for sure, in fact I just started too last night.
As far as the front side. It will have a removable tongue, when assembled it will be like any other two wheel trailer.
So the mower was made by combining a '27 T with an International Harvester "New Ideal," horse-drawn sickle mower. The T axle was narrowed and a pinion attached to each end. This gear mates with the main bull gear on the IHC mower. This drives the tractor. When the mower lever (made from a cut-down T parking brake handle)is pushed in, the bull gear engages yet another drive gear that is attached to a Pitman arm, thereby powering the blade.
Pictures explain better:
Thanks so much and I have always wondered if there is a way to get mechanical power off a Model T drive-line yet allowing the Model T to drive normally. For instance, how did the 4x4 conversions tie in to get the power to the front wheels? Was there something like a transfer case where you cut some length out of the drive line and installed something there like when you install a Warford?
Kurt - don't know about 4x4 conversions, but will say that the mower does not behave like a "normal" T (which, despite my predeliction for doodlebugs and conversions, I have owned). You cannot adjust for a free neutral and push her anywhere - the drive pinions stay constantly meshed with the bull gears on the wheels and there is enormous drag from the rest of the system. It's the same with my Shaw.
Chad good progress, I would add to motorcycle tires that used dirt bike tires may be very cheap, it takes little wear before they don't bite into the ground as well so people change them out. (the half engine doodle bug I posted some time back had them on the front.)
Ron, Wow it must have been something to do the first cutting with the mower. Due to time constraints I am currently stalled with my mower it should only need the broken gear welded and re-cut to be operational though. -next season...
Kurt, there was a transfer case, googleing "Livingood T 4x4" will give lots of results and pictures there have been a number of posts on this forum in the past
Possibly of note for Chad and Ron and others? There is a pretty big truck show in Ballston Spa. NY later in September several hundred semis and trucks last year I was talking to a fellow that had driven his rig down from Canada for the show. There is a tractor pull for Ron as well... Usually several model T's make an appearance and a handful of others from the era.
Here is a link to the show flier:
Chad, check with some of the Model A guys. Surely someone has some worn tires that would be just right for that rig that they would be glad to get rid of. Dave
Zac, there are about 4 different shows that weekend I would like to go to.
The one I am going to go to for sure is at Joe Merli's Harvest Festival at the Canal Street Station on Rt 20 Duanesburg, NY (Sep 26/27).
Joe is very very sick, has been since last year, and as a supporter of our local T club, we want to show our support back for him. We want this to be the biggest show ever, thusly, we want everyone that can come no matter what kind of classic you drive to be there. Joe will not be able to attend because of his health, but we hopefully can bring him videos of the weekends events.
Zac - it was FAN-FREAKING-TASTIC using that mower for the first time and with such great results!! In 3.5 hours, she did what used to take me two solid days with a weedwhacker, shears and a scythe. Best part, it was a hell of a lot of fun because it was a T; didn't seem like work at all.
Am thinking about getting a vintage gang mower to pull behind Celtic Rust. I have another field that is more tended, pasture-like and would be perfect for a reel-style, gang mower.
Cannot wait to see pictures of yours in action.
Bought another power unit ('26/'27 based, sled mounted, always kept under cover) for parts. Going to use the engine in the saw rig - which is the next project. That Ballston Spa show is the same weekend I was looking at going to Maine to pick it up.
Thanks for the information on the Livengood 4x4 and that answers my questions. We are just getting ready to go on a Montana/Idaho back country Model T trip (Rocky Mountain Model T Club) and a 4x4 T would be about unstoppable!
I have met Joe Merli once before, when we had a Model A meeting at his place. Unfortunately I did not get to look around all that much as we lost a fan belt on the way down and had to locate a parts store(I carry a spare now of course...) Joe has done so much down there to facilitate development of the diner and station. It is sad to hear that he is ill, I hope that things have built to a point that they can continue to move forward without his efforts.
I was not aware there was an event there the weekend of the 26/27th. It seems that there are always multiple events on the same weekend.
Will you drive your truck or bring the 'bug?
