Correct Running Board Brackets for 26/27?

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: Correct Running Board Brackets for 26/27?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Brough on Sunday, October 25, 2015 - 06:06 pm:

Picked up running chassis that is 26/27, but had no body, fenders or running boards, so I need to find all that. On this frame, it had no running board brackets on the drivers side, but two remnants of brackets that had been cut off on the passenger side. The two that are left are riveted on with three rivets through the side of the frame rial. Rivet hols match on the drivers side.

But when I went to look at a 26/27 touring body and frame today, it had the one piece strap stamped running board brackets and running boards on it.

My frame, in addition to the rivet holes, also has a larger hole on the top of the frame rail that looks like it would accept the stampled, one piece strap bracket.

Which would be correct for my 26/27"

I've got a Warford transmission installed in it and don't know if that affected someones decision at one point in time to install 4 seperate brackets instead of the two longer humped brackets. Might not fit with the Warford in the way.

I'll hang up and listen.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Sunday, October 25, 2015 - 06:36 pm:

The 21-27 used the stamped brackets. The 26/27 are longer then the 21 to 25 brackets, wider running boards. Your frame may not be a 26-27 by the sound of what you have there. Some time in 21 the stamped brackets were added but the holes for the early forged type remained, maybe up to late 1925. There is more then just the running board brackets that make it a 26/27 frame, the rear cross member is longer and there are additional brackets riveted on the front corners.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Sunday, October 25, 2015 - 07:00 pm:

Comparison of the '26-'27 and the '25 and earlier.

The late frame on the left has wider rear cross member, and more body mount points for the all metal bodies.



This is a "complete" '26-'27 with running board brackets, and front crossmember brackets for the front fenders.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Miller, Mostly in Dearborn on Sunday, October 25, 2015 - 07:45 pm:

The '26-7 Running Board Mounting brackets have two holes on the very end of each bracket a little over an inch apart. No other years have this feature. I believe this allowed the brackets to be used to service prior years.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Brough on Sunday, October 25, 2015 - 09:42 pm:

Well, I'll go out and take another look at the frame, but I got it from Model T Haven in KS and he pointed out some special corner brackets and some other features on the frame when he sold it to me as a 26/27 and that is what is on the title.
The cowl and radiator and radiator shell are certainly 26/27. So far as I can tell, it is only these two cut off cast brackets that give me concern. But again, the installation of a additional transmission may have made it necessary to use the 4 seperate brackets from earlier years that someone along the way installed with rivets and nicely done. Or someone made a frame look like at 26/27 frame?

TO THE GARAGE!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Zibell, Huntsville, AL on Sunday, October 25, 2015 - 10:12 pm:

Dan's lower picture is correct for the 26/27 frame. The front running board bracket needs to have the hump cut out to allow the Warford to fit. The rear running board bracket does not need to be modified for the Warford and should remain in original configuration.




Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Miller, Mostly in Dearborn on Monday, October 26, 2015 - 07:00 am:

When the hump is removed as shown in the transmission installation photo, is some kind of truss rod or brace installed under the running boards similar to what is on earlier cars?

The hump provides the connection to the other frame rail to resist bending of the frame when you step into the car. If the hump is no longer there, then the crankcase arms would have to resist the bending.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Monday, October 26, 2015 - 08:46 am:

Tom

Some do, most don't. Had a KC Warford in the '26 touring, and that front brace had to be sacrificed. Later removed it and installed a Ruckstell to my liking better. Found a replacement running board bracket and re-installed that missing link. Think its important.

Here is was some do for Warfords. Their was a period brace done too, but these are for the weight/support of that added trans, probably not for frame stiffness.




This method of added and welded brace would stiffen the frame.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Brough on Monday, October 26, 2015 - 11:52 am:

OK, here's what I got. Was under the impression a 26/27 frame, but let me know what I got and what I need.

Appears to have a Bubba bracket behind the Warford to held it up, but it is not bolted or welded to the fram, just sitting in the rail.

All comments and guideance greatly appreciated.

Running board brackets I purchased appear to have two hles near the end, so maybe I lucked out and got the correct ones by pure chance.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Monday, October 26, 2015 - 01:16 pm:

Might be a 1919-21 chassis with older style forged running board brackets that's been cut off. You should be able to install the more modern pressed steel style after some measuring on a 1922-25 T - or leave them off if you go the fenderless speedster route - it's already lowered ;)
Cool lowering of the rear end - only problem might be extra sideway sway due to longer spring shackles - Clayton Paddison did a similar lowering on his roadster and added a Panhard bar that stops any excessive side movement.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Monday, October 26, 2015 - 01:22 pm:

Here's Clayton's build thread where he added the Panhard bar - and beefed up the connection to the frame further down in the thread: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/257047/271040.html

Please show more details of the front lowering - or is it std height there? Would give the car an interesting rake..
Maybe it has 26/27 spindles, and the rear axle looks like a 26/27 that lacks backing plates, so the chassis might be a mix of parts. Now I noticed the steering column - it's also 26/27. Great to have 5:1 ratio :-)



(Message edited by Roger K on October 26, 2015)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Monday, October 26, 2015 - 02:40 pm:

And if you add a std Ford body and fenders, consider where the rear wheels will be compared to the fenders - 2.5" to the rear and 4-5" higher? Might not work so well, Clayton didn't use fenders and moved the body 2" to the rear so the fender pressing in the turtledeck fits the rear wheels new position. A 28/29 Model A hood is 2" longer and made the move possible without leaving the engine nude.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Monday, October 26, 2015 - 03:30 pm:

To add what Roger noted. Your T chassis is a real bit of this and a bit of that. :-)

No wonder why you are a bit perplexed.

The frame is '19-early '21 with the forged brackets cut off, as the rear cross member has the holes for a spare rim carrier.

The front engine mount is '19-'21 two piece bolts, but the axle is '27 later, with sway shape, and spindles are dropped later ones too.
That lowers the '26-'27 car 1" or so.

Wire wheels are '26-'27 but don't seem to have correct hubs. Wood wheel hubs have been used and likely drilled for the bolt pattern of the wire wheels, that is why the hubs stick out thru the wheels like they do.

The one rear wire wheel has a small drum, and the backing plates for that rear axle, which has axle housings from a '26-'27 has been cut off both sides, so you can't install emergency brakes for lack of those.

The engine is '26-'27. Steering column is '26-'27.
The rear axle has shorten radius rods for the aux. trans, and instead of shorting the tube, the rear spring is relocated by the brackets on the rear perches. That dropped the rear too. Pinion housing appears to be early closed spool type, a later would be open spool with bolts into the pumpkin exposed.

Rather good bit of pieces there for a speedster set up.


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