'26 roadster door straps

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: '26 roadster door straps
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Wednesday, November 18, 2015 - 08:15 pm:

Hi,
The upholstery kit from Cartouche came with door straps to keep the doors from opening too far. I can not see any indication that my car had them previously as there are no nail holes on the door or in the door jamb post where they would attach. It is an early '26 built in November of 1925. I know they would be useful but I'm trying to keep it as original as I can. Is mine a anomaly?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Pat Kelly Montana on Wednesday, November 18, 2015 - 08:28 pm:

My 26 roadster doesn't have a set up for door straps either. PK


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Wednesday, November 18, 2015 - 09:50 pm:

No part listed for a door check strap on the Improved '26-'27 open cars, but the closed cars had them.

If you add 'em on, its handy to keep the front door from banging on the cowl.

To fit, you can use wood screws with cupped washers on the wood trim strip on the door pillar, but use sheet metal screws into the metal door panel.




Closed car


Open car


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 07:58 am:

Thanks Dan for those images. The open car's picture shows access ports in the doors to (I assume) adjust the door's hinges. My '26 does not have those as the hinges are attached to the door by blind nuts. Consequently my doors do not fit snugly in the front with a quarter inch gap and I have no way to adjust the fit without enlarging the hinge holes.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 08:01 am:

I think I will not install the straps by just being careful not to open the doors as far as they can go..


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 09:15 am:

Will

That is probably good, to leave them off. Access for passengers is much better as the doors can swing wide.

As for you hinges, first try to use new hinge pins, that can help. Then you can try to carefully cold bend the hinges a bit (keep the pin in place as you do that) to get the doors to fit better flush to the body. You want the latches to work first, then the fit, but if you have some gap, that's OK, its a Ford :-)



The earlier doors for the '26 have smaller panel holes and no access to the hinge fasteners.


Early type door panel




Easy access to let the door swing wide without a check strap. The lightweight open doors didn't require a check strap like the heavy closed car doors.

But the earlier open cars before, like the '24-25 runabouts, had check straps, (p/n 5515X) likely because of the wood framing, easy to attach the strap, and likely because the cowl and side lamp position would cause interference.




Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 10:23 am:

Don, Thanks for the history of door straps. As you can see I have the earlier door which has no embossments and smaller holes. Also note the door gap which it not very noticeable once is was painted black.. Curiously, one of the hinges was marked Stanley. Maybe a replacement? I'll definitely get some new hinge pins.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By arnie johansen on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 10:35 am:

Will Brown, could you post a picture of the outside "Bun: area of your vehicle? I believe there may be a difference in how that panel ends. Also the panel behind the seat backrest is different on some vehicles. I believe the early cars did not had an embossing but perhaps later cars had an inverted U embossing in that panel. If yours is real early it will not have the motor number stamped in the frame.

Thanks,

Arnie


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 10:44 am:

No, no number on the frame. It also had plug where the top saddles went.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By arnie johansen on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 10:50 am:

Thanks, Will. You have what I expected in the "bun" panel area. Your panel ends with the rear fender covering the end. I believe later vehicles had a vertical embossed end in front of the rear fender.

I could not tell if the steel panel in back of the seat back rest has an embossed inverted "U".

Also perhaps the early turtle deck was fastened only by four bolts on the floor. Later ones had two bolts on each side of the vertical surface. How many bolts hold the turtle deck on your car>


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 10:50 am:

The area behind the seat was flat when roadsters were shipped with a pickup bed. (McCalley). Mine is embossed


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 10:57 am:

Arnie,
As you can see in my previous post, no bolt holes except at the top of the seat back where there are two holes that were crudely punched in at the time of assembly. The turtle was held on the body frame by four bolts on the sides and two on the back rail plus the two at the top of the seat frame.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By arnie johansen on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 11:02 am:

Will, I wrote to Bruce before he passed away and he was not sure about the flat panel for pick-ups and an embossed panel for roadsters. If you look in his CD which is an update for the book, he no longer made that statement. It makes sense for Ford not to stock two different panels for the same function.

On another note you are one of the few that do not have vertical mounting holes for the turtle deck. I have a vehicle without the holes also and a few other members have ones without vertical holes. For some time I was told Ford never sold a turtle deck that was not mounted with eight bolts, but now believe that the early ones only had four bolts and the later ones were mounted with eight bolts. But I have no proof of this, just observations of cars.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 11:05 am:

Here is a turtle that I saw at Hershey a while back with the late holes for mounting it to the seat back.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 11:18 am:

Turtle mounting holes on my '26


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By arnie johansen on Thursday, November 19, 2015 - 11:29 am:

Will:

If you car is like mine you will not have those holes shown as in the turtle deck you saw at Hershey. I think we have enough examples to say that Ford did not mount the turtle with the two vertical holes on each side for some cars. It would be my guess that the later ones included these additional mounting points.

If I remember correctly I also had some crude holes in the upper part of the seat backrest steel panel. I wrote them off as somebody trying to add something later because of the crude nature of the holes. I will need to check that when I get the roadster out of storage, now that you have some in yours also.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Menzies on Friday, November 20, 2015 - 02:05 am:

I have a 26 touring that I put kerosene side lights on (they are not correct for the car as it is electric) but I like them any way. I need the door check straps because the doors hit the lamps.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By arnie johansen on Friday, November 20, 2015 - 10:53 am:

Will:

You mentioned that there were "two holes that were crudely punched in at the time assembly". How do you know they were put in during assembly. Would it be possible for an owner to put them in because he/she felt the movement between the body and the turtle? Just asking as I seem to have crudely made holes in that area on mine also!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Will Brown on Friday, November 20, 2015 - 12:38 pm:

Arnie,
It's only a guess. But, since my T was part of the early ones, I can find places where the assembly was slip shod. I'm thinking that not all the kinks were not ironed out during those first few months.
For example, the bolts that hold the wood on which the kick panel is nailed to on the driver's side were never installed-the holes were never drilled into the wood. The passenger's side was installed correctly. The splash aprons were never screwed on to the body mounting blocks as they were supposed to have been.
The metal strap the went from the two sides of the turtle was crudely ripped off. The reason for that (I assume) was that they had trouble fitting the turtle and had to remove it in order to make it fit correctly. Perhaps at some point they felt that the turtle needed to be more securely attached to the back of the seat frame and since there were no holes stamped in either in the seat frame or the top of the turtle they had to do something during assembly. The crudely made holes fit in with that pattern.


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