-Another thought for the A wheels might be to pick up some strips of 12 gauge'ish band iron to wrap the wheels in and make your own steel wheels? It would keep the unit low to the ground for stability it is not as if the unit is going to be towed long distance. some I suspect some sort of cleats would be needed, but they need not be very tall and obtrusive, or wrap the metal in tire tread? -Just some thoughts
-Ron, if I had a Worthington I think I would have to have a set of gang mowers to pull.... There is an older gentleman on my way to work that mows his yard with a set of gang mowers.
I was thinking bringing the doodlebug and maybe the half assembled power unit to the Canal St show. I have most of this week off and in between other things, I want to work on getting it looking like it is operational at least. Also received the Fun Projects coil box kit, going to put the 'bug back on coils.
I know it is farther for you, but I think it would be great if you brought your stuff down to Merli's show.
As far as the tires, while I hate to go the expense, I found these and for a smidge over a c-note, I can get two plus the tubes and strips. 3.25-19 motorcycle tires, only 26" diameter--perfect for what I want and they look right.
Not bad, I peered up at my tire rack for you not too much there. You might give Tom Sadlon a call, he had some 19" tires he took off of a hudson(?) or something I looked at them, they were perfect nearly 100% tread (too good for this type of application really but whatever) and would have went on my 19" A wheels but they are a little wider than my Firestone's and I was worried they would rub too badly on the A's brake rods when turning tight. I should have thought of this when you first posted the rims, just not thinking I guess. -No clue what he might want for them but they are likely a steal; tubes and rubbers were included!
I am wondering if any of the North East posters here will be attending the Dublin, NH Gas Engine Show tomorrow?
I had all intentions to, but had to bow out. I know from talking to him, Ron won't be able to make it either, and I am sure Zac has his hands full with his family.
Bill - was planning on going and bringing my T Shaw Conversion, but another commitment intervened.
I google'd the show it looks good! My hands are full, but I think I am going to make time to look at a T chassis tomorrow AM -it looks rough, left outside for who knows how long but hopefully can be had for cheap and yield some misc useful parts?
Chad, You going to pull the ski wood off to see how they look this weekend? I have my fingers crossed that they fit the metal bases well.
I end up missing Dublin every year for one thing or another. Hopefully next year.
Thank you for the heads up about the Dublin NH Show I was able to go and it was great. It was very busy and looks like it has out grown the field where it is held. Very few Doodlebugs but that Worthington conversion that was talked about in this forum was there. There is another show next weekend in Ludlow Vermont that is always fun to attend Thank You Bill
William, thanks for making it harder to accept I did not go, LOL. I have heard that show is fantastic.
Chad - couldn't have said it better.
I got zero work done around the house today but picked up a T chassis today 40$, rough shape: engine was left with oil cap off, water inlet wide open to the elements torque tube was unbolted from the rear so it might be totally wasted... but should be able to get some parts from somewhere on it.
I had low expectations for the engine but pulled the head off for giggles this evening. I was amazed to see shiny cylinder walls on # 1 which had a valve open, 2&3 looked ok but were at the top of their bores so there was little to see. #4 was full of water because the head had cracked on the inside from freezing water and additionally because the spark plug had rusted away. A chunk maybe 2+ inches around actually dropped from the head into the cylinder. Here is the interesting part: I reached into the rusty water and there was no chunk, just rusty goop on top of the cylinder not a huge surprise there, it could have totally rusted away, the surprise was that I felt no pitting on the walls of the bore or top of the cylinder. I cleaned out the water and wiped things down with a rag. The top of the cylinder and cylinder walls look just fine?! So, is the metal that the head was made of more susceptible to rusting and acted like a zinc anode on a ship? The top end of the engine was very clean, absolutely no carbon buildup, the valves all looked perfect like they had just been seated. I was looking at this all by flashlight, so hopefully things still look OK in daylight too.
The bottom end of the engine was oddly protected from water by virtue that there was no inspection plate to be found, There was not even a place to bolt one on as the pan had rotted out where the bolts would have been. A mouse made a nest in the hogs head so I don't really know if the gears are toast, or not. I am thinking with a new pan and a lot of surface rust removal this engine might be made to run again at least good enough for a doodlebug.
