I noticed the rear end of the T and can't remember seeing springs arched this way.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1912-Ford-Model-T-/231752076331?ru=http%3A+www.ebay.co .uk%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_from%3DR40%26_sacat%3D0%26_nkw%3D231752076331%26_rdc%3D1&n ma=true&si=Fnlbdp%252BRHW4YxhClMGonPehptNM%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p20 47675.l2557
In my not so humble opinion whoever bought this mutt paid $10,000 to much for it. Elec. start, louvered hoods, under-axle wishbone, generator, 26/27 engine, stupid rear springs.....
And lets not forget the de-mountable rims!!
No its not a "correct" 1912, but it is a "speedster" Its a pretty nice looking car for what it is and you could not build it for 11,000.00. If it is a good runner, and mechanically its safe. Looks like a fun car to me. Not a steal but seems OK to me ...
Just another *Ho-Hum* vehicle....just like a thousand others calling themselves speedsters.
The ultimate Johnny Cash car. Obviously somebody put a lot of work into it, but why a rear spring that will bounce on the axle shaft? That's just silly.
Looks like a fun car, but I disagree on the safe bit, that rear spring can't possibly work.. Should be really bumpy on a bad road?
That rear spring will also bend the rear end housings. Badly. And probably pretty quick.
Years ago, I got a rear end that still had a spring on it that did something similar, and not quite so badly as this one. It was badly bent. I was only able to salvage a few good parts out of the whole thing. One of the housings I salvaged the backing plate end. I still have the rest of it as a jack stand (it works for that). The other half I cut off and used the center part as a base for my welding butler. The housing tweaked so badly that the ring gear cut through one side of the pumpkin. Bearings all disintegrated, one axle nearly cut in two. I was glad I only paid ten bucks for the whole thing. I was able to salvage the drive shaft.
Drive carefully (special meaning for this car?), and enjoy, W2
I saw a rear spring like this once on a '25 Roadster. It had been in a garage that burned to the ground.
I find it disappointing that a entry level car that was sold below what it cost to build would receive such a beat down. It was bought right, even with it's shortcomings. They are an easy fix and it is a great car for a new member of the Model T hobby. At the top of this column it says "Post for the good of the hobby". I think that's important to remember, because demographics are working against this hobby. And after 40 yrs. of making parts for these cars, I have realized that many people enter the hobby with cars like this. Whether they stay and go on to more accurate and correct cars or leave the hobby depends on the reception and friendship they receive upon entering. If I had bought this car and then read these postings, I would be discouraged.
I doubt that anyone thinks this is not a fun car, but to advertise it as a 1912 is fraudulent. I know it is a free country but that does not give us protection against lying. It is not a 1912 and you Tom know that as well as anyone. The hood, the springs, back axle. wheels and most probably more are from later cars.
I repeat it might be a fun car at the right price but it is NOT a 1912 and that is what is annoying and such fraud is not good for the hobby
...so what percent of correct parts by weight or content (or whatever) of the total vehicle must be present to qualify an assigned year?
At least some....
I think your missing my point Tony. By being so ridged and being totally PC, it turns people away from looking at the possibility of joining this club. There is a place for totally correct cars in this hobby and there should be one for those that are not. I don't recall any member coming into this hobby with a AACA Senior First or Stnyoski winning car. Those are goals that you attain as you become more knowledgeable. I understand your point and it is a valid one. Dedicated hobbyists know the difference between this car and a factory 1912 and there will always be those dedicated to correct preservation. My first T was a speedster much like the subject car and I was pushed forward and encouraged by guys older than I who had totally correct early cars. Had I received information that only correct and accurate parts were to be used, the car would never have been completed. At 17 I couldn't afford them and wouldn't have devoted the time to find them. They knew my car wasn't "correct". But they encouraged me none the less. Not everyone can afford a "correct" car. It is an honorable goal though. "We" all know this isn't a correct car. "Those" that don't know-don't care. We need to lighten up and not take ourselves so seriously. New people like that.
Tom, I agree with you 100 percent. I was not going to add anymore to this thread because sometimes it just "feeds the fire" The only thing wrong with the auction was the "term" "1912" There really is no such thing as a "correct" speedster. They are what they are. They may be "period correct" or "as built in the day" or complete surviving original built by (insert name) in (insert date) or whatever term someone wants to use. But definitely not "correct" To me this is a nice entry level car. and should not be frowned on by anyone. It probably needs some things fixed, but most Ts need something . The car bashing always seems (to me, in my opinion) to come mostly from the early car guys. (not all just some) Come on guys lighten up. Not all of us can have a #220 or a Torpedo, or Couplet, ect... Whoever bought that car, I hope he has a lot of fun with it and maybe moves on to More Ts in his stable. I for one will not "bash" it submitted with respect ... Donnie Brown ..
Donny and Tom I agree with you my t is a put together car I tried to use the most correct parts I could afford at the time I built it. I could not afford to buy a complete correct car at the time but it was more fun building the car and learning how all the parts of the car work together. As time goes on I will replace some of the parts with more correct parts.
I've yet to own a T. But I'm learning. I know enough to know that I don't know anything. I do know that roadster in Hemmings with the "very rare" real wheel disc brakes is a fraud, and that the owner probably doesn't know it. I do like reading these criticisms, it's a very good way to learn.
One of these days soon, I hope to be the owner of a correct touring. And I intend to use it with my wife (she'll drive) to go camping. The more original the better.
I'm with Tom Rootlieb on this. Sure not all the parts are correct for a 1912 but neither is the fact it is a speedster. Ford never built speedsters, individuals did and it is a nice looking put-to-gether car that I sure wouldn't mind having in my collection. I would however redo that rear spring, that will screw up the rearend real fast if the car is driven very much.
I know mine is not correct but granddaughter sure loves it.
I am pretty sure it would cost more than $11,000 to replicate the car if you paid someone else to build it. That's what happened here.
The buyer has happily bought a car.
The seller has happily sold a car.
eBay made $60.
Everyone directly involved with the car is happy. I don't see a problem, it's a T that will now be enjoyed.
I couldn't agree more Tom. This post sure reminds me of my experience with one of my favorite T's.
I bought a 1915 model t roadster fifteen years ago, a very rough assemble 15 with a lot of later parts but it was affordable and a brass car. I got the car home and got it running, amazingly it ran quite well. I drove this car as is for around 4-5 years. during this time I had my fair share of negative opinions, some like a poster was a model t guy told me he had seen the car previously and proudly said he wouldn't give the seller a thousand dollars for it. Or the club members who call it the Johnny Cash T. More than a few times I questioned myself why they would even opened their mouths to put this little car down. If it wasn't for the fact it was just so much fun to drive, I would have given up long ago.
The day came when it was just to unsafe drive anymore. I tore it down and completely restored myself using parts I collected and (new Rootlieb fenders). I amazed myself finishing the car six months later. A picture of the car is on my profile.
My point, the same as Toms we don't often start out with cars or the Knowledge we end up with.
The guy with unauthentic car may surprise you.....or take your opinion to heart and make a street rod.
Too many grumpy old men with nothing better to do than criticise and put done others.
Encouragement and constructive criticism goes much further in keeping our hobby alive.
Not every car project is a business transaction where you have to turn a profit, for some folks it is what makes them happy in their own way...
Incorrect color - "put together" - some non-Ford parts...
What fun for everyone...(except maybe the correct police on the Forum).
Some wise person said something like you can't please everyone all the time!
Life is short (and getting shorter by the day) - may as well enjoy what we have