Streeing Shaft Rattle 1911

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: Streeing Shaft Rattle 1911
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale McMurry on Tuesday, September 08, 2015 - 11:41 pm:

Is there a fix for the rattle of steering shaft thru the hole at end of column. This is also where the two control rods goes thru.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Bennett - Australia on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 03:13 am:

Dale, a new bush will improve the situation, but often the shaft is too worn to completely solve the problem. If you turn the shaft down, some of the taper in the pitman arm will be lost, not good. The only real fix may be a new shaft and re-bushing the bracket.

Hope this helps,
Allan From down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 04:56 am:

Where is the rattle, at the flange fastening the column to the firewall or at the frame bracket?

There is an easy to make block of wood also sold at the vendors as a solution to worn quadrants - it holds the levers where you put them:

anti rattle

Maybe it would stop the rattle if it's at the firewall flange?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Wrenn-Monroeville OH on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 08:51 am:

Roger, FWIW, I have what sounds like the same rattle in my '15s column. I tried that little block of wood just last week and it did tone down the rattle some, but not enough, and then the downside was, it made the levers so hard to move I took the block of wood off, and for now just ignore the rattle. Eventually I'll find a cure.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By R.V. Anderson on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 10:01 am:

Depending on how much slop you have, a bushing at the end of the column is the only permanent fix, but you could wrap a turn or two of rubber electrical tape around the shaft to muffle the rattle. Of course, to do that effectively you'd have to slide the shaft back up out of the column to place the tape, and so almost may as well make the bushing.

Another method would be to make a slip-fit sleeve from a section of black nylon tubing, split it to get it on the shaft, and then slide it up into the column hole, retaining it on the shaft with a few dabs of adhesive after ensuring all was good and clean.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By keith g barrier Savannah Tn. on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 01:00 pm:

Not saying to do this but I have wrapped a worn shaft with one layer of news paper dammed up the ends and poured with Babbitt. Worked for me through the years on all kinds of shafts, the news paper give you the clearance and the bearing makes good contact over all the surface. KGB


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Townsend ; ^ ) Gresham, Orygun on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 04:23 pm:

Dale-

Good to hear from you.

Maybe slip some shim shock in between the shaft and the bracket to take up the slop. If you don't have some shim stock a pop or beer can might work.

: ^ )

-Keith


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 06:03 pm:

It appears to me that the main problem that Dale has is the steering shaft itself is loose enough to rattle. IF (my famous big IF) the shaft is not worn too much, the best repair definitely is to replace the bronze bushings in the lower bracket. I believe these are available from the usual T suppliers. If the shaft itself is a bit too worn? the shaft should be replaced.
However, since his car is a 1911, if his car is correct enough, and has a correct 1911 shaft. Replacing the shaft with a correct 1911 shaft could be difficult. I think a 1911 is a different length than the common post-'15 shafts. It would also depend upon body style in 1911 as the torpedo and roadster is longer than the touring (as I recall). It is not wise to turn down the shaft. New bushings could still help a lot. If new bushings do not help enough? Replacing the shaft may be necessary regardless of vintage. A later shaft can be adapted easily enough, and once all assembled, is not easy to see in the car.
Good luck!
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould, Folsom, CA on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 06:20 pm:

The problem may well be in the steering column rather than the shaft or the bushing. In my situation the three holes the bottom of the steering column where the shaft and two rods pass thru were buggered out causing a rattle that was hard to pin down. To determine if this is your problem, squeeze a piece of shim stock between the shaft and the hole in the column and see if the rattle disappears. I fixed things permanently by brazing up the hole in the end of the column and redrilling so the shaft fit without much clearance. Its also possible the shaft itself has a groove caused by contact with the column where it exits. While you can weld up the groove, you invariable warp the shaft requiring more work. Best IMHO to find a better shaft.
Restoring an early steering column can be a ton of work. I had to remove the top gear case, reinstall with new handmade rivets, replace the two rods, weld up the column as stated above and rebush the lower bracket. Wheh!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould, Folsom, CA on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 06:23 pm:

The problem may well be in the steering column rather than the shaft or the bushing. In my situation the three holes the bottom of the steering column where the shaft and two rods pass thru were buggered out causing a rattle that was hard to pin down. To determine if this is your problem, squeeze a piece of shim stock between the shaft and the hole in the column and see if the rattle disappears. I fixed things permanently by brazing up the hole in the end of the column and redrilling so the shaft fit without much clearance. Its also possible the shaft itself has a groove caused by contact with the column where it exits. While you can weld up the groove, you invariable warp the shaft requiring more work. Best IMHO to find a better shaft.
Restoring an early steering column can be a ton of work. I had to remove the top gear case, reinstall with new handmade rivets, replace the two rods, weld up the column as stated above and rebush the lower bracket. Wheh!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale McMurry on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 10:40 pm:

Thanks for all of your input. It is obvious that there is only one correct way to fix this problem since the shaft is new and steering bracket has a new bushing. This is on a torpedo. I have started to diassemble the steering column and put it in the mill, bore out the hole and make a bushing. There was .035 thousands clearance between hole and shaft.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale McMurry on Wednesday, September 09, 2015 - 10:43 pm:

type error disassemble


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould, Folsom, CA on Thursday, September 10, 2015 - 02:09 am:

Is there enough thickness at the end of the column to hold a bushing??


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Thursday, September 10, 2015 - 03:30 am:

If the end of the column doesn't hold it tight enough, the bushing could be soldered / glued / JB welded to stay in place - no real force on it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould, Folsom, CA on Friday, September 11, 2015 - 08:54 am:

Possibly, but IMHO a better repair would be to braze up the hole and redrill.


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