Zach, sounds like lots of work to get the pistons loose, but still I think you'll get a lot of usable parts from it
The reason it didn't rust much in the rear cylinder even though it was full of water may have been the lack of oxygen? Maybe the valves were closed, then not much oxygen got into the cylinder and it rusted much slower.
Please.. that chassis is more than any of my T started as!
Zac, Tell me those wheels are 6 bolt and you have them-- 16"-17"? They look just like my front ones. I will pay you the $40 you paid for the chassis if they are decent.
When I buy stuff like you did with that chassis, I look at it if I can get a few good parts out of it, then I got my moneys worth. So far in doing T stuff, only once did I feel I got ripped off, but it was going to go to the scrappers. Looking back on what I bought, it probably should have I hate to say. If you still want this other bare chassis I have from that particular purchase, it is yours. At a minimum, the rails are somewhat decent.
Ron, where is that new power unit---did you go get it?
Kep, you must have really scavenged parts to start at that level. Although I have a beautiful '26 frame I always thought of building a vehicle from. Problem is it is 100% completely bare of any brackets and parts. I think it would just take to much to start at that level, but yet I keep it just in case.
Chad I did not take them, I was thinking about it and passed because as you know I already have too much sitting around. I did leave you a voice mail with the guys name and number. There is a very poor condition 58' Willys truck there too, if you know anyone who might need a part. I picked it up with my tractor and moved it to be better accessible, no engine no bed, no doors but some good glass and it was 4x4 so that axle might be useful to someone, also the gauge cluster looks absolutely perfect, not sure why?
Kep, Looking at the parts on your profile I am starting with pure gold, maybe it was worth $80!
I briefly looked at #4 in the daylight, it looks as if there is a sort of smoothish hard coating of never seize on the cylinder wall. When rubbed your finger looks like it has never seize on it. Weird. As time allows I plan to disassemble and de-rust using electrolysis, then put away what looks good as spare parts, if enough of the engine seems salvageable I will re-assemble as a spare engine/future project.
Chad, my father in law started a T with just a frame and built from there, totally wood body and fenders but it is pretty neat and I think it was an affordable way for him to get started. Of course as T's do it reproduced after the kids moved out and now he has a C-cab, touring, and coupe to go with it.
Chad - no, towards the end of September I'm going to tray and make a run up there.
Zach - great find. I saw that on Craigslist and was wondering if someone on here would snag it.
Wow - wish I was closer, she'd be coming home with me:
A little expensive at $1250, but non the less, pictures saved to the computer
Nice - but pricey for a power unit. 30-31 Model A radiator.
Trying to find an early style 4 bolt front engine mount for my power unit. Yesterday I managed to get one spindle and hub bolted up to the units frame, after I cleaned and chased the threads of the original hardware that were on them. Hoping I have time for the other side today.
Was also busy yesterday putting in a Fun Projects coil box kit for the doodlebug, so I can put that back on coils. Hope to finish that today.
Also trying to find two ratty but straight high radiator shells, I think I am going to take some ideas of the Erstad power unit for this build.
Erstand unit pic:
Coil box is finally done for the doodlebug. I won't say it was easy (And I have high mechanical abilities), but it is worth it. The metal box itself was real nice to start with, so I just left as is with all its patina. I know it is not in true preservation motif, but I did not touch the metal box itself, I just seek reliability from the unit.
Chad, I know your pretty hot on the Power unit right now, but did you get the ski wood off the forms I'm curious how they turned out? Also did you get my email about a potential 2 gallon "gas tank" for your power unit? If you can use it the tank is yours.
Zac, I did not get the email about the tank, send it again please.
The past couple weekends have not worked out for getting the wood off the forms---or doing to much else. I have tomorrow off, so I am hoping to get a chance then. Stay tuned.
Went to a regular car show yesterday (something I have not done in many many years) and brought the 'bug. Lots of people asking questions and I tried to talk to as many as I could. Did not win any awards, but I am not a trophy chaser or collector. I was just happy to bring out it out in public and "crash the party" at a classic car show with something completely different.
But the most interesting part was I had a gentleman come up to me and said he had something similar at home. Now if your a car show veteran, you always get at least one person that comes up to you no matter what vehicle you have and say they have/had one "just like it". So I lightly dismissed this fellow at first, but kept talking to him. Then he mentions his Model T has Pullford conversion. That is not a name everyone knows so I paid more attention as he went into detail describing it.
It sounds like that it can be running with minimal work. It sound like it could be a high hood vehicle,--but possibly only a radiator hood and cowl section sans rest of body. I tired to give him clues to look for. And I also gave him my phone number and told him about or local club. I hope he calls me and I hope I get a chance to go help him with it. I have no intentions of trying to purchase it (nor do I think he wants to sell it), but very much would like to see it and see it run again.
A couple of months ago on EBay, I found a '26-'27 ignition switch panel for a non-electric car. Decided to use it on my 1917power unit - was really interested in seeing if the mag was hot and this was better than a three-way knife switch. Aged a piece of red oak, built a bracket from some flat stock and mounted the switch panel. Started the power unit on battery, threw the key over and damned if her mag was hot! Was absolutely thrilled!!!
Wow, always good to get a nice surprise like that. And another great "add on" to your power unit.
Zac and I did some trading today. Meet what hopefully will be the new gas can for the power unit:
And finally scored this old squirrel cage blower off craigslist cheap, I can finally stay cool at the shows now. I will power it off the T-power unit when I get it running:
Picture taken by the hosts of the car show yesterday, LOL. I am carrying my wheel chuck after parking it on a rather precarious hill we had to park on.
Another one lives
Hi guys I thought I would share that I got my shaw together .
The motor that I got with it was not orig. to it but it was
Stored well in a dirt floor barn and was oiled well all of the
Pistons and valves were free I didn't even pull the head.
The exhaust manifold was busted so I replaced it carb was
Gone and timer missing busted off spark plugs and such.
I also had to put a steering column in . I am not sure where
The gas tank was mounted but I think I will mount it on top
Just behind the firewall. As you can see I didnot spend a lot
On plugs and wires😉
Jim - your pics aren't showing up.
Sorry not able to get pic. To post having trouble with Flickr
Try posting the FLICKR link.
Looks like it is missing a little in the radiator department but what a great find! Especially with a nice a free motor and valves. Keep the photos coming as you get it back in full running order
I attended the ATHS show at the Saratoga county fair grounds on Saturday, there were around 175 trucks present(more?) not including tractors or doodlebugs. One fellow was putting around on a nice (later) Worthington. I was parked next to a Wallace truck that had a 28' plow mounted on it, between it and my doodlebugs there was a constant group of people right around us, I think I must have talked to 20 people reminiscing about a doodlebug their family had when they were young. Lots more that wanted to know about the mower or if it was a kit. I also left with a good lead on some T parts that are pretty local to me so it was a good day even if I got nothing done at home.
Sunday morning, unloading the 'bugs at home I had a guy pull off the road to come talk and see the doodlebugs, that is a first.
Jim - there was no convention in mounting the gas tank. The Shaw brochures I have show various configurations. Mine has a gas tank from an F-20 mounted high behind the bench seat.
Is that a spare rear rim in one of the pictures? If so, do you have a set?
Thanks guys yes Zac I seem to have ended up with
A high firewall and a low radiator that's why that isn't
Done I also need a starter switch and a battery tray and I
Don't like my feet dangling between the frame rails
So I will put some old boards with patina in for floorboards.
I might find something for fenders too cause that steel wheel
Is mighty close to my leg.
Ron thanks for the tip I was so focused on trying to reduce
The pics I couldn't see the Forrest for the trees and yes there
Are 4 of those rim halves the guys father was going to restore
It back in the60's but never got around to it Jim
BTW I have an EZ- power unit does anyone know who
Ended up making the couplers I would like to buy one.
Jim - your rims look pretty good. Would you be interested in parting with that spare set?
Hi Ron I don't have plans on using the replacement wheels
Even though the wheels are in bad shape on the tractor
I would like to leave it in its work clothes so to speak.
But on the other hand it is hard to go anywhere with it
Just running it 20 feet out and back into the tractor shed
Tore things up pretty good and not knowing what it would
Cost to have them rolled out at today's prices .
Although I suppose I could patch up the ruff spots on the
Old ones take off the cleats and wrap them with rubber tread
What do you think would be fair on them Jim
Jim - sent you an email.
Worked on the power unit a little today. I fitted another rad shell and filled the open area with sheet metal to make a "firewall". I took that idea from the Erstad power units. Also built the front leg supports that will be retractable when moving the unit around.
I also had to build a truss support for the wheel hub mounts as it was flexing the frame and giving a real bad camber angle. It seems to be ok so far, I have another idea to use the radius rod ball support as a middle mounting point if it still gives me trouble.
I dug this out of the woods and found some unique details on the frame. Front cross member moved back. Three extra cross members out front and engine crank extended thru two cross members. Drive shaft and frame is shortened. If I rebuild this I will be looking for TT rear radius rods.
I wonder what used to hang off the front of that? It's not like the upside down crossmembers provide a bunch of clearance. That is certainly an interesting setup.
Whats left of the normal front cross member is still there and I believe the engine crank handle was mounted with an extension to the front of the engine. No idea what if anything was mounted out front. I did not find any other parts with this frame. Bill
Purchased a few more parts for the power unit today. Good purchases at a fair price. I am very happy overall.
Pistons, rings, rods, trans input shaft, driven plate/output shaft. main caps, valve springs, and my unexpected surprise, a PTO rear mount pulley.
Had the '27/IHC mower out today. Was preparing to cut some brush when the driver side bull gear disintegrated - cast iron shattered. When it went, she was dead in the water. Towed her back to my garage with my '30 AA doodlebug ("Klam Digah"), pushed her into the garage and pulled the driver's side wheel. Picture below is what I found. Need to find a new bull gear, International Harvester part # M626.
That's terrible Ron. I hope you can find a good gear somewhere. Make sure nothing was binding that caused it to break.
Yep, terrible. Was rolling along fine and then wham - disintegrated. Anyone out there that has an old IHC horse-drawn sickle mower as yard art, I need part # M626.
In the past i have seen cast items like that with steel strap bolted on the cracks in the casting to get it mobile again.
A good welder could probably fix that gear up just fine!
A little trick for getting in from out in the fields that sometimes works. Remove and/or safely tie back the broken pieces. Wrap a couple feet of medium size chain around the now-free-and-loose drive gear to lock it in place. It makes the differential work overtime, and if you are stuck in mud or rough ground would probably break something before it moves very far. But one wheel drive at double speed can get you some distance if you don't push it too hard.
For whatever it is worth.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2
Kep - I think it's beyond steel strap. The torsion on that gear would probably be too much for it.
Wayne - don't know of anyone remotely near me that welds cast (even if I could find all the chunks in the brush). That is a great tip on limping her in and I will store that for future reference!!
I would definitely see about getting it fixed in the mean time. Probably needs to be tig welded. You have a plethora of guys in the Orange Engine club, I got to believe someone there knows how to fix it. But I still would be on the lookout for another irregardless.
Just had an idea, although I have no idea what the offset is. Maybe someone can weld a center in it---kinda like a flexplate on an automatic trans. Then make the center however it has to be to attach to it's shaft or flange. Or maybe make a center that bolts on to the gear part. I know it wouldn't be the true look, but it may get you going again as function over form until you find a spare gear.
Yes chad that was my other idea.
May have a line on a replacement.
For Bill above: You know there are people in some countries who don't even have one good front crossmember
Ron I might have located a parts unit for you a couple of weeks back, I will check up on it and get back to you.
Oh, and great find Chad!
Zac - that would be great (in case what I'm working falls through). According to implement experts on another forum, that PN matches to an IHC New 4 and vertical lift (built 1896 to 1915) or the New Big 4 (built 1898 to 1915).
Checked two on my way home; the one that would have been a good price was a McCormick Deereing, the other was a Case. I will check more tomorrow there are 3 or 4 pretty easy ones to check out on my way home from work and one in the woods on my neighbors property.
At least you know what gear you are looking for; the gear that I took three teeth off last summer is not part of the mower so I have no clue where to start looking. Over Christmas I should be able to weld it when I at my father in laws house, but it sure is a lot of work.
Ron I checked 3 mowers no luck on the correct part yet.
Zac - thank you. I appreciate you looking! I may have a line on one - waiting to see.
Hi Ron sorry to hear about your breakdown I have been looking here in my neck of the woods found several but
They all have internal teeth on that gear no corn binders
All John deer and other brands so far.
Good news on my shaw gas tank and radiator hold fluids
Mounted gas tank it runs around on its own
I put a dashboard on and put the choke and carb adj. rods
Thru. It and started on some floorboards next are some fenders and mounting the e-z power just pushed it in the
Crank hole for pic's. Thinking about some crude fenders too
Link to photos
Found a replacement gear and it arrived in the mail yesterday. Have to put lug holes on it - this was a modification to the hub by whoever made the tractor. I appreciate everyone who looked. The source for the replacement I gear I purchased has another and I'm probably going to buy that one as well and keep it on the shelf.
Jim - your Shaw is looking fantastic!!!
So, as I mentioned on another thread, I missed out on a MONSTER last weekend. '32 BB-based, grader, winch, boom, (2) 4-speed transmissions and a 3-speed transmission (that was used to control the winch and boom - both of which were tied into a massive truck axle mounted on top of the back of the tractor). Seat and framing was made of 3" thick steel. This thing was easily one of the most unusual and overbuilt doodlebugs I have seen in nearly 40 years of messing with doodlebug - it dwarfed my Klam Digah. Outbid at an estate sale by about $300.
Here are some pics:
Is that a " H " beam for a seat?
All plate welded together. Seat was 3" thick, as was the pedestal. Base was about 6" thick.
Jim, you know that you are really kicking Ron in the teeth with that EZ Power PTO. Now there are three that I know of. They are tough to find. I wouldn't mind finding one myself to be honest.
Ron, that thing is a huge beast. That would have been a great addition, you are getting out of control.
I think I just came up with new plan for a small homemade tractor using a very shortend T rear axle I have. This would be a one seater. The wheels are turning in my head, but I am thinking personal garden tractor size. Width should be in about the 3 foot area or less. Basically I want to build a whole tractor based on a rear axle and a seat I have, LOL. Gotta' start somewhere.
Always wanted one made from a BB.
Does anyone have pictures of how the rear axle and engine/trans are mated together on a Worthington conversion?
Trying to figure out how they got it so short.
Jim, Incredible machine just beautiful, you are not too far away, I am hoping that means I will get to see it in person some day. Love the wrecker's too, I have a winch I picked up a few years back for a future wrecker.
Ron, so glad to hear you had success with the gear. sounds like there was so much metal there if scrap was higher the price might have been higher.
-Chad, not to put ideas in your head, but a small single seater needs a 1/2 engine -Like the pictures I posted of the one in Canandaigua.
I had a weird transmission idea the other day, what about two T' transmissions mated together? maybe cut up an old engine pan and use a non-starter hogs head with some sort of block off plate and bearing support in the front of the transmission? Anyone ever heard of this before?
I know Zac, that short engine keeps haunting me and giving me bad ideas. I think unfortunately a T engine may be too big for this project, but not sure yet. I would like to keep most of it homemade and use as many 20/30's parts as possible. We will see, still have a power unit to build and get running. Just trying to use up those used parts no one wants.
Guy at Pepperell Engine show 2 years ago showed me pictures of a project he was working on - it was easily the smallest T doodlebug I've ever seen. Transmission was connected directly to a TT rear end; there was essentially no discernible drive shaft. Was supposedly used as a tug in a factory and had to fit in freight elevators to move from floor to floor. Engine was stock, 4 cylinder, T - no chopped jobs. Everything had been narrowed to little more than the width of the engine and whoever narrowed the radiator had done a beautiful job.
This might work as well with some adaptation - pretty nice piece:
That BB is very cool! I bet there was no traction problem with all of that 3" plate and just the single wheels on the back , The spot lights make one wonder what it was used for .
If I can figure out the picture resizing I will post some pictures of a BB doodlebug that I have . It's got a worm drive rear end that could be an AA or BB with a four speed directly to the rear end with some reworked duel wheels , a B 4 banger that runs good . The steering goes over the top of the hood to a extend steering box ( like the steering on some of the old Farmalls from the 20's)
Thanks for the pictures of the stuff you guys are working on.
Ron, My biggest issue if I repower it with a non T engine, is what to use for a trans. Something that is short---maybe an A? But then comes the clutch issue too. Not sure, what to do exactly, but yes, I want to make it as small as I think I can. But then comes the clutch issue too.
I was curious how the Worthingtons hooked the rear to the engine. I think if I just did it straight in, then there might be ground clearance issues with smaller wheels.
I think I have one more T radiator shell I could use to narrow up, that was kind of my plan actually.
Yup, Now I need to find a suitable engine to make it a 2 cylinder. I think I can pull this off. Something that is maybe stuck or broke a crank might be perfect, I don't want to wreck a good block and pan.
If I can make just a little more smaller that this previous picture Zac posted, I think I will have what I want
I hope you can come up with something, this little thing definitely ranks as one of my favorite doodlebugs and I am sure a great deal of that comes from the half engine. You might put an ad in the for sale section for one of the people who is in the two piece crank club, some people can salvage their block but I am sure some cannot. I suspect it is much better to start with the transmission end of the engine rather than the front end.
It seems to me, not unlike the Popular Mechanics Feb 1937 article I found today, that starting with the front half of the block, and shifting the crank forward and cutting the front of the crank off would make it easier. That way you can maintain the timing gears easier under the stock cover.
I have a two cylinder T engine (front half) in a walk behind cultivator. Has a Chevy transmission and rear end (31 I think). Equipped with an oil pump off the generator. Somebody did a lot of work on it...I never had it running and it is a rusty project waiting for me. Make some changes and add a steering front axle and you have the doodle bug.
Too many projects..first $650
248 650 8000
I wish I had the funds to do that Jon. And then there is getting it here to NY also.
Picked up more parts to do my two cylinder conversion. Block, pan, cams, water inlet/outlet, fan, front cover, manifolds, and few other pieces. I have a line on a couple pre broken crankshafts. I am in real good shape now, just need to plan on where to cut the block. No, I am not cutting up anything pristine in case anyone is worried. Hope to start cutting tomorrow.
Thought about doing Doodlebug PART VIII thread, but we are almost at the end of the year.
Anyhow, Two cylinder model T project in progress. Took a little over an hour to cut the block and head. Now to figure out who and how to close up the water jackets. Not quite sure on the back of the block yet if it will or wont get closed up.
Coil box is not done yet, maybe about 45 minutes into that so far.
Sale, Half off today!
Did you use a vertical band saw? horizontal? sawzall? If you could do that in an hour with a hack saw you are in excellent shape!
Keep us posted on progress as you know I love these little engines and would like to use some damaged parts to make one some day.
I think I must be a bad influence, this was your comment a week ago:
"Chad Marchees _____Tax Capital, NY on Saturday, November 14, 2015
I know Zac, that short engine keeps haunting me and giving me bad ideas. I think unfortunately a T engine may be too big for this project, but not sure yet"
Anyways I will be happy to some day have your example/experience to work from... Looking good so far.
It kinda dawned on me that these cut up engines have quite a few degrees of rotation without any power stroke what kind of working power can they develop? It doesn't seem likely that you could put out half the output of the entire engine, not that it exactly matters for a deeply geared doodle bug. It might rule out a midget off-road racer type thing though.
This block was being used as a door stop, had/has multiple broken bolts in it, cylinders are rusty but I think I can get the fronts cleaned up, and generally had been kicked around. Might be a little loose on the piston to wall clearance once I clean it up. No numbers on it either. It was a pretty good candidate in my opinion, and more importantly it was dirt cheap.
As far as cutting it, a grinder with a death wheel attached (metal cut off wheel) was used for 90% of the cuts. It was very quick. The last 10% took a little longer. I did use a bare hacksaw blade itself, trying not to get cut by holding it and having it bend on me when it would get snagged. That part did take a little bit to do. A bigger 7 1/2" cut off wheel would have most likely did it all, but I didn't feel like driving to the store and spending money.
The head was easy to cut too, I had a stack of them here, so it was just a matter of picking one. It was all of course a "measure 14 times, hold your breath and cut once" situation. I also bought a rusty pan for the bottom to use, It will still be hand cranked.
Hard to say if it will be 10 H.P. or not, I hear what your saying about the lapse in rotation as it would go 1, 2, miss, miss. Maybe there is a way to re time the second cylinder via moving the cam lobes. I have a couple of extra cams now, so I could experiment with that. For now it will be what it is.
This will be my winter project, I wanted to get it all cut down so I could easily bring it in the basement where it will be warm to work on when it is cold out.
I am about to list my doodlebug in the classifieds if anyone is interested. Thought I had it sold earlier in the year but the buyer backed out due to health issues. At that time I stuck on a makeshift seat and rear wheels just to be able to drive it onto a trailer.
Comes with lots of spare parts.
Would make a great winter project.
So tempting - if it was TT-based, I'd be on my way down with flatbed in tow. But, I'm running out of space and am holding out for a TT running gear or TT-based bug. I do know someone who is looking for a T-based bug however. Could you PM your asking price and contact info?
PM sent, Ron.
Don't misunderstand,....I have nothing to do with Mark Myers or his doodlebug that he has for sale, but I see that it is indeed listed in the "classified" section and that "listing" is certainly interesting to look at with excellent photos of not only the doodlebug, but quite an assortment of extra parts. I can't help thinking that just those rear "TT" wheels are a couple items alone that some "TT" guys would just love to have. I'd sure be tempted, but I have already greatly exceeded my storage space,.....(maybe a good thing!),.....harold
Thanks Mark. Got it.
Ok , all you doodlebug guys, here it is, Now act like adults, and no fighting over it. Its time to go dig up one of those jars of old silver coins and buy it for yourself for Christmas. As rare as these are, its probably not unrealistic of a price, but its a lot of money (for me anyway) Donnie Brown
HA HA, We already knew about that Donnie. I actually have to thank a local club member for the tip off when he emailed me over the weekend, and I then emailed it to a couple more people here.
Unfortunately, the timing and money is off for a few of us here, I mentioned in emails I would buy it at the $260 it is sitting at, but knowing A) the reserve hasn't been met and B) it is going to go for more, puts it way out of our budgets. I would only hope that someone here is secretly bidding on it, but I know at least 4 of us are out---So I have been told.
I have only seen a handful, and most of them were pictures posted here by myself or others. I think I have only seen one in person on Ron's friends Worthington.
Chad, I have only seen two in person. (in over 30 years) Im getting a new car hauler trailer, so my budget is blown for a year or two. Im not bidding on it so that makes five of us out. I have a front PTO of a different make and style, but would love to have a EZ-Power. Maybe next time ...
Donnie - I'd love to have it, but it's currently out of my budget given other priorities (next big ticket item I need to buy is another Berg's radiator for the saw rig). There is another issue as well - I'm not sure it would fit on any of my T tractors. The Shaw, the mower conversion and the doodlebug have all been significantly narrowed. I've looked at the EZ power pictures in this listing over and over again and I'm not convinced it would fit a narrowed front end. I think the pulley would not clear the driver's side wheel.
Wow - Part VII is long. Almost the end of the year, but I'm going to start a Part VIII.
Link to new thread (this was too much to scroll through):
I have often wondered how many accessories such as this and other ones such as PTO's for a Warford, stationary engine conversions, etc, etc., I have seen at swap meets and farm auctions over the years and had no idea what I was looking at. Dave